does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords?

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offnote
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2011/12/12 10:09:19 (permalink)

does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords?

I mean technique that doesn't use classical music rules like scales, chords etc just coloring ad-hoc with notes and patterns.
I found playing with classical rules limiting and tiresome becasue you always have to know where are you, plus all those circle of fifths can limit your potential choices. Besides playing music I paint also and I like apply same ideas for tunes and for painting. 
I understand though this technique requires of course great ears. 


p.s.
after all there are no real chords or scales, we have just notes right? 
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    Rus W
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/12 19:59:14 (permalink)
    offnote


    I mean technique that doesn't use classical music rules like scales, chords etc just coloring ad-hoc with notes and patterns.
    I found playing with classical rules limiting and tiresome becasue you always have to know where are you, plus all those circle of fifths can limit your potential choices. Besides playing music I paint also and I like apply same ideas for tunes and for painting. 
    I understand though this technique requires of course great ears. 


    p.s.
    after all there are no real chords or scales, we have just notes right? 

    Be warned it is not wise to get "philosophical" with said user! (You are in for it now!)


    Seriously, no I don't do that though I have seen such graphical music programs, but may I ask you and I don't mean this snobbily, but what exactly is PRV or the GUI when it comes to writing enevlopes, controllers or both as these things affect the notes as well?


    What exactly is Tabulature? (I know what it is, just making a point)


    if you really wanna get deep, why do people say "The sky's the limit,: but in the same breath say: "Know your/its limitations"? This is because everything and everybody has limitations. You of course refer to these as rules in classical music notation; however, theory and practice are two totally different idioms or scale degrees (pun intended)


    And for your PS: I realize music and math go together, but "imaginary notes" (numbers), really? Let's not forget limits!


    Definitely, in all seriousness, techniques vary from person to person. Some paint/color in a striaght motion. Others do so in a circular motion. I used to do the former until I watched a painter on a DIY show say that it's better to utilize the latter technique to avoid going outside the boundaries. I definitely can relate being a perfectionist although in other areas, but especially writing music.


    There no one way to write music, but in practice it does have its limits. I do find it odd how in theory courses, you're taught more along the lines of practice; however, the inverse wouldn't surprise me either. Music Practice 101, but discussing theoretical ways around practical limits! 

    Even if I did, I'd still think in terms of chords and scales given that was how I was taught.

    I'd like to hear what you've done using a unconventional technique! (It's not bad, but may be unusual for most. This includes myself)


    post edited by Rus W - 2011/12/13 09:22:14

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    #2
    Tap
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/13 09:00:51 (permalink)
    I found that when I was teaching the art of improvising and composing to newer students that I used the artist as a model for creativity. I related the scale degrees to colors on a pallet that an artist used. The choice and use of these colors ( notes and modalities) along with how the notes were played  ( vibrato, glissando, soft and hard attacks ) were the basis for understanding how jazz musicians tend to approach improvising and is the basis on which many individuals develop their styles.

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    Rus W
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/13 10:12:16 (permalink)
    ^ And they probably had no issues grasping it. I must lament though. I thought by your OP that you meant this is a technique you use on your own as well. Do you and what's the % swing on using both?

    I frequently heard the standard notation vs. TAB argument for guitar players, so that is why I asked. As I said, for me, classical notation was how I was taught and taught myself to play by ear. And I can only speak for myself, but PBE is how I grasped being a composer sice I hear tunes - moreso, arrangements of them in my head.

    And note that said techniques work in other genre, too - especially improvisation. It's just more prominent (studied and talk abot in jazz - moreso, than say Western music (ie: Pop)

    Of course, my spiel is more along the lines of interpretation!

    Funny story - regarding my confusion of the two. (This is way before I started watch Who's Line lol)

    I thought they were the same thing having asked:

    "Is improv where you play a song a different way?" I was told no, but again, I didn't know what improv was. However, the misnomer that improv can't/doesn't happen in other genres just. Much like how "fancy chords" are only suited for jazz/latin music. 

    I haven't heard that said out loud, but I wouldn't be surprised knowing about leadsheets which can also be used in other genres.

    Blossoms has a host of 7b9s, 7b9b11s, 7#5#9s, but it's a pop tune! Then again, I arranged it and using such chord names is obviously my intention as I have a very good idea and feel for how the song progresses! (V-V cadence, although diminished(iv-ii) with appropriate roots is fine, the former is the stronger one for me despite both being the "same" when heard)

    I went somewhat OT, but again, though I may or may not try it, I do see how your technique works.

    iBM (Color of Music) MCS (Digital Orchestration)  


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    #4
    Guitarhacker
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/13 10:48:48 (permalink)
     I was raised on the scales (of which there are many) so I tend to think in that way. 

    I do also refer to the color of chords in a structured sort of way.  In a progression I know that I can use the A minor chord..... but I also know I can easily add some variety and color by substituting the Am7 or Am6 or a plethora of other colorful chord choices. Regardless of my choice, in the ear of the listener, it needs to make sense and fit into the structure of the song for it to work in the musical sense. 

    To "color ad-hoc" in a musical sense, sounds to me like total chaos. I might not understand what you meant by that statement, but to throw chords and notes in a totally random "ad-hoc" manner, produces a sound that most people find to be not very enjoyable.

    Most humans, listeners to music, prefer patterns and structure that is familiar to them to have enjoyment in listening to a piece of music. Even the jazz musicians who play some pretty far out stuff are following some sort of structure. 

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    #5
    AT
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/13 10:48:54 (permalink)
    www.virtuosomethod.com

    Is this what you are looking for?

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    derFunkenstein
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/13 11:03:35 (permalink)
    The link, she is broken.  The first one goes to a page that's not real:

    http://forum.cakewalk.com/www.virtuosomethod.com

    If I make it just www.virtuosomethod.com I get a 404 error that way, too.  

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    Rus W
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/13 12:30:15 (permalink)
    +1 to GH for mentioning color. Though it's the same song, (Blossoms) has a different vibe - it's somewhat darker in tone and the progressions - moreso, how the chords are spelled, but indicates this along with the rhythm section (instruments) that accompanies it. Of course, the part (Bridge) I've added really emphasizes how much darker it is. Then again, the whole song is darker.

    I was just thinking of this and remember being taught about how the quality of chords sound.

    Major, minor, diminished, augmented - your basic triads! Triads 1 and 4 are pretty + bright while 2 and 3 are somber + dark. The fact remains even if you inverted them. If they are played by themselves, of course.

    Yet, you run into a tug-o-war with 7ths and upwards!

    Bb-D-F-A sounds wonderful, but its inversions "don't" as the root sits on top of the seventh on all three occasions. Turning a once bright chord into a darker one. For me, I like the 4/3 version though I use the 4/2 one as well. IOW, the only times when 7ths and upwards are at the brightest is when they are in root position. (Whether or not they are open or close)

    Again, it doesn't seem like much alone, but play or hear the progressions in context and you won't escape the intended timbre. So, yeah, timbre makes a world of difference!

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    #8
    AT
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/13 13:55:50 (permalink)
    The virtuosomethod site seems to be dead.  I haven't looked at it in a while - a year or two.  Must have died an ugly death.  The guy's name was Mark Sandborn and he had a color method of learning music.  That is the only link I had, sorry.  It looked interesting and I wrote an article that never got picked up on it.

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    montezuma
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/14 08:13:14 (permalink)
    "It's all downhill from here..."
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    StevenMikel
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/16 00:57:49 (permalink)
     Colors and patterns are great for learning and teaching musical instruments.I used patterns to teach myself the fretboard of the guitar then,I used color to help me connect the patterns.I drew a picture of a 24 fret fretboard then drew the pattern of a scale then,colored the root red then,drew a red dot everywhere on the fretboard that root acured.Then I drew the scale pattern starting on every red dot.Several years later I used a similar method to teach a friend.
     
      I started learning guitar in the early 80's when knowing alot of scales was important so,I tend to think of music in terms of scales.I learned alot of the scales I know from a jazz guitar book that also taught jazz chords so,I learned some jazz chords(mostly the ones used in blues).I do associate certian moods,scales and chords with certian colors(black,blue,brown= sad,heartbroken,black and red=angry).When I write/compose music I don't realy think about what I'm playing,I play what I feel.
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    Ignitetheairwaves
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/21 21:28:28 (permalink)
    Here is what I see in my mind's eye:

    Cmaj - Red
    Dmaj - Green
    Emaj - Blue
    Gmaj - Purple
    Amaj - Yellow

    I see color only for those 5 chords, always have as far back as I can remember. And for the minors of those 5 I see dark red, dark green, dark blue, dark purple, and dark yellow, respectively.

    It helps a lot with memorization for me and makes music into a visual art inside my head when I'm playing.


    I have also heard that people use the colors of the chakras as well:

    C - Red
    D - Orange
    E - Yellow
    F - Green
    G - Blue
    A - Indigo
    B - Purple

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    offnote
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/29 13:32:06 (permalink)
    The colors are completely personal experience and they may be shifted one way or another.
    Anyway playing with colors and patterns freed me from western music rules. When I start playing it's like starting painting, I am limited only by size of my canvas and spectrum of sounds.

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    LpMike75
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/30 02:12:25 (permalink)
    Offnote - I would be curious to hear some of your music you speak of.


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    #14
    offnote
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    Re:does anybody here use patterns and colors for playing instead of scales and chords? 2011/12/30 11:06:34 (permalink)
    LpMike75


    Offnote - I would be curious to hear some of your music you speak of.

    me too.
    #15
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