Helpful ReplyAudioSnap Questions

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RA1222
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2013/12/21 02:06:35 (permalink)

AudioSnap Questions

I just recorded the drum part to a couple of songs.  I recorded the drums using six mics so I've got six drum tracks.  What I would like to to is, for an example, move (let's say) an early snare drum hit to the appropriate time.  I thought AudioSnap would be the answer to that, making it an easier task.  I figured, in theory, the snare drum hits would be marked with transient markers.  I could highlight the snare drum hit in all six tracks and nudge them over using the transient marker in AudioSnap.  First question, could this be done?
 
Secondly, how do I get into AudioSnap?  I know if I press "A", I get the palette but doesn't seem to do anything.  There are no transients which show up in my selected clips.  I keep reading in the manual, "1. Select the Smart Tool in the Control Bar.  2. Assign the track's Edit Filter control to Audio Transients."  Well, that's fine.  Where on earth is the "Edit Filter control"?  It seems I checked every menu and I am unable to find it.
 
Incidentally, I checked the video posted on Cakewalk University but the version being shown is an older version which had a button for AudioSnap.  X3 doesn't seem to have one.
 
I checked Sonar X2 Power because I have a copy and AudioSnap doesn't show in the index.  It may be in there.  I thumbed through the book and I might have missed it as there are bunches of pages.
 
The first two songs of the project on which I am working was not done with a click so there is some natural fluctuation within the tempo.  I made the mistake of setting a tempo on the third song which through a bunch of clips off in the first two songs.  So, I am a little nervous about setting any kind of tempo at this point.  I have poured many hours into this project and do not want to risk getting my clips rearranged due setting a tempo.  Hopefully, the way I want to use AudioSnap will not have any affect.
 
Thanks

Was still a very green Sonar 8 Producer Edition user when graduating to a very green Sonar X1 Expanded user.  Now, upgraded to Sonar X3c from X2 (but never had the time to get proficient with it.)
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#1
RA1222
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 02:13:52 (permalink)
I may want to enhance the kick drum using a soft synth (MIDI).  I've heard this could be done so if someone give me some ideas on how to do that, that would be totally way awesome.   :-)

Was still a very green Sonar 8 Producer Edition user when graduating to a very green Sonar X1 Expanded user.  Now, upgraded to Sonar X3c from X2 (but never had the time to get proficient with it.)
Cakewalk V-Studio 700 and with VS-700R.    
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#2
dubdisciple
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 02:18:29 (permalink)
This may help with drum replacement:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6JXbnuBnU0#t=10
#3
dubdisciple
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 02:36:29 (permalink)
I just re-read and realized you watched the basic video already.  In X3, if you go the the dropdown window in track view panel where it says "clips" you can change to transient view.  hitting the A should bring up the pallete
#4
RA1222
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 02:38:49 (permalink)
Thanks dubdisciple.  That's exactly what I was looking for regarding the kick enhancement.   The guy in the video talked about moving the MIDI notes if one was off (an early hit).  Will that shift the audio?  I guess, it really wouldn't matter if the original audio was muted.  However, if I've got bleed from the kick in the overheads, snare or toms mics, that could be an issue.

Was still a very green Sonar 8 Producer Edition user when graduating to a very green Sonar X1 Expanded user.  Now, upgraded to Sonar X3c from X2 (but never had the time to get proficient with it.)
Cakewalk V-Studio 700 and with VS-700R.    
System:  Windows 7  
Computer:  Intel(R) Core (TM) 2 Quad CPU; Q6600 @ 2.4 GHz 
2.99 GHz, 8.00 GB of Ram  

 



#5
dubdisciple
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 02:41:27 (permalink)
Also, you may find this helpful for drum replacement since you have X3:
 
http://blog.cakewalk.com/...ictive-drums-producer/
 
I find replacing drums easir to do with melodyne than audisnap.  Compare methods
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dubdisciple
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 02:45:54 (permalink)
The way i handle bleed  is usually by combining filtering /EQ and gate.  I duplicate track so i can totally butcher it to ge tthe kind of signal I need.i believe it is handled in the blog post on melodyne but could easily apply to audiosnape is to make sure you clean up signal using whatever method gets you the cleanest sound.  it does not have to sound good.  just be solid and clean. to create a good midi note. 
#7
RA1222
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 15:43:41 (permalink)
Thanks for the input.  I really appreciate it.
 
Once I am able to see the transients on multiple tracks, will I able to highlight transients representing the same "hit" and nudge them simultaneously?

Was still a very green Sonar 8 Producer Edition user when graduating to a very green Sonar X1 Expanded user.  Now, upgraded to Sonar X3c from X2 (but never had the time to get proficient with it.)
Cakewalk V-Studio 700 and with VS-700R.    
System:  Windows 7  
Computer:  Intel(R) Core (TM) 2 Quad CPU; Q6600 @ 2.4 GHz 
2.99 GHz, 8.00 GB of Ram  

 



#8
RA1222
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 15:51:01 (permalink)
In regards to the video, it shows the AudioSnap palette has a button to activate the transients.  My version of Sonar does not show that particular button on the palette.  So, I am back to wondering how I may get the transients to be shown in the tracks or clips. 
 
I keep reading in the manual, "1. Select the Smart Tool in the Control Bar.  2. Assign the track's Edit Filter control to Audio Transients."  Well, that's fine.  Where on earth is the "Edit Filter control"?  It seems I checked every menu and I am unable to find it.
post edited by RA1222 - 2013/12/21 15:58:53

Was still a very green Sonar 8 Producer Edition user when graduating to a very green Sonar X1 Expanded user.  Now, upgraded to Sonar X3c from X2 (but never had the time to get proficient with it.)
Cakewalk V-Studio 700 and with VS-700R.    
System:  Windows 7  
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#9
garry
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 16:06:58 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby gcolbert 2013/12/21 16:24:44
As it turns out, I've spent the whole day enhancing drum tracks for my band's album project. I only have three drum tracks to work with: kick (mono), snare (mono), and stereo toms/OHs. My goal is to layer kick and snare samples along with the original tracks, not full replacement.
 
Once you change the little dropdown menu from "Clips" to "Audio Transients" you'll see the markers. In my experience, most will be pretty good, but dozens per song will be so early that you'll hear a flam (Sample followed by audio clip).
 
My solution is to painstakingly go through every drum hit on the track (zoom WAY in) and verify that the transient marker is exactly at the start of the beat. It's tedious work, but the end result is worth it.
 
I also find that light hits on the snare drum aren't getting marked, but if I lower the threshold, it triggers on bleed from the high hat and first rack tom. So I also have to make sure every light hit is triggered as well (right click on the diamond and de-select "Disable").
 
Once I am happy that all my transient markers for a track are correct, I click on the clip, and press the A key to show the AudioSnap window. I display the Properties to let me choose which MIDI note I want to create (usually C3 for kick, D3 for snare). I also set the velocity vary with the volume.
 
Next I create an empty MIDI track to hold the data. Then back to the AudioSnap window to click the Copy to MIDI button, press shift-G to line up the insert point, create a MIDI track to insert the data to, then ctrl-V to paste the MIDI data into the track.
 
Finally create an audio track, insert your drum soft synth of choice, and connect the MIDI track to it. Personally, I'm liking the "Classic Rock" kit in Session Drummer for kick and the SI "Hall Kit" snare for snare. Blend the sample with the audio to taste.
 
We recorded to a click, but you can still feel the drummers tempo vary a little or have a slightly off hit. I haven't tried fixing those (yet), but snipping the bad hit into its own clip and moving it a tiny bit has worked in the past. The trick is to hope that you don't notice any glitches in the overheads from the bleed.
 
Oh, in response to your question, here is how you turn Audio Transients on:
 

 
post edited by garry - 2013/12/21 16:15:20
#10
RA1222
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Re: AudioSnap Questions 2013/12/21 16:26:40 (permalink)
Wow.  Thanks Garry.  That was very helpful.  Now, I feel I can start making some headway.  
 
I checked everywhere for the "edit filter" but missed that little drop down right there in the track view.  Duh on me.

Was still a very green Sonar 8 Producer Edition user when graduating to a very green Sonar X1 Expanded user.  Now, upgraded to Sonar X3c from X2 (but never had the time to get proficient with it.)
Cakewalk V-Studio 700 and with VS-700R.    
System:  Windows 7  
Computer:  Intel(R) Core (TM) 2 Quad CPU; Q6600 @ 2.4 GHz 
2.99 GHz, 8.00 GB of Ram  

 



#11
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