vlab
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Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
Hi everyone,
I installed X1d with great expecations ! thanks to CW for the colossal update!
I was so excited to see 64bit rewire compatibilty, so I could rewire my stuff back ... live... FL ...
however, it does not seem to work, in my synth rack, the INSERT REWIRE devices is still greyed out,
and not much explanation on CW's docs about it ..(except that it does support rewire now..)
I was wondering if the new rewire 64 is a version of rewire that only works with 64bit rewire, (which I don't have any instrument for),
or if X1d really was intenteded to bring support back for all rewire instruments (including 32bit ones)
Thansk for any help !
V
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e.Blue
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 15:20:19
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I think someone from CW mentioned a while back that 64-bit Rewire would only work with 64-bit Rewire devices. Right now the only two that I am aware of are Reason 6 and Melodyne 2.
-e.B
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 15:27:55
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vlab
Hi everyone,
I installed X1d with great expecations ! thanks to CW for the colossal update!
I was so excited to see 64bit rewire compatibilty, so I could rewire my stuff back ... live... FL ...
however, it does not seem to work, in my synth rack, the INSERT REWIRE devices is still greyed out,
and not much explanation on CW's docs about it ..(except that it does support rewire now..)
I was wondering if the new rewire 64 is a version of rewire that only works with 64bit rewire, (which I don't have any instrument for),
or if X1d really was intenteded to bring support back for all rewire instruments (including 32bit ones)
Thansk for any help !
V
Hi vlab, If your Rewire device is 32-bit, you will still need to use the 32-bit version of SONAR. The Rewire SDK Propellerheads released allowed us to implement support for 64-bit Rewire devices in 64-bit SONAR, but there is no Rewire "bridge" per se, to use a 32-bit Rewire device in a 64-bit host. I hope that helps clear things up!
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Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 15:29:54
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This paragraph from the Rewire SDK documentation from Propellerheads should clarify it better:
2.6 About 32-bit and 64-bit processes
ReWire has support for both 32-bit and 64-bit applications. It is not possible, however, to mix the two environments. A 32-bit application and a 64-bit application can’t communicate using ReWire in any way. A 32-bit ReWire mixer application can only see and load 32-bit ReWire devices and a 32-bit ReWire panel application can only communicate with 32-bit ReWire devices and mixers, using ReWire’s Panel/Device communication functions. The same is true for 64-bit mixer, devices and panel applications. This makes it important to control in which mode you start the different applications.
On Windows the user typically chooses 32- or 64-bit on install and the applications end up in different locations, hence it is easy to control in which mode you start the application.
On Mac on the other hand, applications could ship as universal binaries, which contain both 32- and 64-bit code. By default MacOS X loads the 64-bit version if possible. The user can, however, force to load an application in 32-bit mode by checking the “Open in 32-bit mode” flag in the “Get Info” window in Finder.
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c5_convertible
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 15:33:23
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vlab
I was so excited to see 64bit rewire compatibilty, so I could rewire my stuff back ... live... FL ...
however, it does not seem to work, in my synth rack, the INSERT REWIRE devices is still greyed out,
and not much explanation on CW's docs about it ..(except that it does support rewire now..)
For FL... You could of course use the VST version of FL. It's not the same, I know, but it might help you a bit...
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 15:36:57
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c5_convertible
vlab
I was so excited to see 64bit rewire compatibilty, so I could rewire my stuff back ... live... FL ...
however, it does not seem to work, in my synth rack, the INSERT REWIRE devices is still greyed out,
and not much explanation on CW's docs about it ..(except that it does support rewire now..)
For FL... You could of course use the VST version of FL. It's not the same, I know, but it might help you a bit...
This is a great suggestion and is what I would do if I were using FL with SONAR. The main reason I would do this is that when used as a VSTi, the actual FL session is saves inside the SONAR session. IOW, you only need to save the SONAR session whereas with using ReWire you need to save the SONAR session plus the session of the ReWired DAW. Not a huge deal, but it keeps things simpler using VSTi, IMHO. SP
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LANEY
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 15:41:35
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I used rewire this morning with Reason and it worked! Thank you Cake for putting this out so I can use reason right in Sonar. Thank You!
i7/16GB ram Win 7 x64 SONAR Platinum Producer x64 VS-700 C&R Octa-Capture and VS-100 for live recording
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vlab
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 15:54:28
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Hi everyone !
lol, looks like all cakewalk staff has gathered around here !
Thanks guys for such detailed response !
to Seth: actually I wished for the 32bit rewire to work, to help me out sorting a timing problem with FL as VSTI ... and ... I took a chance in testing X1d and FL as VSTi ... and ... it still does not work ...;(
There is terrible timing jitter, and FL is always offet by +- 550 samples. and it's latency is not compensated correctly, so it makes it unreliable. (this issues does not happen in other DAW I tested so far (cubase6+reaper).
I might just open a new thread, and report a bug to cakewalk, instead of hijacking my own ... lol !
V
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 15:57:37
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vlab
Hi everyone !
lol, looks like all cakewalk staff has gathered around here !
Thanks guys for such detailed response !
to Seth: actually I wished for the 32bit rewire to work, to help me out sorting a timing problem with FL as VSTI ... and ... I took a chance in testing X1d and FL as VSTi ... and ... it still does not work ...;(
There is terrible timing jitter, and FL is always offet by +- 550 samples. and it's latency is not compensated correctly, so it makes it unreliable. (this issues does not happen in other DAW I tested so far (cubase6+reaper).
I might just open a new thread, and report a bug to cakewalk, instead of hijacking my own ... lol !
V
Ahh, I wasn't aware of any timing or offset issues with using FL as a VSTi. Then again, I haven't used it with SONAR like that since way back in the 32-bit days, so maybe there's an issue. Def report it so that if it turns out to be an issue with SONAR then we can address it. Its also worth getting in touch with Image Line and requesting an x64 version of FL as that would then work with x64 ReWire and might (or might not) cure the VSTi issues you're experiencing. Thanks, SP
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Brando
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 16:09:55
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just a friendly reminder that this - ( rewire VST) http://www.energy-xt.com/index.php?id=0115 works great for me - cheap and there is a demo. Now I'll bow out so everyone who feels they should not have to buy a 3rd party app to get this to work can come in and say their piece... er....peace.
Brando
Cakewalk, Studio One Pro, Reaper Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL ASUS Prime Z370-A LGA1151, 32GB DDR4, Intel 8700K i7, 500 GB SSD, 3 x 1TB HDD, Windows 10 Pro 64
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Jonbouy
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 16:55:29
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There's little point in running the 64 bit version of Sonar if you are connected to a 32 bit slave anyway. Both 32 and 64 bit versions should work OK alongside each other without problems so why not keep it native 32 bit Sonar<> 32 bit Slave and now you can 64 bit Sonar<> 64 bit Slave and you'd should be golden. No bridging required.
Now can somebody tell me if you take a Stereo input selection from the drop downs (above Main outs 1+2) is it actually outputting a true stereo signal to a stereo track finally? Listen carefully because it's always allowed the selection of a Stereo pair but it's never actually been Stereo. I'm wondering if it's now working OK or even if the useless but misleading stereo selections have been removed it will be an advance.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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DigitalArchivist
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 18:10:35
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Yes, thank you Cakewalk Bakers for ReWire 64-bit! Regarding mixing 32-bit and 64-bit ReWire clients, it actually can be accomplished through Reaper 64-bit. I have ACID Pro 7 and FL Studio 10, both 32-bit DAWS, and Reaper 64-bit, the only version I have installed, running as the master/host is able to see and interact with them. I just checked that again to make sure I wasn't dreaming. I was kind of astonished by that myself because I was led to believe that simply wasn't possible.
It's interesting to me that most DAWS, unlike Reaper, appear to have implemented only half of the ReWire technology. I have some other 64-bit DAWS that support ReWire, but only as a master/host, so SONAR does not see them as a ReWire client/slave, nor can they see SONAR. The only DAWS with ReWire that SONAR is seeing are Reaper and Reason (64-bit). Reaper does not see SONAR as a ReWire application.
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Jonbouy
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 18:33:38
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DigitalArchivist
Yes, thank you Cakewalk Bakers for ReWire 64-bit! Regarding mixing 32-bit and 64-bit ReWire clients, it actually can be accomplished through Reaper 64-bit. I have ACID Pro 7 and FL Studio 10, both 32-bit DAWS, and Reaper 64-bit, the only version I have installed, running as the master/host is able to see and interact with them. I just checked that again to make sure I wasn't dreaming. I was kind of astonished by that myself because I was led to believe that simply wasn't possible.
It's interesting to me that most DAWS, unlike Reaper, appear to have implemented only half of the ReWire technology. I have some other 64-bit DAWS that support ReWire, but only as a master/host, so SONAR does not see them as a ReWire client/slave, nor can they see SONAR. The only DAWS with ReWire that SONAR is seeing are Reaper and Reason (64-bit). Reaper does not see SONAR as a ReWire application.
It isn't possible natively Reaper must have some kind of bridging going on for that to work. Other DAWs haven't implemented 'half' the ReWire technology it's just that some apps. are clients and some are hosts. Sonar's implementation is correct in this regard in that being a host it will only indicate slave applications native to the version (x86, x64) you are using. If you read the Propellerheads info on the subject it makes it all clear, the instructions for Reason itself clearly state all this including the fact that 32<>32 bit or 64<>64 bit connections are possible unless some kind of bridging technology is employed. Regardless of whether or not I'm choosing to bridge or that process is done for me discreetly from within an application is neither here nor there for me. If I'm using a 32 bit slave then I'm limited to the constraints of that app anyway. If I'm using a 64 bit slave then it would make sense to take advantage of this new 64 bit implementation in Sonar. Reaper still won't allow anything greater than a 4gb project from a 32 bit slave even if you are using the 64 bit version of it. That is the point.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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DigitalArchivist
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 19:05:18
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Thank you very much for the explanation. I appreciate the time you took. Love your photo!
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Alegria
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 19:11:26
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"DigitalArchivist"
Love your photo! Much better than the "peeing" pooch if you ask me. 
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Bill51
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 19:12:11
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What about this statement on the Sibelius website?
"ReWire normally requires both the master and the slave to be 32-bit applications, because the underlying technology is not yet available for 64-bit systems. But Sibelius 7 can run as a 64-bit application and communicate with a 32-bit ReWire master, thanks to its unique inter-process communication approach."
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cincyjack
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 19:15:02
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Rewire running great with Reason 64!
Thanks Cake!
The monster is back...
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tnphelps
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 19:35:25
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I am using Sonar X1d 64 bit on Win 7. I have Melodyne editor 2.0. It is 64 bit and the Celemony website says it is Rewire compatible but Sonar X1d will not recognize it as the Insert Rewire Device option is still greyed out. Is there something else I should be doing?
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Fog
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 19:44:44
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Bill51
What about this statement on the Sibelius website?
"ReWire normally requires both the master and the slave to be 32-bit applications, because the underlying technology is not yet available for 64-bit systems. But Sibelius 7 can run as a 64-bit application and communicate with a 32-bit ReWire master, thanks to its unique inter-process communication approach."
"unique" = they are using some sort of bridge to do it, or some other technique.. it's not doing it "as is" per the propellerheads spec / library for it, there is a middle step along the line.. which Noel put about earlier in the thread (from the props themselves)
post edited by Fog - 2012/03/05 19:53:38
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radioactiveblue
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 20:48:28
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Hi Bill,
Daniel S. over at the Sibelius forum recently told om March 3rd that:
We're looking into what it will take to support the new 64-bit ReWire SDK.
Sonar X3E Producer (64 bit) Windows 7 Home Premium (64 bit) AMD Phenom II X4 820 8 GB DDR3 (PC3-10600 MB/sec) M-Audio Fast Track Pro 1 TB WD Caviar Green internal HD (OS and software) 500 GB WD Caviar Black internal HD (Audio Projects) 500 WD external HD (for file back up only) Kurzweil PC1 SE Sibelius 7.5 (Various guitars and effects, including Roland GR55)
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vintagevibe
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/05 22:54:03
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e.Blue
I think someone from CW mentioned a while back that 64-bit Rewire would only work with 64-bit Rewire devices. Right now the only two that I am aware of are Reason 6 and Melodyne 2.
-e.B
Sibelius 7 is 64bit rewire compatable.
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alkemy
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/06 08:40:46
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This thread - http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=2508058 says that Sibelius 7 is native x64 and Rewire is not x64, therefore Sibelius can't be rewired. Can someone explain the difference between native x64 rewire and 64 bit rewire?
Asus P6TSE mobo, Intel i7 920 2.67ghz, 8gb RAM, Windows 7 64 bit
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Jonbouy
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/06 08:45:30
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e.Blue
I think someone from CW mentioned a while back that 64-bit Rewire would only work with 64-bit Rewire devices. Right now the only two that I am aware of are Reason 6 and Melodyne 2.
-e.B
+1 You'll need a 64 bit slave app to go with it. You've always been able to run your 32 bit apps via rewire natively you just need to install your 32 bit version of X1 to use them. Why would you need a 64 bit host to Rewire to a 32 bit slave? Sibelius, FL, Live etc, etc just use your 32 bit version of Sonar and all will be well. R6 or Melodyne II are both 64 bit capable and will therefore work with the new version.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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Jonbouy
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/06 08:53:32
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alkemy
This thread - http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=2508058 says that Sibelius 7 is native x64 and Rewire is not x64, therefore Sibelius can't be rewired. Can someone explain the difference between native x64 rewire and 64 bit rewire?
Sibelius as a 32 bit Rewire slave and will need to the 32 bit version of Sonar to run it without some kind of bridge (i.e. natively).
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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radioactiveblue
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/06 09:05:41
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Jonbouy
alkemy
This thread - http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=2508058 says that Sibelius 7 is native x64 and Rewire is not x64, therefore Sibelius can't be rewired. Can someone explain the difference between native x64 rewire and 64 bit rewire?
Sibelius as a 32 bit Rewire slave and will need to the 32 bit version of Sonar to run it without some kind of bridge (i.e. natively).
In the meantime if you use the ReWire vst from: http://www.energy-xt.com/index.php?id=0115 it is adequate and will allow you to do so in Sonar 64 bit.
Sonar X3E Producer (64 bit) Windows 7 Home Premium (64 bit) AMD Phenom II X4 820 8 GB DDR3 (PC3-10600 MB/sec) M-Audio Fast Track Pro 1 TB WD Caviar Green internal HD (OS and software) 500 GB WD Caviar Black internal HD (Audio Projects) 500 WD external HD (for file back up only) Kurzweil PC1 SE Sibelius 7.5 (Various guitars and effects, including Roland GR55)
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Jonbouy
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Re:Sonar X1d and Rewire 64
2012/03/06 09:16:11
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boblette
Jonbouy
alkemy
This thread - http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=2508058 says that Sibelius 7 is native x64 and Rewire is not x64, therefore Sibelius can't be rewired. Can someone explain the difference between native x64 rewire and 64 bit rewire?
Sibelius as a 32 bit Rewire slave and will need to the 32 bit version of Sonar to run it without some kind of bridge (i.e. natively).
In the meantime if you use the ReWire vst from: http://www.energy-xt.com/index.php?id=0115
it is adequate and will allow you to do so in Sonar 64 bit.
You can indeed, although it is a bridged solution and costs. Everyone who has X1 has the 32 bit version they can install alongside their 64 bit version and run 32 bit slaves (and also VST plug-ins that don't like being bridged) natively for free.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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