Let’s talk low-end roll-off

How many of you are using ProChannel EQ to “roll-off” low end frequencies on your tracks?
The big question for me in this regard is: what slope should typically be used? A gentler slope = a less extreme sound, but also less reduction of low end frequencies.
I would love to hear thoughts on this.

it depends on the material also,i listen to my songs sometimes along with a good low end spectrum display and look at the low end from 100hz down to about 20hz Listening through only the sub sometimes and determine what sounds good using several slope settings..

I think it depends one why one is using a roll off of the low frequencies.

If you're getting rid of mud but you have some useful content there a sharp quick roll off makes sense. If its just getting rid of unneeded frequencies that don't have a lot of content a more gentle curve would be wise.  For example a guitar has few frequencies in the bass range. One can roll that off with little concern about loosing useful content. But you don't have to be harsh to do so.  However say its a bass guitar you my want to get rid of everything below 50 Hz. This may not leave you room to be gentle. Thus a more severe curve may prove to be the way to go. 

Of course it could be just the opposite.
Judgment and listening has to be your ultimate guide.  

sharke


It's funny but even when I roll off everything under 300mHz with a steep curve, the Blue Cat frequency analyzer still shows activity all the way down to 10Hz, but the Vonexgo one shows no activity. So I don't know what's going on down there. As for slope I tend to go no higher than 18 for a roll off. 

yeah, sharke, i hear ya.  and the cakewalk analyst shows all kinds of activity.  i'm never sure which one is closer.  i thought for a while the analyst was picking up lfos in synths (i.e. i suspected a bug) but i turned off all lfos and just used a sin wave sample in rapture i still got activity. :/

Personally I like to use 6db per octave slope for both high and lows, although sometimes I use the same as the waves SSL channel strip which is 18db per octave for high pass (low cut) and 12db per octave for low pass (high cut) I assume that's what the real boards use since its supposed to be an emulation? Not sure how that would translate in the ProChannel EQ though (emulation wise)

Just out of curiosity and mainly directed to those who have used real mixing consoles such as SSL and the like, what are the slopes for hi/low cuts on such boards and are they fixed slopes?

elsongs

Been doing it since the old Sonar EQ. Depends on the application and other tracks. I use low-end rolloff to make room for certain instruments (kick drum, bass guitar/bass synth) to not compete for the low-end with other instruments. I also use it for cymbals/high-frequency percussion to make them more transparent sounding and less heavier. 

Absolutely agree.  If I am recording solo guitar, I am going to EQ the bottom end of the guitar completely differently than if I was mixing the guitar with a full band and need to make room for the bass guitar, etc.


Asking "what setting works" means nothing really, as every case if different.  That's why these FX have sliders and knobs and not just an on/off switch, right?


You absolutely have to use your ears for each and every song.  An arbitrary setting just isn't applicable.  For instance, going back to the guitar example - where was it mic'd?  At the sound-hole? At the 12th fret?  You are going to EQ very differently for each position.  What mic was used - omni or cardioid?  Again you will probably be EQing differently depending on the mic you used due to proximity effect, or lack thereof.


I always smack my forehead when this type of question is asked.

Shambler


Voxengo Span and a pair of ears works best for me =)

Fixed

John mentions cleaning up mud and there is another situation which can result in low end being muddy and that is when you get a build up around 200 to 300 Hz or so. When this occurs you need to create a EQ with a suitable dip around these frequencies but the low end needs to come back up to normal though.

This is NOT the same as using a HPF to remove unwanted bass in a track or buss. It is quite a different thing and you may be using a HPF incorrectly when actually it is this 200 to 300 Hz mud that you should be cleaning up instead using a dip EQ.

If you are not sure which one to try, if you feel you are not getting what you want from the HPF then try the dip around 250 Hz instead and see how you like it. Often it sounds amazing and totally cleans up a track or buss big time. Sometimes a little HPF in conjunction with the 250 Hz freq dip works great too.

Using spectrum analysers are not that great either in this area. They tend to work better when there is a lot of excess in a certain area and easy to pinpoint. I have often found they can still look OK down low but the bottom end is still not sounding right. Use your ears first. I find that spectrum analysers work best after 8 hours of mixing and you cannot tell what is what any more and the problem frequencies are higher up in the spectrum as well.

  Hey, sharke, have You learned something new about that activity in the low frequencies? In my case, I have to go very high with the cut to see the results in Voxengo... [pics showing 30db steep cut. #1: 20Hz; #2: 70Hz] http://pokazywarka.pl/r0j7hm/

Lanceindastudio


only ears can decide this brother.

+1

A lot of good general guides, but that is all it is.  I've been working on a song w/ guitars but no bass.  The strummed electric and a thumbed acoustic provide the bass.  Guess what, not much filtering going on w/ those two tracks, even tho w/ electric I (almost!) always roll some off the bottom.  Same w/ the backing voice - female.  Usually these get serious roll off - higher and/or steeper than the female lead.  In this song I kept it in, partially because the bv was actually lower than the lead vox and partially the performance.  It sounded better w/ little roll off and it fit the song better.

Know the rules (such as they are) and follow them and know when to break them for the song's benefit.

@

I'd think that any real console that did this was being inexpertly used:

I'll do a steep roll-off on every track that was recorded with a mic that doesn't do this naturally. For example, an SM57 won't pick up frequencies so low that they're hurting your mix, but a U47 might. Use your ears, and watch your Spectrum Analyzer, but in my case, I'll rull off a steep curve at 15-20Hz in every buss.