wkujater
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X2 soft synth latency issue
I recently upgraded from X1 to X2 and now have a latency issue when performing with a soft synth. For example - I'm trying to record a new track of Arturia Mini Moog, but the latency is bad enough I cannot do it. I've used Sonar back to version 5 and have not had this problem. I've been using the same audio interface all along - M Audio Delta 1010. I have the same OS I did when i was running X1. The only change is from X1 to X2. I assume there is some setting I am missing. I'm running ASIO drivers and latency is down to 1.3ms/64 samples (i think that's pretty darn good!) Any change I make does not seem to make a dent in the latency (worse or better) in any soft synth I play. Any ideas?
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daveny5
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/20 23:12:49
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Do you have another soundcard selected? Check Preferences-Audio and make sure only the Delta1010 is checked.
Dave Computer: Intel i7, ASROCK H170M, 16GB/5TB+, Windows 10 Pro 64-bit, Sonar Platinum, TASCAM US-16x08, Cakewalk UM-3G MIDI I/F Instruments: SL-880 Keyboard controller, Korg 05R/W, Korg N1R, KORG Wavestation EX Axes: Fender Stratocaster, Line6 Variax 300, Ovation Acoustic, Takamine Nylon Acoustic, Behringer GX212 amp, Shure SM-58 mic, Rode NT1 condenser mic. Outboard: Mackie 1402-VLZ mixer, TC Helicon VoiceLive 2, Digitech Vocalist WS EX, PODXTLive, various stompboxes and stuff. Controllers: Korg nanoKONTROL, Wacom Bamboo Touchpad
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noynekker
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/20 23:18:02
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Can you adjust the latency of the soundcard up to say 512 samples, and it makes no difference ?
Are there any memory intensive plugins in this project ? What OS are you running ? How much ram ?
Cakewalk by Bandlab, Cubase, RME Babyface Pro, Intel i7 3770K @3.5Ghz, Asus P8Z77-VPro/Thunderbolt, 32GB DDR3 RAM, GeForce GTX 660 Ti, 250 GB OS SSD, 2TB HDD samples, Win 10 Pro 64 bit, backed up by Macrium Reflect, Novation Impulse 61 Midi Key Controller, Tannoy Active Near Field Monitors, Guitars by Vantage, Gibson, Yamaki and Ovation.
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wkujater
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/20 23:19:01
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I checked and there is only the various delta 1010 ins and outs. Just as an experiment I tried deselecting all but the delta 1010 outs 1 and 2 (turning off outs 3-8) and exporting again. Still no luck.
Thanks for the quick response though!
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wkujater
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/20 23:23:54
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Correct - I started with 256 samples, and as I came down it seemed to make no difference (oddly no crackles either). I just tried 512 and it seems the same. Arturia Mini V (not sure if its memory hog or not) - other than that - TTS1 and ~20 tracks of pure audio! Win7 4 GB ram. noynekker
Can you adjust the latency of the soundcard up to say 512 samples, and it makes no difference ?
Are there any memory intensive plugins in this project ? What OS are you running ? How much ram ?
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noynekker
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/20 23:39:31
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Are you using Sonar 64 bit, on Win 7 64 bit ? Or 32 bit system ?
4GB ram could be an issue, with many audio tracks, plugins, and the OS all running on 4GB.
Cakewalk by Bandlab, Cubase, RME Babyface Pro, Intel i7 3770K @3.5Ghz, Asus P8Z77-VPro/Thunderbolt, 32GB DDR3 RAM, GeForce GTX 660 Ti, 250 GB OS SSD, 2TB HDD samples, Win 10 Pro 64 bit, backed up by Macrium Reflect, Novation Impulse 61 Midi Key Controller, Tannoy Active Near Field Monitors, Guitars by Vantage, Gibson, Yamaki and Ovation.
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WDI
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/21 00:33:02
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Some plugins use delay compensation. If you have plugins on our audio tracks try bypassing them.
Sonar 7 PE Windows XP Pofessional (SP3) MSI K8N Neo4-F AMD Athlon 64 3500+ 2 GB PC 3200 Ram RME Fireface 800 Edirol FA-66 CM Labs MotorMix Old stuff: ARJO
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wkujater
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/21 21:36:57
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So oddly enough, when I add the soft synth as "Simple Instrument" it has the bad latency. I usually don't use this option as I want the more detailed control that the other options provide. In this case I just wanted to do a quick take to mirror an electric bass part (to see how bad its intonation was!) so thought simple instrument would be fine. So thanks to the last comment here I tried adding the instrument the way I normally do with "Midi Source" and "First Synth Audio Out" and tada - no latency - just like I'm used to on my system.
I looked at the original problematic track before deleting it, and it was not added as an audio track with soft synth inside. So not sure what the problem is but at least I have a solution!
Thanks all.
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wkujater
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/21 21:52:06
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Grrr.... spoke too soon. So latency is zero when first adding the synth. Either as simple instrument or not. Then play the session a few bars, and play synth - the latency is back.
I'm guessing software glitch at this point, since hardware and OS are same as they have been for a couple years now.
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WDI
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/22 00:38:14
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Sounds like plugin delay compensation. Try bypassing any plugins in the project. And I'm not talking about just the soft synth track. Any track that has plugins, turn them off and see if latency goes away.
post edited by WDI - 2013/03/22 00:44:48
Sonar 7 PE Windows XP Pofessional (SP3) MSI K8N Neo4-F AMD Athlon 64 3500+ 2 GB PC 3200 Ram RME Fireface 800 Edirol FA-66 CM Labs MotorMix Old stuff: ARJO
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robert_e_bone
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/22 08:19:08
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Hitting 'E' on your keyboard will bypass all effects, allowing you to test whether or not your latency is caused by one or more of them.
Bob Bone
Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!" Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22 Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64 Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms
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jb101
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/22 10:53:30
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I don't know the Mini V, but I wouldn't think that it would cause this issue.
Are you sure that there are no effects? The usual culprits in Sonar are the PC Concrete Limiter, LP-64 Multiband Compressor, LP-64 EQ and Perfect Space Reverb.
They are either look ahead (like the PC CL), or CPU intensive (like Perfect Space). I am sure this is what's causing your latency.
Check that there are none of these in FX bins or ProChannel of any tracks or busses, including the master.
As Bob said, press "E" on your QWERTY keyboard, or press the "FX" button in the Control Bar. If the latency disappears, then you know it's an effect. Track it down, and disable it whilst tracking.
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doriginal
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/22 14:23:42
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I have the mini v and the rest of the suite of Arturia plug ins. I have no issues but I also have 16 gigs of ram.
post edited by doriginal - 2013/03/25 11:10:16
Intel core i7 2600 3.4 GHz 64 Bit 16 GB of Memory, Sonar Platinum ,OS Windows 10 Professional, Sound Card: Komplete Audio 6, Controller: M-Audio Keystation Pro 88
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wkujater
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/24 18:27:41
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Thanks all. You're right. Perfect Space was the culprit. Once that is added to a project, the Mini V exhibits the latency. Fortunately just turning it off (don't have to delete it) - or hitting E as suggested made the latency go away. And I do only have 3 GB of ram. Odd though I did not have this problem with X1 - all else being the same.
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robert_e_bone
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/24 20:26:17
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Just sub out Perfect Space while you are tracking, and put it back in afterwards.
Bob Bone
Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!" Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22 Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64 Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms
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losguy
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Re:X2 soft synth latency issue
2013/03/25 17:14:08
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FWIW, the amount of RAM should have no effect on latency. If you run low on RAM (or out of it), you might experience dropouts, sure, but you'll experience a lot more than that along with it. 
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