Robert Morin
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mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
Hi:
I'm mastering a 45 minute piece of music and would like to be able to analyze or see the how the volume of the piece changes throughout its entire duration. Is there a application within sonar X1 that will do this?
Thanks for the help.
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gswitz
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/27 21:43:29
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☄ Helpfulby HansH 2013/07/28 13:56:20
The only real graphical image over time in Sonar is the wave form itself which you can see in the wave form. This is not the same as 3D analytic tools that give a spectral analysis over time in a 3D representation. There are lots of products that do this, but Sonar doesn't have any built in tools for this purpose. It does have an Analyst spectral analyzer but it doesn't show a graph over time. You might try this... http://spek.cc/ Volume can be measured by frequency... that's why I'm recommending a spectral analyzer.
StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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robert_e_bone
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 06:23:55
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Wouldn't a Sonogram accomplish this? That shows:
Frequency vertically
Time going sideways
Amplitude is shown by color
Timbre is represented by a series of additional lines above the fundamental frequency, for the partials
If you go to downloads.com (run by CNET magazine), and search for Sonogram, then check the box for 'Free' you get back 12 results, and maybe one or more of these tools would give you what you seek.
Please note that while anything coming from the CNET site is guaranteed virus free, the install process DOES try to sneak in extra software - that's how they pay the bills, I suppose. SO, when installing from software downloaded from their site, it uses an installer that ALMOST ALWAYS has checked boxes for 'yes I would love your unwanted software'. MAKE SURE you remove any such checks or you will have extra stuff isntalled on your computer.
Once you DO remove the check boxes, you are generally good to go, but you STILL should watch the install process, just to make sure there are not similar things during install.
Bob Bone
Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!" Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22 Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64 Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms
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Chregg
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 06:47:31
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gswitz
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 07:03:49
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I think we both just recommended the same thing, except you gave him more choices, Bob. :-) Great minds, you know. :-) My suggestion has GNU Public License, but I didn't see the timbre marks that Bob was mentioning. I want to add that I own the Melda Production M-AutoAlign and I love it. So +1 for Melda Production software. I think I'll download this MAnalyzer myself, Chregg. Thanks for the link.
post edited by gswitz - 2013/07/28 07:12:26
StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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Jeff Evans
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 08:38:32
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Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz - 8 Gb RAM - Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME PCI HDSP9632 - Steinberg Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 8- Studio One V4 - iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - Sierra 10.12.6 - Focusrite Clarett thunderbolt interface Poor minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas -Eleanor Roosevelt
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 08:52:12
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"Wouldn't a Sonogram accomplish this?"
Yes, sort of... you'll want to look at the subset of sonograms known as spectrograms, and to do so you'll want a tool known as a spectrograph.
I enjoy using the Nugen Visualizer spectrograph and the Adobe Audition spectrograph.
best regards,
mike
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 08:56:12
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Robert Morin
Hi:
I'm mastering a 45 minute piece of music and would like to be able to analyze or see the how the volume of the piece changes throughout its entire duration. Is there a application within sonar X1 that will do this?
Thanks for the help.
If you are just interested in "volume" rather than "loudness" you can simply look at the waveform display of the mix. It is a volume graph. One thing I really like about SONAR is the little switch that lets you display the wave form graph of the master bus during playback. That feature is 5 star! I forget what the official name of that switch/choice/command is... can someone suggest the proper name for it? best regards, mike
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gswitz
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 09:10:49
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Mike, you are always full of good useful info. Is it called wave form preview?
StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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robert_e_bone
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 09:18:13
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@gswitz - you were quite correct. I had not noticed the link in your post above.
And Mike, you were SPOT ON with taking it further with explaining the subset of spectrograms, displayed using a spectrograph.
To the original poster, I hope some of this can assist you with what you are seeking.
Bob Bone
Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!" Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22 Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64 Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms
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bitflipper
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 10:38:34
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☄ Helpfulby robert_e_bone 2013/07/28 11:27:19
I gather you're looking for something that analyzes loudness changes through the duration of the song, as opposed to a single number or a moment-to-moment display. Something like they used for this article. I use Adobe Audition for most of my own objective measurements. It has a useful histogram that gives me any idea of how squashed my song is. However, it can be misleading when there is a wide dynamic range over different parts of the song, i.e. very quiet parts and/or very loud parts. The quiet parts may indeed be too quiet, or the loud parts may indeed be too loud, but the statistics average them out and say all's well. Mostly, I rely on visual inspection of the waveform. Over the years I've developed a pretty good eye for what's too dynamic and what's not dynamic enough. I have also used the TT Dynamic Range meter, which can report on an entire folder of songs, but which also suffers from the same problem described above. It's quick and easy, and comes in two versions: a plugin for realtime analysis and a standalone executable for batch analysis. Problem is, the developers decided they could make money with it so it's no longer free and requires a "donation" of (last time I checked) $45. But with some creative googling you should be able to locate a copy of the older free version. Here's a tool that would probably do the job: NuGen Audio Loudness Management Batch Processor. This utility intrigues me, but at $1,000 I don't think I'll be investing in it any time soon. Your best bet may be Toscanalyzer. It can analyze and report on multiple audio files, making it helpful for determining how similar a collection of songs, e.g. an album, is. Or comparing your own material to your favorite commercial references. It's also the only tool I know of (besides the pricey NuGen product) that graphs loudness moment-to-moment. And here's the best part: it's free. (Edit for spelling. Yes, even I, the annoying self-appointed spelling cop, occasionally mis-spell something.)
post edited by bitflipper - 2013/07/28 10:44:49
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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robert_e_bone
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Re: mastering - analyzing volume of whole piece
2013/07/28 11:27:12
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@bitflipper - GREAT info there.
(Edit for spelling. Yes, even I, the annoying self-appointed spelling cop, occasionally mis-spell something.)
I know this will come back to haunt me - Didn't you mean 'Edited' for spelling? hmmmm? (I really, really tried to restrain myself, and in the end could not help myself, nana nana boo boo). :)
Happy Sunday - again, lots of good info in your post. I will check out the links you provided, as well - thanks.
Bob Bone
Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!" Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22 Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64 Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms
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