Console Emulation Question??

Ok, I'm digging the console emulation in X2 and yes def worth the 50 buck upgrade I paid late last month but I've been digging around...researching the best way to use it and here is the problem.  In the manual it says to put the console emulation as the 1st module, this is the way I just used it with the last track I just mixed (and I must say, it is a real eye opener, a very musical sound as they say).  But on twitter this morn, The Cake put up a link to a Craig Anderton video and the way he used it was as the last module in the chain.  Now my belief is the 1st way is the correct way, although there is technically no right or wrong way but def if we were mixing there would be very few times that the channel/console sound would be the last thing the audio goes through, this is because you would feed the signal into the console, then it would go through the on board compressor/EQ then out to outboard effects.
 
Any opinions on this??
 
Ben

http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/2674561

I'm stupid and I just thought about something.... in the ProChannel, does the chain go top to bottom or bottom to top?

Learn How To Use The Console Emulator by Craig Anderton just came out on the Cakewalk Blog today as a YouTube demo video. Craig explains everything really well in this video. Basically, it is last in his chain. That is the way I have used it from day one and I really like the results of the CE done this way. Set the CE first and mix into it.

I do the same on the Master Bus JB, don't want to take the chance of any overs.

I've never worked off a real console so maybe this is a dumb question, but normally wouldn't all signal come into the console and pass through it? Wouldn't that put it last in the signal chain (at the bottom) of the PC? I guess that is why last made more sense to me. I know I like the effect much better in the final position, when you play with the drive knob, your driving the entire signal.

Yes there have been many threads on this. I guess it really just comes down to what sounds best to the individual.

According to the developers of the CE, it mainly emulates the "summing part" of a console, hence they suggest to use it at the end.
 
Off course, we can put it anywhere we like, experiment etc.  But, in all the Cakewalk presets it is at the end, it is at the end of the default ProChannel, Noel (Cake's CTO) suggests to put it last, as does Craig A.  Seth and Brandon used it last in all the Webinars, etc., etc.

Hi all,CE mimics the Large Console......in a mixer the input is at begin af the chain,then CE should be at the last couse the drive is the "fader" of console.
Simply speaking 
Best

I remember that discrepancy in methods back when I first started fiddling with it... however you have to consider WHY you might put it at the end of the signal chain of a PC strip. If you were using an external tube pre or compressor in a hardware situation you'd likely have that BEFORE the board, nest'ce pas? It could also be looked at from the angle of how a board with internal compression/EQ and the like handles an input. Like will the signal go through the EQ section BEFORE it starts humming around inside the board? Where exactly would sound the CE creates actually come from within a hardware board?
 
So you might want to look at the ProChannel itself a little differently. What modules would you consider to be something you'd use as an external pre-input effect, what would you consider to be an onboard effect (and where would it sit in the signal chain within the board) and finally what would you consider to be effects that are being fed by the output of the board.
 
Obviously it doesn't need to be overly complex but once I started looking at the CE in those terms I found I could manipulate it more logically and get better results. I personally use it in kind of non standard ways anyway. Like on some tracks I find it sounds really good but on others it kind of sucks the life out the sound or makes it seem lo-fi while other times there doesn't seem to be any difference at all. So instead of throwing it on all the channels at the start I'll get a rough mix together then try it out solo'd on each track and then in the mix. Sometimes I'll even mix and match. Then I'll do the finer mixing with the modules in place.
 
Also putting the CE at different points in the PC chain can have some very different results especially with compressors and tube modules in play. Actually screwing around with how it's placed in relation to the FX bin loaded up with some heavy duty distortion or other really noticeable effects gives a pretty good example of what happens when you drive the CE with the signal as opposed to just turning the CE drive knob.
 
I have even tried doubling up the CE on certain channels or buses which can be interesting. I guess that could be looked at like tracking with one type of board then mixing through another. Many many possibilities.
 
Other people however say they can't hear it doing anything... so maybe I'm just crazy. lol

I hope that you trust him......
 
http://blog.cakewalk.com/...-in-sonar-x2-producer/

There's Craig's blog that I received on Facebook yesterday.  I have not found a good way to post links or do quotes from my iPad, it does n't seem to open up the full version reply very well.
 
I think one of the most important things that Craig states in this video, and I have heard the Bakers say this as well, is that you mix into the console, instead of adding it later.  It makes a big difference to me, because you are making compression, EQ and effects decisions based on how the signal is passing through the CE.  The reason I was understanding that it works best in the last position is because it was stated at one point that it was a summing effect that was being emulated.  Therefore, in my mind, everything that you wanted to sum, would have to pass through it.
 
On the Master, it make sense to me that your Limiter would be the last plug in the signal chain; for those that Master all in the same session of song.  If you pull it into another Mastering Program to do your mastering, then everything would already be summed in your wav file before you add any last position limiting anyway.  

I guess the one thing about "mixing into" the CE though is that'll it will lead you to make different decisions/adjustments as you mix. Therefore your mix might end up sound more vintage because you are making adjustments similar to ones you would on a hardware console.
 
I think it's a really interesting effect with far more depth in regards to application than meets the eye. I don't know why it fascinates me so much but it just does. I'm weird. ;-)

Anyone noticed that the API emulation can introduce an "digital aliasing" type distortion on some sources?

SvenArne
Anyone noticed that the API emulation can introduce an "digital aliasing" type distortion on some sources?

I'm not sure what that means but I have experienced some "odd" effects at times. Like the signal is breaking up. I definitely do not use it on tracks where that is happening.

@Bandso... Yeah, the tape sim makes sense. I was about to say Isn't that more for Master bus to emulate stereo out type thing but then remembered the multitrack tape aspect of old studios. Frankly I never really understood tape stuff. Too confusing for my peabrain and I'm glad I don't have to deal with it. I'll probably have to learn though if I intend to understand tape sims. Just haven't had the chance yet.