Register with ASCAP?

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jhughs
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2011/09/05 20:02:31 (permalink)

Register with ASCAP?

If I start down the path of actually registering songs with ASCAP, then do I need to become my own publisher as well? And if I become my own publisher, what does that really mean? (I post on Soundclick therefore I'm a publisher?????)

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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Register with ASCAP? 2011/09/06 09:31:47 (permalink)
    You would need to register with ASCAP or BMI (the 2 big PRO's in the USA) if and when you have songs that are being used in a commercial setting.... on the radio, TV or whatever. 

    Until you have songs in that (money making) position, it's really not necessary to join and register with a PRO. 

    BUT... you can always join a PRO for free as a songwriter. If the songs are NOT signed to a publisher, you simply register the song and claim 200% of the royalties.  

    I joined BMI probably 15 years ago as a writer, because at the time they seemed to be handling a lot of the country writers, but when you go to Nashville, you will see BMI, ASCAP and SESAC all have a presence on 16th avenue. 

    There are publisher royalties and songwriter royalties for each song. If there is no publisher, the song is deemed to be self-published and you get to keep 100% of both or 200% of the proceeds. There is no need to set up a publishing company to collect the self publishing royalties, it's done automatically. 

    Now... taking it a step further. Many publishers and library catalog managers prefer that you do not copyright or register with your PRO. They would prefer to do that for you. It complicates their job when they have to refer the new registration back to an existing registration number for the song that you registered. All you really should do when you get to this point is to join the PRO and get the membership and registration numbers so you can give that number to the publisher or library so the royalties will go to the right account....your's!

    This is how I do it.... I have a BMI songwriter account. When I write a song, I simply do a "proof of creation registration" with Songuard. I then submit the songs and if they get signed, they are free & clear of past registrations for PRO & Copyright.  You gotta deal with reputable pubs & libraries but it is generally not a big deal. When I sign my first songs with a new company, I give them my W9 info and my BMI number and they handle the details. 

    As far as which PRO is better... They're both about the same.... they calculate the money in similar fashion, and most publishers have TWO publishing firms...one for ASCAP and the other for BMI, and a song can only be registered with one of them. 

    But, lets say you are ASCAP and your writing partner is BMI and the song gets a BMI registration. You get added to the songwriter info IN the BMI account upon registration along with your ASCAP number..... you get paid. The opposite is also true. So communication is essential so the song gets one, correct registration....another reason to let the publisher handle it. 

    post edited by Guitarhacker - 2011/09/06 09:34:07

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

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    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
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    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Register with ASCAP? 2011/09/06 09:49:23 (permalink)
    It seems to me that in reality royalties are paid to the registered owner(s) of the song.

    If it's a mechanical license for a cover song on a record the fee is set by law.

    If it's a synchronization license the fee is negotiated case by case.

    If it's a performance fee... well those fees and dispersal are a big mystery to almost everyone... but they are based on audience size etc.

    Let's call any monies gathered from those sources of revenue 100%.

    Out of that 100% the songwriter and any publishing partners split up the money any way they may have arranged.

    Simple.... yet very complicated.



    To answer the OP's question... no you do not need a publisher. A publisher is someone whom other people in the industry might perceive as easy to contact.

    Herb's advice is good... if you intend to seek out a publisher... then let them be the ones to publish your song without putting them in the position of having to refer to some other documents.

    The hardest thing to do in music publishing is to make all the paper work worth while. If a song doesn't have big numbers than the cost of retrieving a modest payment exceeds the maintenance costs of the paperwork. You gotta think big or it's probably better to just stay relaxed.


    best regards,
    mike



    edit spelling

    post edited by mike_mccue - 2011/09/06 15:20:42


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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Register with ASCAP? 2011/09/06 15:02:00 (permalink)
    You get royalties from 2 primary sources...

    1. PUBLISHER: record/CD/download sales.. generally based on current statutory rates per sale. This is a result of the publisher placing the song with an artist or in a film or TV show and also includes the licensing fees and comes from the publisher as a quarterly check and statement. 

    2. PRO: Public performance. The main avenues here are radio and TV play. On radio, it's based on number of plays, overall length of the song and the market size of the station. On TV most of that counts but the length is the actual air time of the music, which could be anything from the full song, such as at the end of a TV show like House or a few seconds as source in a scene. This comes from the PRO directly to you and to the publisher for airplay/preformance.... PRO=Performance Rights Organization.  This revenue source can easily exceed the sales revenue on a good song that climbs the charts or is a TV theme song and the show goes into syndication and re-runs. 

    other sources include live/pre-recorded performance in concerts and bars, and restaurants. All these venues pay one of the PRO's according to the source (jukebox, cover band, radio ) and according to the songs on the set list/jukebox, etc.... the venue might pay a large sum but revenue that makes it to your pocket from these sources may only be a few cents when it's said and done. 

    The PRO collects the performance royalties and the publisher generally manages the sales royalties. Hopefully you have a 50/50 split after expenses.... but the contract may vary considerably from that "normal and customary" split.  If the publisher is aggressive on getting cuts and does it successfully I would have no problem giving them a larger percentage. 
    post edited by Guitarhacker - 2011/09/06 15:04:59

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

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    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
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    jhughs
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    Re:Register with ASCAP? 2011/09/06 20:48:11 (permalink)
    Thanks guys. That helps. "Simple... yet complicated" was pretty much what I was thinking when I wrote the post. (Of course, as I often say, everything is easy when you don't know what you're doing.)

    ASUS P5ND/Intel E8500, Line6 Toneport UX2/PODFarm, Sonar, Axiom 25, Blue Bluebird, Audio-Technica AT3035s, Blue Snowflake, Line6 Spider IV 150 & AMPLIFI, Crate 1

    J Hughs Soundclick
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