konradh
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Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
Suppose I have a track (Rhodes, acoustic guitar, etc.) and I want to broaden it to create a strong stereo image. What is the best and simplest technique? I can clone the track and time shift one forward and one back—the trusty "Eye in the Sky" effect—but perhaps someone can recommend a more interesting technique since the R/L delay thing has been overworked. Example 1: I really like using Vir 2 Acoustic Legends sometimes for variety or as a complement to RealGuitar. It does not have a stereo sample set. (RealGuitar has a very nice stereo option.) Example 2: I am currently working on a track that uses Sonar's SI-Electric Piano (Rhodes). I have a good sound going by using a Guitar Rig slow rotator and some Pro Channel EQ but I would like a broader image. For vocals, I use a doubler to create an ADT effect, but vocals are different.
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wizard71
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 10:49:00
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Try Channel tools -Increased width preset. but having seen your post count im assuming you already know this lol Bibs
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 10:58:13
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A tried and true way of placing a mono source in a stereo image is to pan it a bit to one side and then perhaps use a true stereo reverb effect so that the reflections and trail differ from right to left. Once you actually have something different between left and right... you may want to experiment with a "widener" to see if that adds an effect that you enjoy. best regards, mike
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Jimbo 88
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 11:00:28
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Craig Anderton has a good way to do this in one of his videos. I dont remember exactly, but i think... 1) clone a track twice giving you 3 tracks 2) Pan one dead center, one hard left, one hard right 3) Eq the hard left and right tracks to create stereo image placement...say high pass on one side and low pass on the other to match where the high notes and low notes live in the real world
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 11:42:24
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Short delays are quire effective as well. If it's feasible, record the whole thing again and pan the 2 L/R
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bobgassert
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 12:02:08
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Brainworx Stereo Maker lets you adjust phase corallation ,,,, It works well for me on a side bus or inserted on a track or a bus
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leakybrain
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 12:32:58
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Clone the track pan one left, one right and nudge the second track a few milliseconds. Season to taste ...Nevermind, didn't read the whole post. :/
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Shambler
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 12:42:26
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tomixornot
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 13:07:23
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John
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 13:27:37
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I like Nugen Steropack Its still 32 bits but it works fine under Bitbridge.
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ed97643
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 14:50:31
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I am a huge fan of the Channel Tools "Increase Width" preset (as suggested above) for the following reason: Bring up the preset, and on the lower right there are sliders for width of left and right. You can make it very wide, more narrow, or you can have it slightly lean to one side or the other. I am remixing a bunch of my old analog 4-track stuff, and most of it was "four mono channels", so I am using that preset (varied by track of course) in a ton of these remixes. Working great here. Best, Ed PS, for the effect to work at all, the tracks interleave button must be set to stereo not mono. Make sure it looks like this: >>><<< (not like this: >>>) or you won't "hear" the effect at all.
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bitSync
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/24 15:32:45
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In addition to panning the original and the clone hard left and right with some small amount of delay, try also detuning the two tracks by a small amount, one up and one down. This technique may very well be automated in some plugins but I'm unaware which ones. 'Image spreading' I think it's called.
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dmbaer
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/25 13:28:48
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If mono-compatibility is important to you, be wary of the Haas effect techniques (delaying one channel slightly) as it will likely produce unwanted comb filitering when collapsed to mono. There's a stunningly good effect made by MeldaProductions that uses EQ differences only (or optionally also delay processing) called MStereoSpread. I believe that Waves has a plug that uses a similar technique. I have MStereoSpread and it's brilliant (I have no first hand experience with the Waves offering). However, MStereoSpread is intended to make mono signals stereo, which is a bit different than what you've stated you're looking for.
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brconflict
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/25 14:05:04
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Nugen Audio is on the right track. It's an easy thing to do manually, but the plug makes it much faster. Here's what I do: 1) Clone the track twice as mentioned earlier, giving you three tracks. 2) Leave one centered and pan the other two hard left and right. 3) Click the Phase button on one of the panned tracks and pull them back in from hard-left and hard-right until they sound about how you want. 4) On the panned channels, put a high-pass filter in with a non-drastic slope between, say 300-500Hz. 5) On the centered channel, put an EQ with a gradual sloped Low-Pass of about 200-400 Hz (where you feel is right), so that centralized bass frequencies stay centered. 6) Feel free to experiment with the EQ filters and panning, until you get what you're looking for. Don't be afraid to bring up the "filtered-out" frequencies on the centered channel if you think the higher frequencies missing there. 7) After doing this, you can play with delays, or echo tools, not to mention the free Flux STTool from Flux Home. Best of luck!!
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Zonno
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/25 14:08:55
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Hi, Craig Anderton had in one of hs video's an interesting solution for acoustic guitar. He made two clones of the mono acoustic guitar. Panned the orgininal in the center. Panned one clone to the left with a lowpass filter Panned the other clone to the right with a highpass filter. This broadens the sound of the acoustic guitar. This is a very simple technique.
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Bub
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/25 15:09:33
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tomixornot Just came across this http://www.musicradar.com...e-world-today-277953/3 Have not tried yet.. The plug-in's name is Upstereo (For those who haven't clicked the link). I downloaded it and checked it out when you posted the link. Oh my. It's a great VST. The 'Air' control is excellent. It seems to do it's best when you place it before a reverb. It's a 32bit VST, but I've been using it for hours without a hiccup in X2-64bit which is a lot more than I can say for most 32bit VST's I've tried running through Bitbridge.
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icontakt
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/25 18:53:43
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Bub tomixornot Just came across this http://www.musicradar.com...e-world-today-277953/3 Have not tried yet.. The plug-in's name is Upstereo (For those who haven't clicked the link). I downloaded it and checked it out when you posted the link. Oh my. It's a great VST. The 'Air' control is excellent. It seems to do it's best when you place it before a reverb. It's a 32bit VST, but I've been using it for hours without a hiccup in X2-64bit which is a lot more than I can say for most 32bit VST's I've tried running through Bitbridge. I thought this plugin was designed to widen the stereo image of a stereo signal (like Ozone's Stereo Image). No? Does it really convert a mono signal into stereo?
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icontakt
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/25 19:19:15
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Shambler You could try http://www.voxengo.com/product/stereotouch/ I tried this yesterday. I does a good job and it's free! Although it uses delay, I don't hear the undesirable "one side (that you hear first) sounds louder first and then the other side grows louder later" effect of the simple "delaying one channel slightly" technique (I haven't tried it in a mix so I can't tell for sure, though). Thanks for posting the link. @Bub: Sorry, I forgot the OP wasn't just looking for mono->stereo conversion.
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slartabartfast
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/25 19:46:57
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Eq the hard left and right tracks to create stereo image placement...say high pass on one side and low pass on the other to match where the high notes and low notes live in the real world I am not saying that this would not work to "broaden" the effect, but I am pretty confused about how sound in the real world sorts itself out low to high aligned right to left. The guitar is a mono instrument for all practical purposes, and no one can distinguish the different origination of high vs low strings separated by a couple of inches in an acoustic and not at all in a magnetic guitar. At best one could postulate that in a very asymmetric reflective/absorptive audio space there would be some asymmetry in the frequency mix of reflections coming from different directions. To the extent that this works it is not because it represents an acoustic model of the real world.
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guitardood
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/25 21:43:06
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Two things I've used to create some nice tones...... 1) ADT (Auto-Double-Tracking) - http://www.kvraudio.com/product/adt_by_vacuumsound Does a really nice job of recreating the clone-pan-and-nudge technique but also has a few other settings (wow and flutter) to give the sound a little more life than simply delay. and, 2) The DSP-Fx Chorus' Guitar Quadruple setting ( http://www.dspfx.com). I bought these quite a while ago and they are still quite relevant sound-wise albeit they are DX plugs. These were included in Sonar (don't remember which version they debuted) with different interfaces. The sonar version is FX-Chorus. This plug sounds really great for widening/adding life to both stereo and mono guitar and rhodes tracks. Best, guitardood EDIT: Also, +1 for the Voxengo StereoTouch
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VariousArtist
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/27 13:47:58
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Jyri T.
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/27 14:20:19
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Easy and nice: Use really short (true stereo) convolution reverb, like <25 ms. Thick plate works well.
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konradh
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/27 15:04:01
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Thanks for all the ideas, guys. Wizard, Don't let my post count fool you: there are tons of things I don't know and I have never really messed with Channel Tools to any extent.
Konrad Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/ Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka. Rokit 6s.
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Sacalait
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/27 17:15:44
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this is what brconflict says- but with a twist: If you're using a synth/soft synth as the sound source you could try this to 'fake' a mid-side recording: Record a midi track using a piano as the voice (just for this example) create a mono audio track of the piano from the midi track clone the track- now you'll have two mono piano tracks call the first track 'mid' and the second track 'side' and pan each in the MIDDLE create an effect send send using a reverb you like on the mid track, add just a touch of reverb on the side track add a good bit to the point that it's pretty wet bounce each track separately to MONO tracks WITH the effects Mute the two original tracks (not the bounced tracks) You'll now have two mono tracks with mono effects- the "side" track will be a bit more wet than the mid track Here's the important step: clone the bounced 'side' track and put the cloned track out of phase (only ONE can be out of phase, otherwise this wont work) pan each of these 'side' tracks full hard right and full hard left (create a stereo image from the two tracks) lower the volume on the two 'side' tracks to off hit play and listen to the mono mid track slowly raise the faders (grouped so they move at the same time) until you hear the stereo image come into place. I tried this with the Lexicon Reverb that came with 8.5 using a large hall and it worked nicely to create a broad stereo image.
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Jeff Evans
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/27 17:19:56
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Another technique is to add early reflections only from a reverb VST but don't add the add the reverb so much or make any reverb very tight (ie small room) and keep it low in the mix.
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Maarkr
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Re:Best Technique for Fake Stereo?
2013/01/27 23:17:02
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