MrRoundel
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Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
Greetings all. I'm brand new to Cakewalk and computer music production as well. At the suggestion of a friend who said touted the "user-friendliness" of Sonar, I bought Sonar X2. So far, I'm not sure that there is a neophyte user-friendly piece of DAW software out there at all. I guess I'll have to spend some time with it and hope that it penetrates my cluttered skull somehow. While trying to get my input/output devices set up, I'm finding that I cannot get my electric guitar to play through the computer with Sonar X2 unless I enable the "echo" effect. I have tried connecting a Line6 JM4 looper and a Vox practice amp before going into the computer but still nothing unless I activate the "echo". Do I need a DI box? Any suggestions are appreciated. Thanks in advance. MrR
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Lynn
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 10:58:25
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If you're using an amp simulator, you must enable the echo button to hear your guitar in real time. The trick is to set up your converter to its lowest latency so you're not hearing a delay on the signal. If, on the other hand, you're using a mixer and micing your guitar, then if all the outputs from X2 are routed through the mixer, you won't need to engage the echo button as all your signals should arrive at the mixer at the same time. Hope this helps.
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FastBikerBoy
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 11:00:18
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There are two ways of monitoring either using "Direct monitor" or the "input monitoring" method. The latter requires input echo to be active as you have discovered.
Whether you can direct monitor or not will depend on your interface as this is where it is controlled from. You will not be able to monitor any effects used within Sonar when using direct monitoring though.
Input monitoring will introduce latency although how much is again interface dependent. A DI box will not make any difference to monitoring except that you may be able to take a copy of the signal from the box to monitor with/from.
HTH
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Mystic38
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 11:00:53
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Do you mean the input echo on the audio track?..if so then this is correct..
Input echo allows the input to be 'echoed' directly to the output without being recorded...
i strongly suggest a solid browse through the tutorials and early examples in the manual... no DAW is easy to use, but Sonar is not the most complex by far, and spending some time learning it will pay big dividends..
and welcome to the forum
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MrRoundel
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 11:15:55
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Thank you for your answers, and the "welcome" to the board. I have tried plugging directly into the input jacks on my computer, which is a Dell XPS 8300 with a Realtek audio setup. According to Cakewalk's tech pages, Realtek isn't the optimal sound card for doing recording. However, so far it seems like I can't get it to work at all. Again, w/o the echo being on. Latency? Uh-oh, I think I might be in over my head here. I guess I'll have to keep working at it. "I'm just the cook." Can I plug my guitar directly into the 1/8" input, using a simple adapter 1/4"x1/8", or do I have to have an amp of some sort inline? BTW: I do have a Behringer Eurorack MX802A mixer. Would this be helpful somehow?
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Danny Danzi
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 11:42:51
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☄ Helpful
MrRoundel
Thank you for your answers, and the "welcome" to the board. I have tried plugging directly into the input jacks on my computer, which is a Dell XPS 8300 with a Realtek audio setup. According to Cakewalk's tech pages, Realtek isn't the optimal sound card for doing recording. However, so far it seems like I can't get it to work at all. Again, w/o the echo being on. Latency? Uh-oh, I think I might be in over my head here. I guess I'll have to keep working at it. "I'm just the cook." Can I plug my guitar directly into the 1/8" input, using a simple adapter 1/4"x1/8", or do I have to have an amp of some sort inline? BTW: I do have a Behringer Eurorack MX802A mixer. Would this be helpful somehow?
Yeah, I do what you do on my laptop all the time. 1/8 inch into line in, not mic in...it will distort. You still may get some latency (delay in your sound) due to the Realtek using WDM drivers. You can run ASIO4ALL drivers which are a simulated driver for giving you more performance out of a WDM card. I know...more things to confuse you...sorry. LOL! But if you run a Realtek rig, the ASIO4ALL driver package will complete it and make it tolerable. Just search for them and you'll find them if you decide to go that route. As for not hearing yourself without using echo, you should be able to enable "playback" in your Realtek options so that anything you play, will be monitored. Right click on your speaker icon on your task bar....select the playback options and make sure line in is enabled so you can hear yourself. Then, do the same thing again and select record options and make sure line in is enabled there. You should hear your guitar and be able to record it. If you use a guitar sim plug like TH2 or Guitar Rig...you will need to use the echo button as that will allow you to hear the guitar sim. The problem there is, you will also hear your clean sound with it...so to stop it, right click on the speaker icon again in your task bar, select playback, and mute the line in. This will stop your clean sound from playing at the same time as the guitar sim you may be using if you're using a distortion patch or something. Hope this helps...good luck! :) -Danny
My Site Fractal Audio Endorsed Artist & Beta Tester
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MrRoundel
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 12:45:45
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Thanks, Danny. That helped. I can now hear my guitar through my computer. However, when I change the input in order to record in stereo, it works somewhat, but the recording is noisy but muffled. Oh well. Is there a "Cakewalk for Dummies" book out there? Maybe it's a cakewalk for some folks out there, but not for the likes of me. Thanks again.
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daveny5
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 12:48:27
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☄ Helpful
Can I plug my guitar directly into the 1/8" input, using a simple adapter 1/4"x1/8", or do I have to have an amp of some sort inline? Guitars require a preamp or a stompbox to get the signal level to what is called Line Level. Since you have a mixer, that will do. What you should do is route the output of the mixer to the soundcard and then monitor your playing through the mixer and not the computer and you won't have that latency delay. You can plug your guitar into the mixer and that will give you a strong enough signal to record. You can also take the LINE OUT from the soundcard (usually the blue jack) and plug that into the AUX return on your mixer. That will allow you to monitor your playback without re-recording it when you're overdubbing. Cakewalk has a good resource for beginners. Here's the link: http://www.cakewalk.com/support/kb/reader.aspx/2007013075.
post edited by daveny5 - 2012/10/07 13:10:47
Dave Computer: Intel i7, ASROCK H170M, 16GB/5TB+, Windows 10 Pro 64-bit, Sonar Platinum, TASCAM US-16x08, Cakewalk UM-3G MIDI I/F Instruments: SL-880 Keyboard controller, Korg 05R/W, Korg N1R, KORG Wavestation EX Axes: Fender Stratocaster, Line6 Variax 300, Ovation Acoustic, Takamine Nylon Acoustic, Behringer GX212 amp, Shure SM-58 mic, Rode NT1 condenser mic. Outboard: Mackie 1402-VLZ mixer, TC Helicon VoiceLive 2, Digitech Vocalist WS EX, PODXTLive, various stompboxes and stuff. Controllers: Korg nanoKONTROL, Wacom Bamboo Touchpad
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MrRoundel
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 15:27:36
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Thanks. I just tried going through the mixer and it's no different than when I went my practice amp. Noisy and muffled. Oh well...I'll keep trying. I'll check out the link to see if I can get past "go" with this stuff. Update: Everything still sounds muffled and noisy. I did a search on such a problem and found that Realtek audio is often blamed. I read that by using some sort of external A/D converter might quiet things down. Would an M-Audio Pre Audio USB work for accomplishing that job, or do I need to invest in a better sound card setup? BTW: I also will be reading "PC Sound Recording for Dummies". Maybe that will help me understand a bit more of what's going on. Thanks.
post edited by MrRoundel - 2012/10/07 17:31:53
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daveny5
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 19:05:17
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Everything still sounds muffled and noisy. That seems odd. Are your headphones plugged into the mixer? Are they good headphones? Did you adjust the tone controls on the mixer? What kind of guitar do you have? Using the built-in soundcard is not the best solution for good audio, but it should work. A USB audio interface would be better, but you should do some homework before rushing off to buy one. You have to think about how many tracks you need to record simultaneously, how many inputs do you need, do you have external effects, etc. There is a learning curve to acquire the skills needed to do this. Its not "plug 'n play".
Dave Computer: Intel i7, ASROCK H170M, 16GB/5TB+, Windows 10 Pro 64-bit, Sonar Platinum, TASCAM US-16x08, Cakewalk UM-3G MIDI I/F Instruments: SL-880 Keyboard controller, Korg 05R/W, Korg N1R, KORG Wavestation EX Axes: Fender Stratocaster, Line6 Variax 300, Ovation Acoustic, Takamine Nylon Acoustic, Behringer GX212 amp, Shure SM-58 mic, Rode NT1 condenser mic. Outboard: Mackie 1402-VLZ mixer, TC Helicon VoiceLive 2, Digitech Vocalist WS EX, PODXTLive, various stompboxes and stuff. Controllers: Korg nanoKONTROL, Wacom Bamboo Touchpad
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MrRoundel
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/07 23:51:48
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Yup, I can see that it's not "plug and play". My headphones are wireless, but a decent model from Sony. The base unit is an DP IF3000. Are wireless a bad idea? I will say that the audio sounded fine when I listened to the samples that are provided by Cakewalk. The guitar I'm using is a single-coil model, a '99 USA-made G&L ASAT Classic semi-hollow. As far as how many tracks I'll be doing, it won't be more than 1/2 dozen or so. The only reason I got the software was because I've been recording a few songs just using my Samson C03U mic in front of my guitar amp, flanked by a couple of PA speakers, with Sony Sound Forge Audio Studio 8.0 as software. A friend suggested that my recordings would sound more pro if I used software that would allow multiple tracks. So, it'll be maybe a rhythm guitar, lead guitar, bass, drum track, and vocals, not much other that that. I don't plan on getting too "crazy" with it. I just want to be able to accent certain sounds while dropping back others, etc. Thanks for your help. MrR
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MrRoundel
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/09 16:36:01
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Well, I happened to find a link to the 900+ page instructional manual on the cakewalk website. Someone was kind enough to post it in another thread. After I learned how to open up a new "blank" template and made a recording, it was much clearer and louder. I did have to enable the left side input in order to record in stereo. Slowly, but surely, I'll get the hang of it. Thanks for the help provided here.
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Crg
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/09 18:57:22
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You really need to get a USB or firewire interface to get any usable performance for recording. The difference in perfromance and quality will amaze you. Most DAW programs <--Cakewalk, are made for professional equipment. I can tell you from experience you're screwing yourself to death trying to stick with the realtek onboard soundcard. They just aren't made to do the job of real time recording and streaming and most DAW platforms do not write their drivers and software to work well with onboard sound cards. Do yourself a favor and get a good interface.
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daveny5
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Re:Can't hear guitar unless "echo" is enabled.
2012/10/09 21:45:20
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My headphones are wireless, but a decent model from Sony. The base unit is an DP IF3000. Are wireless a bad idea? Yes, wireless headphones are a bad idea. I had a pair and they sounded terrible.
Dave Computer: Intel i7, ASROCK H170M, 16GB/5TB+, Windows 10 Pro 64-bit, Sonar Platinum, TASCAM US-16x08, Cakewalk UM-3G MIDI I/F Instruments: SL-880 Keyboard controller, Korg 05R/W, Korg N1R, KORG Wavestation EX Axes: Fender Stratocaster, Line6 Variax 300, Ovation Acoustic, Takamine Nylon Acoustic, Behringer GX212 amp, Shure SM-58 mic, Rode NT1 condenser mic. Outboard: Mackie 1402-VLZ mixer, TC Helicon VoiceLive 2, Digitech Vocalist WS EX, PODXTLive, various stompboxes and stuff. Controllers: Korg nanoKONTROL, Wacom Bamboo Touchpad
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