cyberzip
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X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
X2 is a great upgrade with a lot of good improvements. But there's one thing I miss - the buttons! So many options and features are now hidden in menus, which increases mouse clicking a lot. A prime example for me is the Browser, which used to have a lot of dedicated buttons in Sonar 8.5: - Enable auto-preview - Preview at host tempo (didn't exist in 8.5) - Loop preview (didn't exist in 8.5) - Change view (Icon/List/Details) The above are just a few examples. Does anyone else want Cakewalk to bring more dedicated buttons back to avoid RSI?
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Frostysnake
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 05:42:01
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Set up key bindings  ..then you can dedicate what ever button you want.
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Kalle Rantaaho
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 06:37:12
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That's the way it goes... IIRC, one of the most common complaints about SONAR < 8.5 was that the UI was cluttered with buttons and other junk, and the most common praise for X-versions came regarding the cleaned up, more simple UI :o) :o/
SONAR PE 8.5.3, Asus P5B, 2,4 Ghz Dual Core, 4 Gb RAM, GF 7300, EMU 1820, Bluetube Pre - Kontakt4, Ozone, Addictive Drums, PSP Mixpack2, Melda Creative Pack, Melodyne Plugin etc. The benefit of being a middle aged amateur is the low number of years of frustration ahead of you.
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jm24
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 12:04:11
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The mental illness of de-cluttering has run rampent in the X series. One person's clutter is another's well thought through lay-out of tools. One click buttons, reflecting state, are much superior to menus. Menus, menus everwhere, and not a drop of reason. I find the command-ribbon to be way cluttered with crap I never use. Which is the definition of clutter. 8.5.3 provides the true ability to declutter with completely configurable menus and button-bars. And other stupid stuff: screen sets: importing from other projects is stupid: should be global presets change the meter displays, but no presets for meters But there are presets for gadgets. Yet there are more possible choices for meters. Hidden menus: lanes no indication of more than one take lane in track take lane menu-toggle not available until track expanded: ANOTHER MENU ANOTHER CLICK Menu on staff view: absolutely the stupidest example of declutter over powerful ease-of-use. The X series requires users to give more attention to the interface. Not what an interface is supposed to do. Learning key commands is useful. But key commands most often do not provide quick information about the state of functions. If the user has to repeatedly waste time looking away from the work to read labels on menu headers, and then click the headers to choose items that should have been icon-buttons with symbols and color, the GUI has failed. The X series FUI is a big step to the rear for power use.
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joeb1cannoli
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 13:09:46
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I guess you can't please everyone. I'm loving the way X2 is laid out. My drummer is still on 8.5. When I go to his house and he asks me to help him with something in Sonar, I have to put on my reading glasses and spend 15 minutes trying to figure out which one of those stupid little buttons controls the function that I'm looking for. I personally find the X versions much more user friendly.
http://soundcloud.com/joe-b-10 Windows 10 Pro x64, 6 core, Core i7 , 16GB ram Sonar Platinum , Komplete 8, Ozone 8 Presonus Studio 192 and DP88 ,uad-2 solo
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joeb1cannoli
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 13:33:07
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Just to clarify cyberzip, I'm not saying that you're wrong. I'm just thinking that maybe more people agree with the X1,X2 way, and that's why Cakewalk made it so.
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stevec
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 14:12:10
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I have to put on my reading glasses and spend 15 minutes trying to figure out which one of those stupid little buttons controls the function that I'm looking for. Same here... The 8..5 camp is correct though in that the toolbars could be customized, leaving only those tools you need. However, as an out of the box experience, or working on someone else's machine, it was a different story... One of things I really want in the next "X" series is a customizable Control Bar module. That and some colors. :)
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Ludvig
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 17:14:15
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Hi guys! Some good ideas in here. Did you all report them to Cakewalk? I prefer the look of X-series but did like that 8.5 was configurable so that I could remove the buttons I did not use. But as stevec writes, the experience for a new user was terrible. I agree with the following, FWIW: screen sets: importing from other projects is stupid: should be global presets Menu on staff view: absolutely the stupidest example of declutter over powerful ease-of-use One of things I really want in the next "X" series is a customizable Control Bar module. Best Regards Ludvig
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Keni
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 17:32:58
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I use Panu's Duckbar to give back many of the buttons I miss... I too prefer a button to scrolling thru menus... Keyboard shortcuts are great too, but I don't always remember them while the button is a reminder... Keni
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SteveStrummerUK
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 19:00:33
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To this day, I still click on the Insert Menu every sodding time I want to Insert a tempo change. I can just imagine the staff meeting that decided that: "Hey guys, Strummy wants to INSERT a tempo change, let's take that function out of the INSERT menu and, for no reason whatsoever, put in the PROJECT Menu; but just to really wind him up, when he does eventually find it, we'll still name it INSERT Tempo Change" Absolutely pointless. Arrrrgggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhh
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SteveStrummerUK
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 19:03:24
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"Oh, and while we're at it, we'll have a View Menu and a Views Menu in the Track View. Now that will really push him over the edge" BTW, I am a very slow learner
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SteveStrummerUK
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 19:05:12
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And it took me 1.83672653 years to stop hitting F11 every sodding time I wanted to insert a marker. Apart from that, I lurve X1, and now X2.
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Glyn Barnes
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 22:23:02
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SteveStrummerUK To this day, I still click on the Insert Menu every sodding time I want to Insert a tempo change. You are not the only one, I assure you.
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Bub
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 22:26:51
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The thing about 8.5 and all previous versions was, the end user had the option to have as many or as few buttons as he wanted in the tool bar. It was 100% customizable and it was only cluttered by your own doing. I'm not really seeing how the X Series has improved upon this. It's never good to take away functionality, especially when it's been part of your software from day 1. I think the popularity of Panup's mod speaks volumes over this blunder ... and a few others that he fixed. I still can't believe they took the 'Phase' and 'Interleave' button off the tracks.
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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vintagevibe
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 22:52:40
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Don't worry. For X3 they will change everything again and we'll need to stop working and re-learn the software.
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panup
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/16 23:54:02
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I have made a mod that copies Insert commands from Project menu to Insert menu. It's included in my utility if you're interested...
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ampfixer
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Re:X2: Clickfest with all the menus - please bring buttons back!
2013/01/17 00:37:19
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As a recent convert to Duckbar I have to say it makes Sonar a much better program. I have colour options and the ability to create a custom button bar. Why Cakewalk can't embrace the ideas that Panup has implemented is beyond me. In fact, I need the Sonar mods to make it usable after having some recent vision troubles. Great job Panup, keep up the good work.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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