Hardware Synth Midi to Audio Latency (Resolved)

Update:
Turning on Transmit MIDI Clock resolved the MIDI latency issue with the Fantom.
Removing UAD-1 card, plugins, and drivers resolved a lot of audio latency issues.
 
I've had this problem for a while and I'm wondering if there is a way to fix it. I have a Roland Fantom X6 synth that I use for some of my sounds. I also use it a lot when working parts out. The problem I'm having is that when I use it to record an audio track from a midi track, the recorded audio is almost a 16th note behind the beat at 128.
Routing: Sonar midi -> USB ->Fantom -> Audio Out -> Sonar
Is there a tweak in Sonar I can use to tell it to send midi out early for tracks that use the Fantom so the audio lines up when recorded? Is there any way I can get the midi and audio to match up or do I have to always tweak it manually after the fact? It appears to only happen with the hardware synth, all the soft synths work fine.

+1
 
Each system with have its own "happy medium" for performance. I threw in a "Tailoring DAW buffers" at the end of this post.

Dave makes a good point that audio latency should be dialed in first with a Manual Offset in addition to the automatic compensation that SONAr does (not to be confused with Timing Offset that alters the relationship between MIDI and audio), either by re-recording an audio track to check sample alignment or by using a tool like the free CEntrance Latency Tester to measure the actual latency vs. the latency reported to SONAR by the audio driver. But that error is nothing like what the OP is reporting in this case - usually less than 44 samples = 1ms at 44kHz. Whereas a musical 16th is over 5500 samples at 120BPM.
 
But I would set the Manual Offset where it needs to be to compensate normal audio recording latency and do correction for MIDI transmission/response/sync issues by other means.
 
 
 
 

Hmmm... something not making sense, That big timing offset should be making audio from the keyboard earlier relative to soft synths and audio, which was the goal. If that's not improved, what is? In any case, that big Manual Offset is going to cause all kinds of weirdness in different scenarios so you;re not going to want to leave it that way. It was meant to deal with the usual MIDI-Audio offsets on the order of 3-6ms.
 
You'll definitely want to look into the latency/dropout issue. As you can see from my signature. I run a MOTU 2408 with PCIe424 , and it can play pretty heavy projects (like the Cakewalk demos with all synths and FX unfrozen) with the buffer at 256, and all my usual stuff at 128. Have you run DPC Latency Checker or LatencyMon to check for spikes in Deferred Procedure Call times?
 
The real-time performance latency you're getting is due to a combination of MIDI transmission/response delay and audio latency. But you should be able to get the total down to about 10ms (playing the Fantom by echoed MIDI), which is quite tolerable, and soft synths will be better because they're only subject to inbound MIDI delay and outbound audio latency.
 
In addition to getting your buffer down, I think you need to do some simultaneous MIDI-Audio record tests from the Fantom - first with Local Control On, and then by echoed MIDI. And also maybe a MIDI and metronome loopback recordings to figure out where the delays and sync errors are. The more you understand about all the sources of delays in you system and the smaller you can make all of them, the better off you'll be. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

So if you record simultaneous audio and MIDI from the Fantom to a click with no Timing Offset in place, the MIDI timing is good but the audio lays down 97ms late? Or only if you record audio from existing MIDI playback?

Ah. So all this time the Fantom was being driven by internal MIDI patterns? Glad you got it figured.

Thanks guys. This is a really good trouble shooting guide for these kind of latency issues. Should be put in the Cakewalk resource files.