The bass and laptop speakers

Hard to say exactly without hearing it.... but my guess would be...... starting with good gear and proper playing technique in the studio...and maybe new strings. 

Was it Tal Wilkenfelf perhaps?

You will read lots of advice on getting bass clarity by careful balancing with the kick drum, but none of that applies when you're talking about laptop speakers and iPod earbuds. Some playback systems are simply incapable of reproducing the frequencies wherein most of the energy lies.

An open E on a bass guitar has a fundamental frequency of 41.2 Hz. Even if you play every song in Am, that only brings you up to 55 Hz. Laptop speakers might have a lower limit of 100Hz or worse. Obviously, something's going to be missing in playback. 
 
Fortunately, there is a psychoacoustic effect that can exploited, in which the listener's brain actually synthesizes the missing fundamental even if all you actually hear are the harmonics. Of course, you have to make sure those harmonics are clearly audible, and they may or may not be, depending on the playing style (picked versus fingered, for example) and whether the bass was recorded from an amp or a direct box.

Distortion and EQ can be used to emphasize harmonics. I find that on a busy mix, a melodic bass part can cut through more clearly with an EQ boost between 800 and 1.2Khz. Sometimes, it's a lower frequency that needs the boost, around 300-400Hz. A harmonic exciter further helps by assuring that there's something happening in those ranges in the first place.

Another thing to keep in mind is....what does this supposedly great bass sound, sound like on real monitors? If I hear something on my lappy that is leaping out at me with bass, just about all the time when I listen to it on good studio monitors, it will be too much bass. So I'd be interested in hearing a clip of this if you have one around. Most laptops don't really put out much bass at all. But if I heard it...I'd actually be more concerened than happy...but that's just me. :)

-Danny

Rbh you did mean Tal Wilkenfeld didn't you! She is one serious bass player. I did meet her at the Melbournme Jazz festival with Chick Corea. I only go to meet her because I know Frank Gambale and he was in that band too.

Another great female bass player with a great sound is Linda Oh. But her sound is created entirely in her technique. She sounds exactly the same live as recorded. Anyway not sure who the OP was talikng about. Maybe they could enlighten us.

We need to leave laptop speakers completely out of the reference speaker situation. They are just so bad they are not even worth a mention IMO. It is just plain wrong to even consider how something sounds on a laptop. I know people listen to things on them for sure but I think as long as you get the other reference speakers sounding OK you just need to take what you get on a laptop. They are NO indicator.

bitflipper


You will read lots of advice on getting bass clarity by careful balancing with the kick drum, but none of that applies when you're talking about laptop speakers and iPod earbuds. Some playback systems are simply incapable of reproducing the frequencies wherein most of the energy lies.

An open E on a bass guitar has a fundamental frequency of 41.2 Hz. Even if you play every song in Am, that only brings you up to 55 Hz. Laptop speakers might have a lower limit of 100Hz or worse. Obviously, something's going to be missing in playback. 

Fortunately, there is a psychoacoustic effect that can exploited, in which the listener's brain actually synthesizes the missing fundamental even if all you actually hear are the harmonics. Of course, you have to make sure those harmonics are clearly audible, and they may or may not be, depending on the playing style (picked versus fingered, for example) and whether the bass was recorded from an amp or a direct box.

Distortion and EQ can be used to emphasize harmonics. I find that on a busy mix, a melodic bass part can cut through more clearly with an EQ boost between 800 and 1.2Khz. Sometimes, it's a lower frequency that needs the boost, around 300-400Hz. A harmonic exciter further helps by assuring that there's something happening in those ranges in the first place.

Bit, you should be writing books! But then again, I guess it's even better - you're sharing all that stuff for free w/ us on these boards. 


I think that most of what I've been trying to say in my own clumsy way earlier was that you could create the illusion by placing a few "hints" in the higher frequencies and let the listener brain do the rest of the work. 

I think that most of what I've been trying to say in my own clumsy way earlier was that you could create the illusion by placing a few "hints" in the higher frequencies and let the listener brain do the rest of the work. 

And you said in one sentence what it took me four paragraphs to say.

Hi timidi  I am saddened to think that 80% of music is being listened to on laptops. I find that surprising. Isn't it a shame in that even one of those cheap Logitec systems with a sub and a couple of satellites will sound a lot better than a laptop. Or nice headphones instead.

Maybe it could be included in the list of speakers one may to want to audition a mix on. I think the mistake could be to change something based on your laptop perceptions only to find that it does not satisfy the other speakers very well. I would tend to go for something sounding good on 3 or 4 speaker systems and take what you get on the laptop.

It is the hi fi in me. It is easy to connect up even the smallest of active speakers to an IPod or laptop and enjoy a massive improvement in reproduction.

I don't know if people are actually listening to music using laptop speakers - I mean really listening. Some maybe. Like my old man who could listen to AM radio on a tiny plastic receiver w/ a 4 inches speaker. It was circumstantial however. He also had a proper (if not HiFi) record player. But most of the time, the radio was just there to keep him company I guess. 

The thing w/ music is that it's everywhere, and we've learned to hear it in all kinds of way, from the crappiest source to the best possible. Given the opportunity, most would probably pick the best possible quality, however, not many people will just sit there, close their eyes and actively listen to music. It's something that they do while doing something else - riding the bus, washing the dishes, etc.

I don't think it's anything new. As far as I remember, we've always tried to take music w/ us. I remember as a kid placing speakers in the windows to listen to music outside w/ friends. And it was obviously okay if the sound quality wasn't good. But of course, sometimes, I'd want to listen to it in a proper setting, in the best possible quality.

Maybe it was on another magnitude, but overall the feeling was: in most circumstances, better crappy sound quality than no music at all. And come to think of it - if it was really a matter of sound quality, who here would ever attend a rock concert? (That's one thing that actually bothers me w/ live shows - one of the last ones I've was Them Crooked Vultures, and I could hardly hear anything past the 3rd or 4th song, so loud it was.)

As for laptop speakers... I've noticed that whenever my wife is in the room browsing for new stuff on iTunes or previewing whatever on her laptop - which is exactly the same as mine - it's like nails on a chalkboard. If she hooks up proper speakers, it could be 3 times as loud, it won't bother me. However, when I am checking out stuff, it's as if I'm expecting it - same crappy quality, but I don't mind. I'm in preview mode.

Which I think goes back to saying that we listen differently and expect differently, because, unlike a movie in front of which you have to sit to watch and hear if you want to follow the story, music can be enjoyed in a much more non-linear fashion, in different kind of contexts.

Lastly - I too sometimes do quick check up of my own mixes on my laptop speakers, to see how they compare to others. Pretty much like a painter will instinctively take a few steps back and squint to actually "mask" some details.