Still Stumbling with V-Vocal

[Caveat: I have no inside knowledge of how V-Vocal works internally. What follows is based on experiments and observations, with blank spots filled in based on how I would have designed the software to work. I cannot guarantee the veracity of any of it.]

During the detection phase, V-Vocal separates the clip data into 50ms segments and determines the fundamental pitch for each one. Since nobody wants to edit 50ms chunks of data, V-V gathers sequences of similar segments into larger chunks and indicates these with horizontal guide lines. Moving the guide line shifts all of its constituent segments at once.

Most of the time, the guide line region encompasses a single vowel, word or phrase - something that was sung at a more-or-less constant pitch and therefore consists of a series of similar 50ms pitch values. Each guide line represents a logical unit for editing, its vertical position indicating the mean pitch value for that group of segments.

V-V must decide where this macro-segment begins and ends by comparing the pitch deviation from one micro-segment to the next. Where it gets confused is when there are micro-segments that deviate greatly from the mean. As in any application of statistical analysis, a small number of anomalies must be ignored in order to not skew interpretation of the overall trend.

Where V-V is most challenged is when trying to distinguish between statistical anomalies and the start of a new pitch segment. If you have a large enough number of deviant segments to suggest that they do not belong in the larger macro-segment, but not enough to establish a new statistical mean, V-V displays those in-between groups with green dots. They are mini regions that may or may not represent a logical grouping for editing. They are not part of any macro-region, which is why they move independently of any white guide line. However, you still edit them the same way. Just be aware that they are oddball sections that have to be judged entirely by ear.

Whispers, shouts, groans, moans and breathy vocal bits have to be tossed out altogether, as it may be impossible to find a fundamental pitch in them. Those are the sections that have no guide lines at all. Never attempt to edit them with V-Vocal! If you have a lot of these, or a lot of green-dot sections, it may be an indication that your vocal track is too noisy. The most common causes that I've identified are headphone bleed, poor mic technique and preamp/mic hiss. The latter, if chronic, may be an indication of a poor mic-preamp match.

As to why you cannot get the vibrato tool to work, I haven't a clue. I use it all the time, much more often even than pitch correction.

Set your formant control to zero for normal pitch correction. Only use nonzero values when you're using V-V creatively, such as generating harmonies or simulating chipmunks or evil voices.

Hello again, Konradh - Sorry you're still having VV problems.  It can be a bear of a plug-in to wrestle to the ground, so I sympathize. 


The short notes that you can't grab with a line - yes, that's the way it is.  But those green dots can be thought of as extremely short lines - move those, and they Do change the pitch.  


But syllables and words that short, Nobody can tell the pitch of.  What you need to focus on are the sustained vowels where pitch problems can be detected by most everyone, if there really are any.  And I know you don't want to believe this, but a held note which isn't exactly Right On The Money is usually preferable to one which has been moved so that it is Absolutely Right On. 


 Be that as it may, "...In videos, I see people grab the LFO tool (the wavy line) to increase or decrease the pitch variation around a note. By pulling it all the way down, they can make the note into a straight line. I have tried this 20 times and cannot get anything to happen. What am I missing?..."  I remember I gave you the advice to use the vibrato control so you could flat line a note, then see exactly where you're moving a phrase.  And then I said after moving it to the note, you need to then re-apply the vibrato to at least some degree if not to the full amount in the original recording.  


Click that vibrato control, move to a line - when the vibrato control is engaged you'll see a visual, hard to describe, which indicates you have engaged the line.  While holding the left click down on your mouse, move up - you'll see the natural sine wave vibrato line get smaller until it's flat.  That's useful for taming an overly wide vibrato, or for trying to zero in more accurately on a note, which is what I understand you're interested in.


RB

good call on the green dots-  tedious but yes they do stuff when you tweak them. I have had many moments when I had to go there.


Lance

rbowser


Hello again, Konradh - Sorry you're still having VV problems.  It can be a bear of a plug-in to wrestle to the ground, so I sympathize. 


The short notes that you can't grab with a line - yes, that's the way it is.  But those green dots can be thought of as extremely short lines - move those, and they Do change the pitch.  


But syllables and words that short, Nobody can tell the pitch of.  What you need to focus on are the sustained vowels where pitch problems can be detected by most everyone, if there really are any.  And I know you don't want to believe this, but a held note which isn't exactly Right On The Money is usually preferable to one which has been moved so that it is Absolutely Right On. 


Be that as it may, "...In videos, I see people grab the LFO tool (the wavy line) to increase or decrease the pitch variation around a note. By pulling it all the way down, they can make the note into a straight line. I have tried this 20 times and cannot get anything to happen. What am I missing?..."  I remember I gave you the advice to use the vibrato control so you could flat line a note, then see exactly where you're moving a phrase.  And then I said after moving it to the note, you need to then re-apply the vibrato to at least some degree if not to the full amount in the original recording.  


Click that vibrato control, move to a line - when the vibrato control is engaged you'll see a visual, hard to describe, which indicates you have engaged the line.  While holding the left click down on your mouse, move up - you'll see the natural sine wave vibrato line get smaller until it's flat.  That's useful for taming an overly wide vibrato, or for trying to zero in more accurately on a note, which is what I understand you're interested in.


RB