Helpful ReplyAnyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output...

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Calkwalker
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2013/05/28 22:05:39 (permalink)

Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output...

I just upgraded to X2 Producer (from X1 Producer) and am looking to see if the guitar tablature on the Staff View is working any better than before.
 
It's still outputting wrong fingerings.
 
I record one MIDI track per string (via MIDI Channels 1-6, from a guitar-to-MIDI converter).  To produce standard notation and guitar tab, I copy and paste the MIDI note contents of each of these 6 tracks to a consolidated MIDI track.  I then select the consolidated track in Staff View. 
 
The standard notation looks good (other than being an octave lower than the longstanding convention for notating guitar music).  
 
However, when I check "Display Tablature" on the Staff View Layout panel, the tablature shows the majority of notes on the correct string, but a significant number of notes on the wrong string.  The actual notes are correct, but the string is wrong (e.g., an A note is depicted correctly on the 7th fret of the D string, but in the next measure, is shown incorrectly on the 2nd fret of the G string. 
 
I've double-checked the 6 individual MIDI tracks, and all notes are represented correctly there.  If I output individual standard notation and tablature for the 6 tracks, everything is good (but of course, unusable in such a fragmented, per-string output).
 
It seems that SONAR is getting confused when the notes from multiple MIDI tracks are combined.  It doesn't matter whether I select 'float', 'fixed' or 'MIDI Channel' as the "method," the errors are the same.
 
Any ideas welcome.
 
post edited by Calkwalker - 2013/05/29 15:06:20
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    Calkwalker
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/29 15:12:03 (permalink)
    BUMP.  Is no one on this board using guitar tab?

    As mentioned, for standard notation there is apparently no option in X2 to indicate that the notes should be raised an octave for guitar, but I'm getting around that problem by cloning the consolidated MIDI track and transposing it up an octave.

    The guitar tab issue is the bigger problem - if I can't find a solution, I'm going to have to edit the output text files manually to fix the errors...
    #2
    Calkwalker
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 13:27:06 (permalink) ☄ Helpful
    Although there is apparently scant audience for this topic, I'm updating this thread to document that I discovered out how to get the tab working properly. 

    It seems that when making changes to tablature 'Preset' definitions, you have to close and reopen Staff View, select the entire MIDI track being displayed, and execute the Edit > Regenerate Tab function to update the tablature output.

    I had not done this, and was therefore looking at "stale" tab based on a previously-selected, default Preset definition.

    It is highly recommended to read pages 1097-1101 (and 1743, 1762) of the SONAR_X2_Reference_Guide.pdf to fully understand the tablature function.
     
    MORE TIPS FOR TABLATURE EXPORT:
     
    - If consolidating MIDI tracks to produce consolidated guitar tab, make sure that your input MIDI tracks are all assigned to a MIDI channel, so that the tab export generator will know the channel (i.e., string) of each note in the consolidated track.  Make sure that those (consecutive) channels match the MIDI channels defined in the tab "Preset" declared on the Staff View Layout, Tablature Settings panel.
     
    - SONAR's tab export program cannot handle multiple clips in the MIDI track; the presence of multiple clips will produce spurious "MIDI note out of range" errors and erroneous output in the export tab file.  If you have multiple clips in the track, such as from comp editing, you must execute "Bounce to Clip(s)" on your MIDI track(s) before executing "Export to ASCII Tab."  This is an undocumented requirement!!!
     
    post edited by Calkwalker - 2013/06/02 12:41:37
    #3
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 13:45:48 (permalink)


    Thanks for the follow up.

    best regards,
    mike


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    spacey
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 14:24:18 (permalink)
    Calkwalker


    BUMP.  Is no one on this board using guitar tab?

    As mentioned, for standard notation there is apparently no option in X2 to indicate that the notes should be raised an octave for guitar, but I'm getting around that problem by cloning the consolidated MIDI track and transposing it up an octave.

    The guitar tab issue is the bigger problem - if I can't find a solution, I'm going to have to edit the output text files manually to fix the errors...

    Sure there is-In the "Staff View" - "Edit"> "layout"> in the "Staff View Layout" select "Preset" and then "Standard 6 String Guitar TRANSPOSE".
    I have X2a...maybe choice wasn't there for X2?
    #5
    Calkwalker
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 15:50:33 (permalink)
    spacey, the Staff View Layout panel controls two representations:  standard musical notation (staff) and guitar tablature.  The "Preset" dropdown list is in the Tablature section of the panel.  From everything I've seen and read, the Preset setting only controls how the guitar tablature is represented, not the standard notation.

    Having said that, my "Preset" dropdown list does not have an element called "Standard 6 String Guitar TRANSPOSE."  It does have an element called "Guitar - Standard 6 String."  However, that element, like all the Preset elements in my dropdown list, only affects the tab display, not the staff display.

    #6
    chuckebaby
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 17:57:10 (permalink)
    x2A ?

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    #7
    spacey
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 18:26:55 (permalink)
    Calkwalker


    spacey, the Staff View Layout panel controls two representations:  standard musical notation (staff) and guitar tablature.  The "Preset" dropdown list is in the Tablature section of the panel.  From everything I've seen and read, the Preset setting only controls how the guitar tablature is represented, not the standard notation.

    Having said that, my "Preset" dropdown list does not have an element called "Standard 6 String Guitar TRANSPOSE."  It does have an element called "Guitar - Standard 6 String."  However, that element, like all the Preset elements in my dropdown list, only affects the tab display, not the staff display.

    X2a has "Standard 6 String Guitar Transpose" and effects the staff display but as before, I don't know what you're using and X2 might not have
    it.
     
     
    #8
    Calkwalker
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 18:28:39 (permalink)
    I have applied the X2a Producer patch and the behavior is exactly the same as previously described - tab presets don't affect the staff display.

    I still don't see a preset called "Standard 6 String Guitar TRANSPOSE" - I assume that spacey created that as a custom preset. 

    To experiment, I went into Tablature Settings, pushed all the open string values up an octave, and created a custom preset called "Guitar +8va." When I applied it, the tab display values all went up by 12 frets as expected (at least to the max fret value of 24, beyond which no tab number is displayed), but the staff display remained unchanged, as expected.
     
    spacey - please confirm that you're talking about the Preset dropdown list in the Staff View Layout panel, and not something else.  I'm on X2a and see no such element in that dropdown list.
     
    #9
    spacey
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 18:39:08 (permalink)




    You assumed wrong...I'm lucky to get a computer turned on more less get X2a working...lol....I don't use notation either but just so happened I knew about this...on mine anyway.

    You can see the little open E on the first string is just exactly where it should be on the staff. The menu doesn't show " transpose" completely but enough that I knew what it was.
    There is a possiblity that I made the preset...I went deep into the program when it came out but to many issues with it for me to continue using it.
     
     
    post edited by spacey - 2013/05/30 18:46:01
    #10
    scook
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 18:51:03 (permalink)
    I only have installed X1d Expanded and X2a Producer on my current machine. It only has three presets. Here is the preset registry export:

    Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00

    [HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Cakewalk Music Software\SONAR Producer\X2\Presets\{D6E03380-E062-11D2-89BC-006008C4F4C8}]
    "Guitar - Standard 6 String"=hex:03,00,02,00,00,00,03,00,04,00,00,00,03,00,00,\ 00,00,00,03,00,0b,00,00,00,0b,00,00,00,03,00,15,00,00,00,03,00,06,00,00,00,\ 03,00,40,00,00,00,03,00,3b,00,00,00,03,00,37,00,00,00,03,00,32,00,00,00,03,\ 00,2d,00,00,00,03,00,28,00,00,00,03,00,00,00,00,00,03,00,00,00,00,00,bc,f8,\ d8,00
    "Bass - Standard 4 String"=hex:03,00,02,00,00,00,03,00,04,00,00,00,03,00,00,00,\ 00,00,03,00,0b,00,00,00,0b,00,00,00,03,00,15,00,00,00,03,00,04,00,00,00,03,\ 00,2b,00,00,00,03,00,26,00,00,00,03,00,21,00,00,00,03,00,1c,00,00,00,03,00,\ 1c,00,00,00,03,00,1c,00,00,00,03,00,1c,00,00,00,03,00,1c,00,00,00
    "MIDI Guitar (Chan 11-16) "=hex:03,00,03,00,00,00,03,00,04,00,00,00,03,00,00,\ 00,00,00,03,00,0b,00,00,00,0b,00,00,00,03,00,15,00,00,00,03,00,06,00,00,00,\ 03,00,40,00,00,00,03,00,3b,00,00,00,03,00,37,00,00,00,03,00,32,00,00,00,03,\ 00,2d,00,00,00,03,00,28,00,00,00,03,00,00,00,00,00,03,00,00,00,00,00


    #11
    Calkwalker
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    Re:Anyone working with SONAR guitar tablature? I'm not getting valid output... 2013/05/30 19:11:43 (permalink)
    spacey

    ... There is a possiblity that I made the preset...I went deep into the program when it came out but to many issues with it for me to continue using it. 
    It looks like you have something rather custom there; something that contradicts the Reference Guide.
     
    scook's post, with registry entries for three default tab presets, is essentially what I have (minus the custom tunings I have added), which would seem to corroborate that.

    #12
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