Splitting Clips Doesn't Work

Author
konradh
Max Output Level: -42 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3325
  • Joined: 2006/01/16 16:07:06
  • Status: offline
2014/01/05 19:19:32 (permalink)

Splitting Clips Doesn't Work

As I mentioned in an earlier thread, sometimes certain functions suddenly stop working.  Case in point: Split Clips.
 
I was editing a vocal today and splitting clips tso I could zero in on a pop.  I edited several clips successfully.  Suddenly, the split tool stopped acting like a split tool and started acting like a cursor.  Clicking on a clip would not split the clip anymore.  Double-clicking with the split tool would open Loop Construction.
 
The only fix is a complete reboot of Sonar (not just a reload of the project).
 
It is hard to believe this doesn't happen to others.  Anyone experience this?
 
Note that other functions like Cut, Copy, and Paste sometimes stop working as well.
 
Thanks.

Konrad
Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/

Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka.  Rokit 6s. 
#1

28 Replies Related Threads

    gswitz
    Max Output Level: -18.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 5694
    • Joined: 2007/06/16 07:17:14
    • Location: Richmond Virginia USA
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/05 19:23:24 (permalink)
    Make sure the focus is on the clip not an envelope. Shift click on the clip header until it takes the focus. Alternatively change the selection on the track header drop down to clip.

    StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen.
    I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
    #2
    konradh
    Max Output Level: -42 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 3325
    • Joined: 2006/01/16 16:07:06
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/05 21:29:42 (permalink)
    Thanks, but to clarify, what happened today: split a clip, split the same clip in another spot, split the same clip in another spot, try to split the same clip in another spot and it doesn't work.  Now the scissors won't work anywhere.
     
    Reboot Sonar and go back to the same clip and split works again.

    Konrad
    Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/

    Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka.  Rokit 6s. 
    #3
    Anderton
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 14070
    • Joined: 2003/11/06 14:02:03
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/05 21:31:37 (permalink)
    I've had this happen if I'm using the Smart Tool+Alt and trying to apply split to either a mono clip that was converted to stereo, or vice-versa. Choosing the dedicated Split tool solves the problem.
     
    There are some circumstances where the split tool doesn't work on a clip because it's not a "real" clip. For example, if it's being processed by V-Vocal as a Region FX you can't use the split tool.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #4
    chuckebaby
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 13146
    • Joined: 2011/01/04 14:55:28
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/06 00:11:11 (permalink)
    if it happens again, try and remember what you were doing up to the point this started happening nd maybe we can figure out why it happen :-)
     
    best with this.
     
    Chuck

    Windows 8.1 X64 Sonar Platinum x64
    Custom built: Asrock z97 1150 - Intel I7 4790k - 16GB corsair DDR3 1600 - PNY SSD 220GB
    Focusrite Saffire 18I8 - Mackie Control
       
    #5
    FastBikerBoy
    Forum Host
    • Total Posts : 11326
    • Joined: 2008/01/25 16:15:36
    • Location: Watton, Norfolk, UK
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/06 02:54:30 (permalink)
    Another possibility is that you have lanes open (perhaps with only one lane) and are trying to split the composite (track view) clip which won't work. Although unlikely if you've only just split it elsewhere, but if there's a bit of time between splits and that would be fairly easy to do.
    #6
    ston
    Max Output Level: -71 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 965
    • Joined: 2008/03/04 12:28:40
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/06 08:15:35 (permalink)
    Did the splitting of the clips create any orphaned notes (notes which extend either side of the split point)?
     
    Sonar 'goes a bit mental' in this circumstance.  It just doesn't handle orphaned notes at all, i.e. I do not think any code has been written to explicitly manage this.  I say that because the software makes no attempt to ask any of the pertinent questions to the user which it should: "Do you want to truncate the note(s) to fit within the new clip, split the note(s) between the clips, or extend the clip(s) to incorporate the orphaned note(s)?"
     
    I've seen Sonar exhibit really bizarre behaviour when creating orphaned notes by splitting clips.
    #7
    neirbod
    Max Output Level: -84 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 343
    • Joined: 2005/05/09 12:27:26
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/06 08:20:21 (permalink)
    Have you checked your snap settings? The only time I noticed this is when I had "snap to markers" engaged and set to snap to clip edges. I would try to split a clip and it appeared to not work, when in fact it kept "splitting" at the edge of the clip.

    -----------------
    Windows 7 64
    Sonar Platinum
    Intel i7 3.4 GHz
    Gigabyte GA-H67A-UD3H-B3 mobo
    RME UFX and UCX
    #8
    Sanderxpander
    Max Output Level: -36.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 3873
    • Joined: 2013/09/30 10:08:24
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/06 08:25:47 (permalink)
    I've had the same issue. Always figured it must've been some button I hit, but it annoys the hell out of me. It's not frequent, but seems to appear randomly when I've been working on a project for a while. Rebooting Sonar always works but it's a really dumb embarrassing thing to do when you're not alone.
    #9
    brundlefly
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 14250
    • Joined: 2007/09/14 14:57:59
    • Location: Manitou Spgs, Colorado
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/06 11:38:04 (permalink)
    ston
    Did the splitting of the clips create any orphaned notes (notes which extend either side of the split point)?
     
    Sonar 'goes a bit mental' in this circumstance.  It just doesn't handle orphaned notes at all, i.e. I do not think any code has been written to explicitly manage this.  I say that because the software makes no attempt to ask any of the pertinent questions to the user which it should: "Do you want to truncate the note(s) to fit within the new clip, split the note(s) between the clips, or extend the clip(s) to incorporate the orphaned note(s)?"
     
    I've seen Sonar exhibit really bizarre behaviour when creating orphaned notes by splitting clips.



    OP's talking about audio clips, whereas it appears you're referring to MIDI. I don't want to hijack the thread, but I'll just say for the record that I'm not seeing a problem with splitting MIDI clips. What you get depends on the setting of Non-destructive MIDI Editing in preferences:
     
    - With it off (my preference), SONAR will leave any notes that cross the split in the earlier clip, and the later clip will start with the first note after the split point. In this mode, the sound of the track is totally unaffected by the split. Initially it will look like the clips are overlapping in the same lane, but after toggling lanes, the later clip will be shown in a new lane.
     
    - With non-destructive MIDI Editing enabled, the notes crossing the split get truncated by slip editing, and the later clip contains only notes that start after the split as before. The reason it's non-destructive is that either clip can be slip-edited back across the split to restore the full length of the truncated notes. But unless you move the split to a point where no notes are truncated, the track is going to sound different. I usually want to preserve the sound above all else, which is why I prefer the "Destructive" mode.
     
     

    SONAR Platinum x64, 2x MOTU 2408/PCIe-424  (24-bit, 48kHz)
    Win10, I7-6700K @ 4.0GHz, 24GB DDR4, 2TB HDD, 32GB SSD Cache, GeForce GTX 750Ti, 2x 24" 16:10 IPS Monitors
    #10
    konradh
    Max Output Level: -42 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 3325
    • Joined: 2006/01/16 16:07:06
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/06 11:46:10 (permalink)
    Sorry for taking everyone's time.  I truly believe there is something fundamentally wrong with my system as I have lots of bugs no one else does.
     
    This happened with the dedicated scissors tool on audio clips.  I routinely split clips.  Just for one example, I cut all harmony voices to start and end at the same time to make it easier to copy them into other choruses, or to reverse parts for Chorus 1 and 2 on different tracks to create doubling (or tripling).
     
    In this case, I was slicing up an audio clip into small parts and muting them one at a time to find a click (pop) I wanted to eliminate.  This worked on a previous clip.  I sliced a very small section of a harmony voice and muted it.  The very noticeable click went away.
     
    These clicks resulted from bouncing Melodyne.
     
    By the way, I am going to re-record these voices.

    Konrad
    Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/

    Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka.  Rokit 6s. 
    #11
    soens
    Max Output Level: -23.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 5154
    • Joined: 2005/09/16 03:19:55
    • Location: Location: Location
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2014/01/07 03:55:44 (permalink)
    Have you tried turning off the Snap To/By feature? Sometimes if I'm zoomed in and try to split with it ON, I can't see the split because it split where the Snap told it to instead of where my cursor was.
     
    Also, try Bouncing that particular clip, then try splitting again.
     
    Steve
    #12
    thedukewestern
    Max Output Level: -83 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 387
    • Joined: 2008/04/14 12:06:59
    • Location: NY
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/25 18:31:53 (permalink)
    I am here investigating that very same issue - to clarify once more - I was just working on the very same audio track - at different points in the song... splitting using the shortcut "S".  Sopying one part of a guitar take by splitting out one measure... copying it to a later point in the song.  Split at beginning of measure, then beginning of next measure.  Copy - Paste - all of a sudden.... s doesnt work anymore and Ive never been able to figure out why - its not the first time.  Its not that I have automation lanes etc... its none of the things mentioned here.... it just... quits...  it actually appears to be "saving" as if I am hitting control s....?
     
    Also - in copy and paste world - one very annoying thing that I experience when working in this fashion... is it seems like it should be a no brainer that when I copy a measure from one track - that it default to paste it to the same track... or at least open the menu as soon as I hit control c...
     
    x3 producer - very experienced user
     
    #13
    panup
    Max Output Level: -50 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2538
    • Joined: 2006/05/23 09:34:35
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/25 18:39:10 (permalink)
    I have seen the same issue several times. Rebooting SONAR is the only way to get splitting work again.
    SONAR X3 Producer x64 here.
    #14
    Keni
    Max Output Level: -17.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 5769
    • Joined: 2003/11/04 10:42:15
    • Location: Willits, CA USA
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/25 19:21:05 (permalink)
    Hi Gang...

    Yes, I too have had this happen but I always made myself believe it was something I did without knowing...

    I was only able to correct the issue with a Sonar reboot as Konradh mentions...

    So it appears something is going on here as more chime in with witnessings... (Is that a word?)

    Keni

    Keni Fink
    Keni - Facebook
    Deep Space Records
    http://www.reverbnation.com/inexile
    http://www.cdbaby.com/artist/inexile
    Out Of My Head Music (BMI)

    SPlat/MacPro/Dual Xeon 3.06GHz 6-core (12 total)/64GB/Win8.1X64/Presonus 1818VSL/Soundscape SS8IO-1
    #15
    charlyg
    Max Output Level: -72 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 950
    • Joined: 2015/02/27 22:10:47
    • Location: West Hills, CA
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/25 23:53:15 (permalink)
    Sounds to me like a maxed out buffer..... Somewhere!!

     
     
    #16
    konradh
    Max Output Level: -42 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 3325
    • Joined: 2006/01/16 16:07:06
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/26 21:37:40 (permalink)
    Good to know I'm not alone.

    Konrad
    Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/

    Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka.  Rokit 6s. 
    #17
    gswitz
    Max Output Level: -18.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 5694
    • Joined: 2007/06/16 07:17:14
    • Location: Richmond Virginia USA
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/26 22:29:46 (permalink)
    I have seen the case where I can't turn the split tool of when changing between projects using alt+w. I have to close and reopen to fix it. I wonder if the two are related.

    StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen.
    I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
    #18
    vanceen
    Max Output Level: -74 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 814
    • Joined: 2003/11/08 08:55:56
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/26 23:00:08 (permalink)
    I'll add one more confirmation. This has happened to me, as well. No take lanes open or anything like that. Just splitting away, and suddenly it stops working until I restart SONAR. I can't say that it's happened with Platinum, but I'm not absolutely sure.

    SONAR Platinum
    Windows 10
    ASUS X99E WE
    Core i7 5960X  
    32 GB Corsair DDR4 2133 C13
    Fireface UFX USB driver 1.098
    GeForce GTX 950
    #19
    tenfoot
    Max Output Level: -53.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2186
    • Joined: 2015/01/22 18:12:07
    • Location: Qld, Australia
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/27 00:12:59 (permalink)
     I have had this happen quite a few times. Restarting Sonar is my go-to workaround. At least I now know I am not alone:)

    Bruce.
     
    Sonar Platinum 2017-09, Studio One 3.5.3, Win 10 x64, Quad core i7, RME Fireface, Behringer X32 Producer, Behringer X32 Rack, Presonus Faderport, Lemure Software Controller (Android), Enttec DMXIS VST lighting controller, Xtempo POK.
    #20
    Sanderxpander
    Max Output Level: -36.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 3873
    • Joined: 2013/09/30 10:08:24
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/27 00:42:01 (permalink)
    Definitely not alone. Still an intermittent problem, although it seems better in the last few versions. I had it a lot more during X2 I feel. Pretty annoying since there doesn't seem to be anything that reliably reproduces it. Only thing that fixes it is restarting Sonar. Pretty embarrassing when you're there with a client.
    #21
    jerrydf
    Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 280
    • Joined: 2007/03/24 19:27:45
    • Location: Warwickshire, UK
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/27 04:05:53 (permalink)
    Me too. 
    I thought I had executed some elaborate procedure to get in to this state, but it seems I'm not alone!
    As far as I recall it's only happened since Cambridge (to me, anyway), I think
     
    jdf

    i5 6500 3.2GHz; 16GB; Win10 on SSD1; recording and samples on SSD2;  + 3 other HDDs; 2 monitors in landscape;  back with CbB and also Cubase 10 Pro,  Komplete 11, Steinberg UR22.
    Instruments: Various fretboards and amplifiers.
    Listen to ... Cosmic Two-Step (2017)
    #22
    TomHelvey
    Max Output Level: -80 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 537
    • Joined: 2013/02/26 20:23:54
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/27 04:16:18 (permalink)
    I've never had any problem splitting clips. Maybe I'm not beating it hard enough.

    System: i7-6900, 64Gb, AMI X99 Carbon Pro Gaming, AMD Radeon HD 7700, Win 10 Pro
    PCIe: UAD Octo
    USB: MOTU midi express 128, OB-6 Module, Akai MPK-249, Moog SUB 37, Antelope Orion 32 HD, Softube Console 1, iLok, eLicenser
    DAW: Cubase Pro, Ableton Live, Sonar Platinum
    Plugins: Waves, UAD, Xfer, Lennar Digital, u-he, Reveal Sound, Spectrasonics, SoundToys, VPS, Blue Cat, iZotope, NI, Valhalla, Lexicon, etc.
     
    https://soundcloud.com/thomas-helvey
    #23
    reginaldStjohn
    Max Output Level: -81 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 485
    • Joined: 2011/01/15 23:42:50
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/05/27 16:01:00 (permalink)
    I have seen this issue as well. Only a restart of Sonar would fix it.

    AMD Phenom II x6, 8 GB Ram, 2 Internal SATA III HD
    Windows 10
    Presonus Studio Live 16.0.2 Interface/Mixer
    Cakewalk Sonar Platinum
    Line6 Helix Guitar Processor 
    Custom Made (El Bandito) Telecaster
    LTD ESP EC-1000
    PRS El Torrero SE
    #24
    Lauriefin
    Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2
    • Joined: 2015/05/24 12:40:35
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/06/27 14:37:44 (permalink)
    My problem with the X3 split function is it cuts the visible track (i'm trying to cut a 2 hour show into individual songs) and seems to save the song ok ( splits before and after the song i'm editing), I've deleted the sections before and after the song i'm working on, the problem seems to be with the audio in the audio folder, as this is still the same length as the original 2 hour show ( if i play the wave files outside of X3 on a media player everything is still there!!), previously all the wav files were cut to the song i'm working on... Help!
    #25
    olemon
    Max Output Level: -75 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 768
    • Joined: 2011/10/27 05:35:19
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/06/27 17:27:22 (permalink)
    The same thing happened to me this morning.  I was going through the vocal clips I recorded yesterday.  I was splitting four or five clips at a time by lassoing them and using 'Alt+Click' on the selection.  The clips on the screen did not split.  When I looked at the Edit menu however, 'Undo Split Clip' was an option.  I closed Sonar and restarted.  After that splitting clips worked as usual.
     
    Note:  After repeating this on three vocal tracks and using Melodyne for some pitch corrections, nearly all of the clips on one of those three vocal tracks had fades on them.  I haven't seen that happen before, but the the Smart Tool gave me the Crossfade Icon a few times, so maybe it was operator error.  I don't know.

    https://www.reverbnation.com/scottholson
     
    Platinum, Studio One 3 Pro, Win 10 (x64), AMD FX-8350, ASUS M5A97 R2.0, 16GB, RME UCX, Digimax DP88, Faderport 8, Revive Audio Mod Studio Channel, Vintage Audio M72, Summit Audio TLA-50, KRK Rokit 5 G2 Monitors, Guitars
     
    "If you wait till the last minute, it only takes a minute."
    #26
    Bristol_Jonesey
    Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 16775
    • Joined: 2007/10/08 15:41:17
    • Location: Bristol, UK
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/06/28 06:45:27 (permalink)
    Lauriefin
    My problem with the X3 split function is it cuts the visible track (i'm trying to cut a 2 hour show into individual songs) and seems to save the song ok ( splits before and after the song i'm editing), I've deleted the sections before and after the song i'm working on, the problem seems to be with the audio in the audio folder, as this is still the same length as the original 2 hour show ( if i play the wave files outside of X3 on a media player everything is still there!!), previously all the wav files were cut to the song i'm working on... Help!


    This is unrelated to the problem being discussed.
     
    If i were you, after splitting each song out into it's own clip, right click it and select "Apply Trimming"
    When you've done them all, do a "Save As" to a new location and ensure "Copy Audio With Project" is checked.

    CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughout
    Custom built i7 3930, 32Gb RAM, 2 x 1Tb Internal HDD, 1 x 1TB system SSD (Win 7), 1 x 500Gb system SSD (Win 10), 2 x 1Tb External HDD's, Dual boot Win 7 & Win 10 64 Bit, Saffire Pro 26, ISA One, Adam P11A,
    #27
    Lauriefin
    Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2
    • Joined: 2015/05/24 12:40:35
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2015/06/28 07:24:00 (permalink)
    Thanks Bristol, that seems to have cured the problem :

    #28
    Kiltrash
    Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 3
    • Joined: 2014/06/17 10:06:29
    • Status: offline
    Re: Splitting Clips Doesn't Work 2018/02/11 13:11:01 (permalink)
    Just to say I had the same problem, tried all the fixes listed above and found rebooting Sonar (X3 Prod) was the only thing that fixed it. Thanks for the advice in this thread.
    #29
    Jump to:
    © 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1