redbarchetta
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What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
Hey all, I'm interested in getting a MIDI keyboard. I don't want a full blown keyboard or synth or anything like that. I'm not aspiring to become a Jordan Rudess from Dream Theater. Rather just something simple that I can control soft synths in Sonar for perhaps some sound effects in my songs. A few bells and whistles would be ok, just nothing way over the top. Thanks all
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AT
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/02/24 16:07:52
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Look at novation stuff. The keybeds are fatar (as far as I know) and they come w/ different levels of knobs and stuff. I don't actually use those too much, but I like the feel of my 25 Le. And the x/y pad is great for alchemy. @
https://soundcloud.com/a-pleasure-dome http://www.bnoir-film.com/ there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. 24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
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redbarchetta
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/02/24 16:42:49
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How well does it integrate with Sonar?
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bitflipper
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/02/24 19:16:01
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Any MIDI controller will work fine with SONAR. I would strongly urge you to try out any keyboard in person before buying, because it's a tactile device and how it feels is everything. 1. How many keys do you need? You might assume a compact 25-key controller might be best and take up the least amount of space. But as soon as you try to play a sample library that has keyswitches, you'll realize your mistake. 49 keys is the bare minimum, 72 or 88 is ideal if space is not an issue. 2. Some controllers offer user-assignable knobs and sliders. These can be very handy. You can use them to move the virtual controls on your software synthesizer. Maybe you care about this, maybe you don't. Some people consider it an essential feature. Personally, I almost never use the feature and wouldn't miss it if it was gone. 3. Some controllers have between pressure pads for percussive input. Some are tiny and can be actuated by a single finger only, others are big enough you can play with two fingers or a stick. It's a fun way to manually play drum parts. However, the sensitivity of these pads is never quite right, either too sensitive or not sensitive enough. 4. Most controllers nowadays do not have an internal power supply. I don't like wall-warts. I'd glady pay a little more for a controller that had an internal power supply. Some don't have a power supply at all and are powered off the USB bus. I don't like that at all (except for my little miniature keyboard I carry around when I travel). In the studio, I use 5-pin DIN, so I'd have to plug in a USB cable just for power. One MIDI controller that I have (Axiom 49) can be powered via USB or a wall-wart, but the wall-wart cost extra and is not included, requiring a separate purchase. 5. Speaking of 5-pin DIN...that's the old-fashioned way of hooking up MIDI devices, and most folks nowadays use a USB connection instead. I, however, am a fan of the old way of doing it. Just in case you should discover the benefits of DIN connectors, make sure the controller you choose has them. Not all do, especially at the low end of the price range. 6. If you ever end up using your controller on stage, you'll want to be able to do patch changes and/or MIDI channel changes quickly. If the controller requires you to pull up a menu in an LCD window to change the MIDI channel, skip it. Look for a dedicated switch instead. Even more important, if your controller is less than full-size make sure it has dedicated buttons for transposing! 7. Some low-end controllers lack pitch and/or mod wheels. These are absolutely essential IMO. Do not accept a touch pad or joystick-type controller in place of wheels. Only a Moog-style pitch wheel (returns to center when you let go of it) and mod wheel will do. They should be ergonomically placed such that you can easily reach them with your left hand while playing the keyboard with your right. (One of my synths requires an awkward long reach to get to the wheels.) Wheels should not offer much resistance - on my Axiom, the pitch wheel's springs are too tense. 8. Some controllers include a basic transport control (play, stop, rewind, FF). That's a surprisingly useful feature if your MIDI controller isn't right next to your computer keyboard. 9. Another nice feature if you use the controller on stage is backlit knobs. One of my controllers has this and I wish all of them did. (Why do so many devices have black buttons on a black background with tiny off-white labels? Engineers that have never worked from a darkened stage, that's why.) That's all I can think of off the top o' my head.
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Glyn Barnes
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/02/24 23:30:02
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bitflipper 1. How many keys do you need? You might assume a compact 25-key controller might be best and take up the least amount of space. But as soon as you try to play a sample library that has keyswitches, you'll realize your mistake. 49 keys is the bare minimum, 72 or 88 is ideal if space is not an issue. . I have a 61 note keyboard (Cakewalk A-800), I am far from being a great player but and I would not consider going for anything shorter, on some keyswitched VSTs 61 keys is still limiting. I have recently Acquired a AKAI LPK 25 mini keyboard, free with a magazine subscription. This is pretty useful for keyswitches. Another thing to consider is do you want piano type weighted keys or a lighter synth type action. Also consider aftertouch, many people find the A-800 aftertouch too stiff, but its OK for me. All improtant reasons to try before you buy. I actually like the Roland style combined pitchbend modulation lever, I guess because I am used to using Roland keyboards (way back to when I got a SH101). The specific disadvantage is both the modulation and pitch bend springs back to zero when you let go. While this is highly desirable for pitch bend, its not always what you want for modulation. You can work around by assigning another fader to modulation depth, but it will not be as conveniently positioned.
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Bonzos Ghost
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/02/26 14:57:04
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One possible issue to look out for with the plethora of inexpensive (IE: crap) midi controller keyboards these days is velocity range....meaning - if you require a 127 velocity when you hit the keys hard, will it actually give you a 127? Some have a difficult time doing that. Not good. It's not easy to test for that sort of thing in a store, but just Google reviews on any you might be interested in. If there's an on-going issue with velocity, (or anything else) you'll probably come across a lot of users complaining about that issue.
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RobertB
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/02/26 22:31:34
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bitflipper Any MIDI controller will work fine with SONAR. I would strongly urge you to try out any keyboard in person before buying, because it's a tactile device and how it feels is everything. +1 to this. A synths response to your attack on the keys can have a huge impact on how it sounds. Tactile feedback is very important in controlling that. Some inexpensive controllers have really soft, flimsy feeling keys that are just annoying to play. I don't really like weighted keys either. If it feels like a piano, you tend to play it like a piano, and this is generally not ideal. This may be a personal preference thing and ymmv. Knobs and sliders are nice. but not terribly essential most of the time. However, some buttons are really nice. For example, on my Edirol PCR M-50(ancestor to the A500 Pro), I can switch the output channel quickly with a few clicks. When I am working on a project, I may have several active synths, and this is a big deal. Drilling through menus in a multi-function display bugs me to no end. I also agree that 49 keys is bare minimum. That said, 49 keys will meet or exceed the range of 90% of your virtual instruments. Wall warts may not be attractive, but I much prefer them to USB power. If you can use a 5 pin DIN MIDI via your interface, great. If you only have USB, go direct to the computer if at all possible. Do you have a decent interface/sound card? When you are playing soft synths with a controller, you will be working real-time, and low latency is vital. List your system specs and Sonar version in your signature. It will help us answer questions you are probably going to have as you move forward.
My Soundclick Page SONAR Professional, X3eStudio,W7 64bit, AMD Athlon IIx4 2.8Ghz, 4GB RAM, 64bit, AKAI EIE Pro, Nektar Impact LX61,Alesis DM6,Alesis ControlPad,Yamaha MG10/2,Alesis M1Mk2 monitors,Samson Servo300,assorted guitars,Lava Lamp Shimozu-Kushiari or Bob
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lawajava
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/02/26 23:18:00
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redbarchetta - not sure what your PC is since you don't have a signature yet. I have a laptop for my PC. I love the mobility of hooking up to stuff in my studio setting if I need all the gear, and I love having the option of going elsewhere with Sonar and my laptop and being able to do most of everything not connected to any gear. My special bliss in being mobile and being able to be productive in places outside of my main studio setting is having a Line 6 KB37 keyboard. For a very good price point, with the KB37 I get a mobile keyboard, a fully functional audio input device (it serves really well as the external audio for Sonar), guitar and microphone inputs, and PodFarm. PodFarm has turned out to actually my favorite of the guitar amp sims I have including Guitar Rig 5. The KB37 works great with Sonar, and allows me to accomplish the kinds of things you were asking about in your initial post above. If I were a full-blown keyboardist like lots of the folks here, I admit this keyboard wouldn't be a concert performer. But for laying down tracks, melodies, etc. it's great! It can move in any direction with octave settings, so you can also play any key range as you need.
post edited by lawajava - 2013/02/26 23:21:13
Two internal 2TB SSDs laptop stuffed with Larry's deals and awesome tools. Studio One is the cat's meow as a DAW now that I've migrated off of Sonar. Using BandLab Cakewalk just to grab old files when migrating songs.
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Glyn Barnes
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/02/27 22:52:46
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RobertB bitflipper I also agree that 49 keys is bare minimum. That said, 49 keys will meet or exceed the range of 90% of your virtual instruments. . Unless you are a piano player I think the biggest frustration with a shorter board comes when a instrument uses key switches. Octave transpose buttons do not help much here unless you are using in step mode entry. As an example take NI Scarbee Pre bass. The actual range only covers 40 notes, B0 to D4 However below this key switches cover the range A-1 to A#0 and above the playing range there are further key switches extending all the way up to B6 so you need a 88 note keyboard to cover it all. The Scarbee basses may be an extreme case but there are plenty of others where, because of key switches, I find myself running out of keys on a 61 note board. NI's B4 and Vintage keys are less extreme examples. 61 note range + 12 key switches representing the preset keys of the original instrument. Adding a second keyboard like my Akai LPK 25 is a reasonably cheap solution that does not take up too much room. As a plus you have a very portable keyboard you can use with a laptop while traveling if you wish. Plenty of people use shorter keyboards successfully for a lot of things, I am just pointing out something that can easily be overlooked when deciding what you need.
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bitflipper
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/02/27 23:43:52
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Check out the Jordan Rudess Omnisphere demo on this page to see a secondary mini keyboard in use as a keyswitcher. RE: Akai LPK25 ...I've got one, too. But I haven't tried using it that way. Mine stays in the computer bag for traveling. It's pretty cool, composing at 40,000 feet over the Pacific. I just wish they made a mini pitch/mod wheel controller to go with it.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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blairsuth
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/03/01 14:43:07
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Novation makes some great controllers. I use M-Audio Oxygen 49 and it does everything I need for soft synths.
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losguy
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/03/25 17:57:55
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bitflipper Check out the Jordan Rudess Omnisphere demo on this page to see a secondary mini keyboard in use as a keyswitcher. What a great idea! I had considered a smallish live setup using a combination of two controllers, like a 61 and a 49, to handle two-handed parts. I was thinking along the lines of more flexibility and two lighter pieces of gear as opposed to one 88-key monster. I hadn't considered that the left-hand / bass controller could be used for keyswitches. That's brilliant! To the OP - I have a Novation ReMote 61SL in my studio. I got it thinking that I'd use all the knobs and faders for controlling all sorts of things in SONAR and on synths and FX. Like other posters here, I ended up just using the mouse, which I then upgraded to a Kensington trackball, which is very nice and easier on my joints. (I notice in the video that Jordan Rudess uses one - so maybe I *am* trying to be like him. ) Just my experience - but your preferences may be different. That said, I am thinking that the extra controls will make more sense in a live setup, where the mappings are likely to be more fixed, for example, where you may have the faders control the synth levels in a stack, and knobs controlling EQ or overdrive in an FX chain.
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Fog
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Re:What to look for in a MIDI keyboard?
2013/03/26 01:25:50
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I have m-audio axiom 61.. good build quality , not great to config novation 25sl mk 2.. not great build quality considering the price, to a point where I won't buy one again due to that.. first one I had keys weren't even level !! .. so so with automap, but for custom setup in sonar.. bit of a mare again m audio ozone - much like the oxygen .. only 25 keys , so so .. but I'm not a fan of how m-audio support is none listening when drivers don't work for 3 months!! just got a korg microkey 61 the other day.. only coz I wantd korg legacy software.. drivers for it are a nightmare.. won't reinstall correctly on win7 64 bit . (can't use sustain pedal) the price of keyboards has gone up I did notice from buying a few but if your SOLELY using sonar exclusively I bet the roland / cakewalk keyboards are the most straight forward. a sustain pedal is really nice, even if you don't go mad on playing . makes a big difference :)
post edited by Fog - 2013/03/26 01:26:51
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