Recording guitarist and singer together

Hi - what say you about preferred studio set ups when you record the acoustic guitar player while they sing - versus overdub / isolation. Granted there will be some mic bleed - but I guess that's part of it sounding organic. Better to stand, versus sit, mic placement and angles?....thanks !

You could start by reading this:
 
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul12/articles/rsg.htm
 
But there is one approach which I like and it works very well and results in nearly total isolation of the two things even though they are performed at once.
 
You need two quality figure 8 microphones if you can organise them. And also a room that is reasonably quiet at one end at least. You position the figure 8 mics horizontally. It involves the use of the null qualities of the figure 8 mics.
 
One is positioned up higher and angled up so the diaphragm is pointing towards the singers mouth but also positioned so the null of that mic is pointing down at the guitar. A pop filter can be emplyed on that mic too. I like to get that one reasonably close to the singer. The second mic is positioned downward and its diaphragm is facing the guitar (around the 12th fret if you like) but angled so that its null is pointing toward the singers mouth.
 
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar07/articles/micpatterns.htm
 
(check out the picture under the Proximity Effect heading)
 
Because the mics are in figure 8 mode they are also listening on their other side. This works better in a dead room rather than a live one for obvious reasons.
 
What you end up with are very isolated tracks. The vocal mic will have virtually no guitar on it and the guitar mic will have virtually no vocals on it. More isolated than any other mic configuration in fact and processing these two tracks is a dream. It allows the performer to do these two things at once but the results are great.
 
I teach this technique to my sound engineering students and when we do it they are always quite amazed at the results and the isolation between the two things.
 
If you don't have two figure 8 mics then the first link in my post may be more helpful.
 
 
 
 
 
 

thanks for that link ---- good article !!

The method Jeff mentioned can work well, but is very dependent on having the right room. If your room is too live, it'll sound like your player is at the end of the hallway, and you won't get any better isolation anyway, as the reflections are so strong. Actually, recording a singing guitarist will almost always bring the properties of the room forward, as the recording techniques tend to be a bit different to the isolated approach.
 
Another method that can work very well by itself, or as a complimentary configuration, is to use a single mic to capture everything. This won't work unless you have a great player, lots of time, experience, the right room, and great gear. Put up a quality LDC in omni around a metre from the player, stick on some good headphones, then take the time to move the mic around until you achieve the best possible tone and balance.
 
But one thing is certain, your player had better be very, very good if the results are to sound acceptable. Honestly, I've only worked with a few who have been good enough to pull this off. If your player isn't technically proficient, sensitive and innately musical, I'd be encouraging him to record vocals and guitar separately. No one practices anymore, it seems most are content with mediocrity, so I'd say (from my experience, at least) that there's a 90% chance this guy should be doing it separately :-) Of course, that very much depends where your working, past clients etc.
 
Have fun - it's a lot more fun recording bands and people all at once, you're going to love it!

Thanks Mike I thought you would like it. It is very effective for sure. What James is saying above is true but it is easy in most cases to organise a deadish room so the other sides of the figure 8 mics are not picking up much. I have never had a problem with that.
 
In terms of the player being good I only record incredibly good musicians now and nothing less. Anything less is a waste of time as far as I am concerned. I have recorded supreme artists who can pull this off and in some case they can only do these two things together and recording separately is not the way to go at all because you can also end up with a mediocre performance that way too but when some people do it together it can sound much much better.
 
A more important issue and one that can be difficult is whether they can do it against a click track. Now that is another story!