sklathill
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Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
Basically, I've got a few minutes of improvised piano that I want to fit to measures so I can do further accompaniment on it. Using the Set Measure/Beat option. Very frustrating because my clips will get truncated randomly whenever I do this. It happens VERY consistently when undoing the Set Measure/Beat and it also happens sporadically when simply doing the Set Measure/Beat itself. Here are some videos showing what I'm looking at. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uffgoP86fAs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqRkGJ1vh-Y Personally, I'm a big fan of back in the day with DP, when I could just tap tempo to go along with my improv while it plays, but I guess this is the way to do things here? Would love it if there's a way to avoid this or if there's a far better way that I'm totally missing...
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chuckebaby
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 16:30:27
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dude, one word http://www.screencast.com/ I cant see pop up boxes or timeline detail. I watched about 3 minutes of the first one and closed it out. just make sure your opening the correct functions. not just the set time signatures. ps look at all the check boxes. and have you looked at in tempo view?
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jb101
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 17:01:46
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I've not used Set Measure/Beat much, but I will have a play around when I get a chance to see if I get the same behaviour.
I agree that the video is not of the best quality, but I could see enough to read the dialogue boxes (Set Measure/Beat) and all of their content. I could also see enough of the time line to tell what you were doing. It was good enough to problem shoot.
Like I said, I'll have a look when I get time and post back. Sorry I couldn't help straight away.
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 17:13:21
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chuckebaby
dude, one word
http://www.screencast.com/
I cant see pop up boxes or timeline detail.
I watched about 3 minutes of the first one and closed it out.
just make sure your opening the correct functions.
not just the set time signatures.
ps look at all the check boxes.
and have you looked at in tempo view?
If you wouldn't mind looking at it again, the stabilize function is now kicked in. Also, the second youtube video is only 40 seconds along. The only thing I'm doing is hitting Shift-M for the set measure/beat function. The only check box is the change meter check box. I sometimes use it. Using it or not doesn't have an effect on what I'm seeing. The tempos look like they're being set properly between where I'm setting the measure and the immediately preceding tempo change.
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jb101
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 17:37:11
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I guess I must have seen the updated video, then.
I'm off to have a look now.
Just one thought, was it only MIDI clips that this happens to you on? Simple inst tracks? I think I've only done it with audio tracks before, but will try it with MIDI now.
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chuckebaby
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 18:11:51
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im trying to determine why the wave track above the piano roll is moving when you hit undo.
im guessing this is because you have copied a piece in somewhere.
it may have been the point where I saw a pop up box in the corner out of site.you said:"saying im going to put this to beat 1 here ?"
if I saw the whole screen I may have known that.
sounds like this othr person here has a good idea though with what he has to work with.
I on the other hand, do not. (my bad I guess)
check your layers and it might even be worth scrolling all the way down the timline for your missing clip.
sorry and I do wish you the best with your problem.
good luck.
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jb101
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 18:21:25
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I just tried it with a simple inst. track, and I am getting the seriously lengthened clips you see, but not seen one disappear yet.
Ae you using MIDI or simple inst. tracks? I guess I could watch the video again to see..
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 18:25:20
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I'm using just MIDI. (it's one channel of my Kontakt which has a couple of instruments loaded.) There's no audio tracks anywhere. There's a few simple instrument tracks, but haven't messed with them (some RealGuitar stuff)
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jb101
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 18:28:52
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@chuckebaby - "this othr (sic) person here" - can't you even say my name any more, Charlie? 
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jb101
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 18:30:52
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sklathill
I'm using just MIDI. (it's one channel of my Kontakt which has a couple of instruments loaded.) There's no audio tracks anywhere. There's a few simple instrument tracks, but haven't messed with them (some RealGuitar stuff)
I'll have a go with a MIDI track, instead of a simple inst. track. Hopefully someone more experienced with this will chime in.
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chuckebaby
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 18:46:10
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jb101
@chuckebaby - "this othr (sic) person here" - can't you even say my name any more, Charlie?
I don't think what I said was out of line in anyway.
Windows 8.1 X64 Sonar Platinum x64 Custom built: Asrock z97 1150 - Intel I7 4790k - 16GB corsair DDR3 1600 - PNY SSD 220GBFocusrite Saffire 18I8 - Mackie Control
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 18:52:28
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chuckebaby
im trying to determine why the wave track above the piano roll is moving when you hit undo.
im guessing this is because you have copied a piece in somewhere.
it may have been the point where I saw a pop up box in the corner out of site.you said:"saying im going to put this to beat 1 here ?"
if I saw the whole screen I may have known that.
sounds like this othr person here has a good idea though with what he has to work with.
I on the other hand, do not. (my bad I guess)
check your layers and it might even be worth scrolling all the way down the timline for your missing clip.
sorry and I do wish you the best with your problem.
good luck.
Looks like there's nothing past the end of where I was working. Don't have any track layers going on either. I do vaguely remember a few iterations back (maybe 5-6 hours back of work) that there were other clips that were somehow made huge that I would then apply trimming to to get them back to normal. (I didn't realize it until I rendered stuff out and I was wondering why I had a 54 minute piece of music.) That hasn't happened since, but maybe that's related...
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jb101
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/09 19:12:35
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I'm definitely getting the elongated clips, but not seeing the shortened ones. The long ones seem to extend to the end of the project. I've heard of strange stuff extending beyond the length of the apparent end of a project. I'm not sure, but think there is sometimes an automation envelope out there that has caused this kind of fifty minute export thing. I often record prog rock, so that wouldn't seem out of the ordinary to me.  I'll still keep poking around with it, to see if I can find a solution.
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/10 02:55:46
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Finally brute forced my way through it... this section at least. Ended up just continuously alternating between Shift-M and extending the clip out. Every time I did it, it would just keep on shrinking, and it seemed like there was no recourse but to extend the crap out of it. I also tried extending the clip by many minutes before working on the Shift-M business, but it always seemed to trim itself really quickly. I tried again with a fresh project, but that worked as normal, so I guess there might be some spurious data somewhere that's making Sonar react weird. Just wish I could find what that is...
Thanks for the help...
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forkol
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/10 03:29:56
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sklathill
Would love it if there's a way to avoid this or if there's a far better way that I'm totally missing...
Is there a reason why you didn't try the Fit Improvisation feature?
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/10 14:12:58
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forkol
sklathill
Would love it if there's a way to avoid this or if there's a far better way that I'm totally missing...
Is there a reason why you didn't try the Fit Improvisation feature?
Well, I was doing a fair amount of meter changes, so I figure I'd just do that with my beat setting, and there's a lot of long sustained notes and rubato, so I wanted to be really precise. I suppose I could have done that, record a click track, then edit my notes around for that, then insert my meter changes. For some reason I had it in my head that set measure/beat would actually be faster with the type of stuff that I was doing, and I forgot to fall back to Fit Improvisation... :)
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/10 18:50:04
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And... I'm having very similar issues with Fit Improvisation as well. Actually worse, since it seems to be actually destroying my notes as opposed to just trimming my clips. Going to do the video thing again in a bit... EDIT: Okay, I figured this thing out, at least. Fit to Improvisation was working properly... but it was sending all that stuff back to measure 1, beat 1. So I guess the question now is: Can I do fit improvisation in the middle of an existing piece?
post edited by sklathill - 2013/04/10 19:02:52
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Boomboom24
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/10 18:58:32
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question?,, are you using session drummer 3??
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/10 19:16:06
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Nope, not using Session Drummer.
Synths I'm using:
WIVI
Kontakt
Synful
Miroslav Philharmonik
RealGuitar
ChromaPhone
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/11 21:05:54
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So... I'm still having trouble with this. Thanks to those who've replied so far.
I'm going to try calling tech support about this in the morning. Any of you guys think that would be futile?
Right now my basic thing to get around this is
1) Save a copy of the project
2) Open both the copy and the working project
3) Add new section of improv and do my set to measure/beat thing
4) copy stuff from the project copy into the working version to replace all the clips that get truncated.
It's pretty darn frustrating!
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chuckebaby
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/11 21:44:05
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calling tech support is a great idea.
they're actually very good and usually get right to the problem.
have your video ready for them (the link)
though I still think your shying yourself by not recording it using screencast.com
the whole purpose of that app is so you don't need to install some third party software to do video.
it doesn't hurt anything, the faster you want your issues solved, the cleaner the presentation.
your videos aren't the worst ive seen but they can not give an accurate documentation of your problem.
if you had posted a screen cast video to begin with, this may be solved right now.
I know people that see a video camera taping a monitor and click the red X instantly.
myself included because I cant give an accurate description and rather looking like a tool giving futile leads, id rather walk away.
like I said, not the worst taping ive seen, but like the track I thought was an audio track, it was a midi track.
little things like that, make it to complicated.
I do wish you the best and hope this gets sorted. calling TS is a good idea.
Windows 8.1 X64 Sonar Platinum x64 Custom built: Asrock z97 1150 - Intel I7 4790k - 16GB corsair DDR3 1600 - PNY SSD 220GBFocusrite Saffire 18I8 - Mackie Control
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/12 00:28:26
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/16 18:44:59
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Don't suppose any other ideas? I couldn't outlast the Bach hold music (the voice said my wait time was about 5 minutes, but I ended up going well over and meetings had to start...) and they haven't responded to my e-mail query.
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/04/30 17:47:45
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Bumping with another screencast! This one is very clear and has a very simple starting point: a project with nothing but a simple instrument track and one recorded clip of MIDI that I'm going to do Shift-M to for a few minutes. You can very clearly see (I hope!) the notes go away with this... http://sklathill.gotdns.org/random/beattest3.htm Anyone?
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Razorwit
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/05/01 16:23:08
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Hi sklathill,
I actually noticed this same behavior yesterday. I was doing exactly what you were doing (set measure/beat at now) and was seeing the MIDI clip truncating and actually splitting seemingly randomly.
Did you talk to TS about this?
Dean
Intel Core i7; 32GB RAM; Win10 Pro x64;RME HDSPe MADI FX; Orion 32 and Lynx Aurora 16; Mics and other stuff...
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Jackdied
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/05/01 17:07:44
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Razorwit
Hi sklathill,
I actually noticed this same behavior yesterday. I was doing exactly what you were doing (set measure/beat at now) and was seeing the MIDI clip truncating and actually splitting seemingly randomly.
Did you talk to TS about this?
Dean
same here...
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sklathill
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Re:Issues with Set Measure / Beat in Sonar X2 messing with my clips
2013/05/03 01:39:43
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Calling TS didn't work but I'm in the middle of some e-mail back and forth with them. The latest response isn't making me happy though...
"I have reviewed your videos with some other tech support agents and it doesn't seem like there is any unusual behavior happening. The clips are moving further towards the area that you are editing, they are not disappearing. You have a note mentioning that they are disappearing from the the PRV but the clip is just compressing in size. Do you have any other videos showing clips getting removed?"
...and I'm thinking... really? That's considered working as designed? Maybe there's something confusing there, or maybe they're referring to one of the other videos, but that's a frustrating turn...
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