ampfixer
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X1 latency issues
How do I minimize latency in X1? I'm getting back to soft synths for the first time post 8.5 and find that Rapture and Dim Pro are real laggy. True Piano and GR4 don't seem to have problems.
DCP reports a max latency of 170us but averages about 120-130us and my round trip latency with the UA25EX is about 12.6 ms @ ~600 samples. I read threads where people talk about latency values down to 64 samples. I don't see how this is possible with my equipment.
The system in general is pretty clean with no extra TSR apps running and my memory. hard disk and cables have all been tested.
It's strange to me that the latency is more apparent on certain soft synths.
Any advice greatly appreciated.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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brundlefly
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/23 17:27:33
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Audio latency will not vary from synth to synth. If Dim Pro and Rapture feel slow, it might be that the attack of the patch is slow. Dim Pro's piano should feel just as good as TruePianos. If your round-trip is 12.6ms, I'm guessing your buffer is about 256 samples. That's on the high side of ideal, but since your output latency is about half the round-trip, that's pretty tolerable for playing soft synths. A buffer of 128 samples will feel a little snappier, and your PC and interface should easily be able to handle that. When people talk about running at 64 samples, they mean the buffer size. The round-trip will be twice that, plus about a millisecond each way for A/D/A conversion, plus a few samples for the inherent latency in whatever bus the audio interface is using to connect to the DAW. So that one-way 64-sample buffer realistically becomes a round-trip of at least 2 x (64 + 44 + 2) = 210 = 4.8ms @ 44.1kHz. There are folks able to run a 32-sample buffer, but it takes really good interface drivers and a well-tuned DAW to do it reliably with any kind of project load running.
post edited by brundlefly - 2011/08/23 17:31:29
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ampfixer
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/23 19:32:41
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From the preferences I have these values for samples.
Buffers = 2
Size = 2.3ms 112 samples
ASIO Panel Shows
Input = 6.3ms @ 301 samples
Output = 6.3ms @ 304 samples
RTL = 12.6ms @605 samples
I tried to compare just piano between instruments and each one does seem to respond differently. I assumed it was the coding of the softsynth. GR4 pro is very snappy as is True Pianos Amber. Dim Pro and Rapture piano's are slow and slushy.
I want to get the latency as low as possible but I may be up against the limits of the UA25-EX. The newest drivers I can find are from 2009 and I think it's an orphaned product now that Roland has new interfaces to sell.
Thanks for looking.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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Lanceindastudio
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/23 20:11:26
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yup gotta get an interface that performs better at low latencies. if you have a pci slot available u can do so pretty cheap.
m audio 2496 or an echo pci product.
Asus P8Z77-V LE PLUS Motherboard i7 3770k CPU 32 gigs RAM Presonus AudioBox iTwo Windows 10 64 bit, SONAR PLATINUM 64 bit Lots of plugins and softsynths and one shot samples, loops Gauge ECM-87, MCA SP-1, Alesis AM51 Presonus Eureka Mackie HR824's and matching subwoofer
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/23 20:26:56
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Hi John,
FWIW, just to help you compare, I use an older desktop DAW with a fire wire connection at 64 samples with a pair of MOTU 896HDs.
My round trip is 178ms.
That seems about normal these days.
As I think was mentioned, many people are running 32 samples with the latest PCIe based systems.
If you can get your system running at 128 or 64 or 32 you'll find that the DAW experience changes radically... especially if you want to enjoy soft synths or native record input monitoring. It can be a lot of fun to get to use a DAW as a complete studio.
best regards,
mike
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StarTekh
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/24 16:24:55
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please post the latency test tool address.. thanks
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GlennKay
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/24 17:34:01
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ASUS P8P67 LE/i5-2500k/8GB DDR3-1600/1 SSD (system) & 3*SATA HHDs (recording, samples, backup)/ ATI HD 6450 Silent/Win 7 Ultimate x64/RME Multiface/ UAD2/3*Creamware DSP cards on a separate PC connected via ADAT "The path of excess leads also to the palace of wisdom," but they let you in through the back door.
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StarTekh
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/24 17:50:43
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StarTekh
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/24 18:22:39
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firewire 410:
From the preferences I have these values for samples.
Buffers = 2
Size = 2.9ms 128 samples
Input = 4.9ms @ 216 samples
Output = 4.9 @ 216 samples
RTL = 9.8ms @432 samples
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Karyn
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/24 19:16:41
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Can I point out that DPC latency has nothing what-so-ever to do with your audio interface latency...
... and also that audio interface latency has nothing to do with DimPro feeling "slow and slushy" if TruePianos feels "snappy".
To simplify latency, Sonar adds up all the buffers requested by plugins and syncronizes the outputs from all the tracks/busses to make allowance for the slowest plugs, (usually stuff like PerfectSpace that has large buffers).
If you have TruePianos on track 1 and a DimPro piano on track 2 their output will match each other.
If the DimPro piano feels "slushy" compaired the TruePianos then it is the patch, not latency.
Mekashi Futo. Get 10% off all Waves plugins.Current DAW. i7-950, Gigabyte EX58-UD5, 12Gb RAM, 1Tb SSD, 2x2Tb HDD, nVidia GTX 260, Antec 1000W psu, Win7 64bit, Studio 192, Digimax FS, KRK RP8G2, Sonar Platinum
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ampfixer
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/25 00:29:48
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Thanks for the info everyone, I appreciate your time.
Karyn made my day. (insert voice of Eric Cartman) My mom says I don't have a latency problem!! It's just a mushy patch!
So at the end of the day, I don't know if throwing money at this problem will actually make a difference. Until it becomes a bit clearer I'll use cans all the time and ASIO direct monitor. The UA25-EX and the A-Pro both show up as USB 1.1 devices but they are on USB 2.0 ports.
Good tech support response from Roland Canada via their email Q&A system. A fast response and an indication that both my hardware items were still current, but no updated drivers available since the initial release.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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Karyn
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/25 06:12:03
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ampfixer
(insert voice of Eric Cartman) My mom says I don't have a latency problem!! It's just a mushy patch!
PWF! *  * Patch Wettingly Funny
Mekashi Futo. Get 10% off all Waves plugins.Current DAW. i7-950, Gigabyte EX58-UD5, 12Gb RAM, 1Tb SSD, 2x2Tb HDD, nVidia GTX 260, Antec 1000W psu, Win7 64bit, Studio 192, Digimax FS, KRK RP8G2, Sonar Platinum
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ampfixer
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Re:X1 latency issues
2011/08/25 15:57:19
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Karyn! You're looking much better girl! Thanks for the help.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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