12 String Capo'd

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digi2ns
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2012/09/11 13:49:19 (permalink)

12 String Capo'd

Aolt of work getting a 12 string ready to record. 
 
Tuning before anything, applying capo in a manner that will get all the strings correctly then to finess it back into tune, WOW
 
Once you get that, the fingers work so much harder if multiple takes a needed (OUCH)
 
Worth it once you get past all the prep 
 
Anyone work with 12 strings much?


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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/11 14:47:27 (permalink)
    6 and 8 mostly here..... 

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    #2
    digi2ns
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/11 16:43:28 (permalink)
    Never seen or played a 7 or 8 string.
    12 capo'd is kinda challenging with the smaller string next to the larger. Alot of the time, I have to add a spacer behind the capo to get it to get down to the smaller string without it having a muted sound. Which adds more pressure drifting the pitch/tuning up a little.
    I spent a good portion of the day getting it ready to do some tracking, the good side is-my fingers have had time to relax and recoop from playing earlier.
    Now tracking is just a matter of hitting a few Punch In/Out spots and Im off 


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    #3
    Chappel
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/11 19:06:45 (permalink)
    My first acoustic guitar was a 12 string and I learned to play on that. I don't recall ever having any problems using a capo with it. Of course, not all capos are created equal. Some may work better than others because of the material that presses against the string and how well the radius of the fingerboard and capo match up. I used an old capo my dad bought right after WW2. It worked great then, and still works great now.

    Are you using a capo made to work with 12 strings?
    #4
    Alegria
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/11 19:18:36 (permalink)
    "digi2ns"
    Anyone work with 12 strings much?

    All the time. With .012 to .052 gauge strings. For a warm and mellow tone, I prefer silk & steel but for everyday playing I use an 80/20 bronze mix with an ultra thin coating of nanoweb (your fingers will thank you). Speaking of which, finger callouses management becomes important, especially if you're also a piano player. I rarely use bar chords and don't use a capo. I also avoid using scales with more than 5 accidentals which basically eliminates usage of open strings, which are good friends with a 12 string. You're a brave fellow to use a capo.

    One thing I do to avoid excessive finger tip pain, is practice/play on a daily basis even if it's just for half an hour. Day in and day out. And it does make all the difference. But preparing for a 12 string recording session is tedious and something I don't enjoy much. I completely understand your position.

    Note: I've used at times a special string lubricant to manage squeaks but you can kiss your strings goodbye soon after as it also kills the tone. And the strings ain't cheap nowadays. 
    #5
    Guitarhacker
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/11 20:37:35 (permalink)
    Six string  (one of 4)






    Eight string  





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    #6
    Rbh
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/11 20:45:00 (permalink)
    I've always wanted to string a 12-string with the light string on bottom and regular string on top. I've just been too lazy to file a new nut. But, for finger picking and down strokes - it would work much better for my style.

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    #7
    chuckebaby
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/11 20:55:32 (permalink)
    i use the 80/20's..0.54-.012-martin makes the best sounding ones IMO
    ive seen everything when it comes to 12 strings,ive seen people come in to record on them and just say...okay,its your money.
    ive even seen people string'em up backwords..with the .054 up top rather then the .032/.054.
    spend alot of time fiddling w/them getting them straight,its personal experience that a 12'er out of intonation can be a nightmare to keep/tune.

    i strongly suggest straightning out the neck before anything,tighten the truss rod till you have only a slight dip.
    this is the mistake i see most.
    the truss rod not tight enough or over tightened.
    w/out a dip youll get fret buzz,w/too much of a dip youll get out of tune chords in some spots.
    its also about comprimise unless your playing the best 12 ever made.
    find the box your playing in and tune it up,the general is from 1-3-5 frets.
    i have a martin and i still have fluctuations in the 7-9 region of my frets where im off a small amount.
    capo isnt the exeption exept finding that box i spoke of.

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    #8
    bitflipper
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/11 21:32:57 (permalink)
    You just have to accept that there are some things you can't properly do with a 12-string guitar: use a capo, bend notes, tune. 


    All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. 

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    #9
    digi2ns
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/11 21:52:16 (permalink)
    Yeh Its a very nice Takamine EF385.  Neck is in perfect shape, low action and no buzzing at all all the way up the neck.
    Ive played 12 strings for a long time but unfortunately that time thing is what is getting me now (Arthritis)  LOL
    Intunation is right on the money-no issues at all with chords anywhere.

    This is my first time being new to the recording side of really seeing what it takes to prep one for actually tracking. I find even with a 5 to 10 degree room temp change throughtout the day-Check or Retune OFTEN.
    As for the song we are working on, the chords that are being played doesnt allow for bar chords and capo'd open chords just really add that sound/tone we are after.
    Just kind of an eye opener with it being the first time attemping to achieve a good recording of a 12 for me.  
    Glad to hear its the norm and all the thoughts on the capo thing.
    I appreciate the other suggestions and info as well. Knowledge is priceless
     
    Forgot to add that this is also my first time with trying the capo on a 12'er as well. I have a couple but I guess I need to look at something just for 12s. Wasnt sure if there was more tension and a softer bar on them or ???  But theres gotta be a big difference.
    Ive seen a few others play with them on 12s for a few sets without any probs at all.
    post edited by digi2ns - 2012/09/11 21:55:32


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    #10
    dke
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/12 02:18:53 (permalink)
    I used to play 12 string on most any song I did with acoustic, and used a capo as well when needed no particular problems.  I think it's just what you're used to playing, if one mostly plays 6 string & electrics then a 12 string is going to be challenging.  These days I usually just use my JTV 59 Variax.

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    Bristol_Jonesey
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/12 04:43:12 (permalink)
    You might find you'll be better off recording the song in sections, moving the position of the capo as you move between different sections.

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    cliffsp8
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/12 06:29:46 (permalink)
    I use a G7th capo. The trick is to fit it carefully by pressing the bar down straight on to the strings, without moving sideways or otherwise disturbing the strings, before clamping.

    The other trick is to have a reasonably low action and have it properly in tune first 

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    #13
    Beepster
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/12 11:30:12 (permalink)
    Are you using a "quick" capo or the kind that wraps entirely around the neck with the screw clamp? I find quick capos can sometimes not apply enough pressure evenly on all the strings... even on a six string guitar. Might be something to consider. And yeah I'd look around to see if you can find a capo specifically designed for 12 string. Also spend a little more on a quality capo. It may seem silly for such a simple device but in the studio you want accuracy. It'll save you more time doing takes and trying to brighten deadened tones. Cheers.
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    Beepster
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/12 11:46:45 (permalink)
    Oh and although I've only worked with capos when absolutely forced to by anal band members I've been told more than once that tuning AFTER the capo is in place is a no no. With a proper capo on a guitar that has good intonation you should be able to tune up the guitar then apply the capo. If it is out of tune at that point something is wrong. The three likely culprits are 1) the guitar wasn't actually tuned properly 2) the guitar has an intonation problem or 3) the capo was put on crooked or improperly and it's bending the strings (sometimes even if it goes on straight if you have "tall" frets the pressure from the capo can knock things out of whack which is another reason why the screw down capos are better). If you tune with the capo on you are creating a situation where the string tension may not be distributed evenly on each string (there could be more or less tension above the capo) so when you start playing that tension gets released below the capo and you go out of tune. Cheers.
    #15
    geeare1
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/12 14:50:03 (permalink)
    There are a couple of companies that make capos specifically for 12 strings. I've always had good results with Shubb capos on guitars and Dobros.

    You can check 'em out here, if you're interested: http://www.shubb.com/

    -gr

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    The Band19
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    Re:12 String Capo'd 2012/09/12 19:27:32 (permalink)
    Taylor 754... Recording one with it now. But this sweet piece of wood and steel stays in tune ;-) Drop a few large on an instrument and they're typically better made.



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