Vocal Comping with Lanes (my gripe)

Good day!  Just want to see if I'm out to lunch on this.

Creating a finalized vocal track from takes seems like chaos to me in Sonar.  I don't understand, because REAPER ($40) offers a Beautiful workflow.  If Sonar were to adopt it, it would truly stand alone as a one-stop-shop for DAWs...because it's just so damned awesome at everything else!

REAPER method:  The highlighted portion of any clip/take is the ONLY thing that plays, so... you Split to isolate what you want, Click the portion of clip you want to use (to activate it), and move the split to account for any phasing, and move on.  Split, Click, Move Split if necessary.  Once you "activate" one of the take portions, everything else vertical mutes.  It's PERFECT.  

SONAR method:  Everything is playing all at once... so, solo one of the tracks...is it good?  Ok now mute the rest (or exclusive-select tool)...oops, now there's overlap that doesn't work properly.  Fudge the muted section so it hopefully works nicely.  Still doesnt...try a "manual crossfade".  Ugh.  Oops there's a small piece of a lane that I forgot to mute...ok good, first line is now sounding okay.  Phew!  

So I ask:

Why on earth do Lanes play at the same time?  This "functionality" (?) is completely contrary to what the spirit of a lane should be.  Lanes are "versions" of ONE track.  At any given time, only ONE lane should ever be active.  Ever.  It's one track!  Lanes hold the potential 'pieces' of one track.  If you like the first two words of Take 3, split to isolate the first two words -- all the takes should split.  Click that piece -- it should mute every other take above/below it!  If there's phasing, simply move the split until you find a nice crossover point...and move on.  

I LOVE the lanes approach, but the way it is set up is basically overcomplicating and breaking a super useful new feature of Sonar X2.  It would be so simple to fix this!!!  Allow only one clip to ever be vertically-active, splits should split all the takes together, the split point should move together on all of them, and in no circumstance EVER should the takes ever play together... because why?

Thoughts?  :D

This seems to be a common misunderstanding with a lot of SONAR users. You can use SONAR's "Isolate" feature exactly how you described in Reaper.

Maybe that feature is hidden deep in SONAR's manual, but it works and is great. Many claim SONAR lacks this work flow, but it does not, they just are not aware of all of SONAR's capabilities. Reading the manual, getting Scott Garrigus' SONAR Power books, or asking forum members if something is "possible" seems to be the thing to do rather than just assume the negative.

Just one SONAR users opinion. Take lanes could use a little tweaking, but I am liking them more than the layers. I know other feel the opposite and that is ok. Maybe SONAR can make both available or something down the road.

nderstanding with a lot of SONAR users. You can use SONAR's "Isolate" feature exactly how you described in Reaper. Maybe that feature is hidden deep in SONAR's manual, but it works and is great. Many claim SONAR lacks this work flow, but it does not, they just are not aware of all of SONAR's capabilities. Reading the manual, getting Craig Anderton's SONAR Power books, or asking forum members if something is "possible" seems to be the thing to do rather than just assume the negative.

stevec

Just one SONAR users opinion. Take lanes could use a little tweaking, but I am liking them more than the layers. I know other feel the opposite and that is ok. Maybe SONAR can make both available or something down the road.

 
A big ole "+ 1" here!
 

Now that I know about the isolation method...I certainly like take layers a lot more. 

Who is Scott Garrigus?
 
 
 
 
 

If you come back, perhaps you could change thread title to "SOLVED", please.

Hey Charles,

LOL! No problem, man. Of course, you know you are now obligated to buy my next book when it comes out.  Just kidding! 


Thanks!
Scott

--
Scott R. Garrigus - http://garrigus.com
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series: http://garrigus.com/?PowerBooks
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar ProAudioTutor video tutorial series: http://garrigus.com/?ProAudioTutor
* Publisher of the DigiFreq free music technology newsletter: http://digifreq.com/?DigiFreq
* Publisher of the NewTechReview free consumer technology newsletter: http://newtechreview.com/?NewTechReview

Regarding lane playback... just click the Solo button of the lane you want to play. All other lanes will be muted automatically.

Scott

--
Scott R. Garrigus - http://garrigus.com
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series: http://garrigus.com/?PowerBooks
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar ProAudioTutor video tutorial series: http://garrigus.com/?ProAudioTutor
* Publisher of the DigiFreq free music technology newsletter: http://digifreq.com/?DigiFreq
* Publisher of the NewTechReview free consumer technology newsletter: http://newtechreview.com/?NewTechReview

The tool you guys describe definitely adds some functionality (and thanks for pointing it out - I'll flag this as solved...) but it still lacks basic things like crossfading.  I suppose this could be accounted for by splitting the clips and physically dragging the pieces to a new track to create the comp, then using all the manipulation tools, but this defeats the purpose of lanes... you could simply use folders then.

Bit more user error here you'll be pleased to know. Select the clips you want to fade comp together and then choose "Fade clips..." from the TV-->Clips menu. That will  allow you to set up crossfades and fill gaps (as long as the clip hasn't been trimmed).

You'll be pleasantly surprised to learn there's not much Sonar can't do and plenty of knowledgeable folks here to tell you how if you can't find it in the manual or other learning resources such as Scott's book or some of the tuition videos available such as that linked in my sig. (How's that for a shameless plug?)

Great thread & I'm a fan of both SWA's complete X-2(own it) and Scott G...I wore his X-1 Power book out recording my old bands last CD over the year it took to get done! Karl your voice over was great. I cracked up every time you sang tho. No disrespect man. I learned a lot!! I used to get pops editing audio, but no more cuz I no the trick! Thanks Karl!! Vic P.S. Waiting for the next Garrigus Encyclopedia to be released? :-)

DaddyV

Great thread & I'm a fan of both SWA's complete X-2(own it) and Scott G...I wore his X-1 Power book out recording my old bands last CD over the year it took to get done! Karl your voice over was great. I cracked up every time you sang tho. No disrespect man. I learned a lot!! I used to get pops editing audio, but no more cuz I no the trick! Thanks Karl!! Vic P.S. Waiting for the next Garrigus Encyclopedia to be released? :-)

Hey Vic,


Thanks very much! Yep, SONAR X2 Power! is in the works as we speak. Right now it's looking like an end of February release. May be sooner... stay tuned to DigiFreq and the Power Books site: http://www.garrigus.com/powerbooks.asp


Scott

--
Scott R. Garrigus - http://garrigus.com
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series: http://garrigus.com/?PowerBooks
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar ProAudioTutor video tutorial series: http://garrigus.com/?ProAudioTutor
* Publisher of the DigiFreq free music technology newsletter: http://digifreq.com/?DigiFreq
* Publisher of the NewTechReview free consumer technology newsletter: http://newtechreview.com/?NewTechReview