Latency again

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mookie
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2014/02/26 21:21:36 (permalink)

Latency again

Im using X3 with Asio4All and cannot get latency below 32MS. That is impossible to overdub with.
Computer is Dell17R i-7 2.40GHz and Im using a blue yeti usb mic. If I set the buffer size to 64, the latency only drops to 15 MS which is better but not good enough. Any ideas what I might could do? Ive used SONAR products before but have always moved samples from a digital recorder to the SONAR tracks. I'd like to be able to record via USB but I'm starting to wonder if I'm on the wrongtrack. 
 
 
#1

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    Cactus Music
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    Re: Latency again 2014/02/26 22:03:33 (permalink)
    It helps us a lot if you clearly describe your system you are using when asking these kind of questions. There are a dozen answers depending on what equipment you are using. The software is only one thing. 
     
    Asio4 all is a band aid left over from the distant past when the audio world was still evolving. We now have real good audio interfaces and drivers and there is no body that should suffer ASIo4all. 
    And audio interface is critical to using a DAW. The drivers are the heart of the system. 

    Johnny V  
    Cakelab  
    Focusrite 6i61st - Tascam us1641. 
    3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
     http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
     
     
    #2
    robert_e_bone
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    Re: Latency again 2014/02/26 23:56:12 (permalink)
    I do concur that ASIO4ALL is at best a very weak option, and urge you to consider picking up a dedicated audio interface of some sort.  A reasonable audio interface will start at around $150 on up, depending on features and inputs/outputs.
     
    Make sure whichever one you pick up has drivers for the OS version you are using - I suggest making sure Windows 8 drivers are available for it.  Please note that even if Windows 8 drivers are available, they might not be for Windows 8.1, so just do your homework on them prior to purchase.
     
    When you do pick one up, I would suggest the following settings:
     
    Audio Interface: Sample Rate either 44.1 k or 48 k, ASIO Buffer Size 128.
     
    Sonar: Driver Mode = ASIO, Sample Rate must match the Sample Rate you have set for the audio interface, Record Bit-Depth = 24 bits.
     
    You want to shoot for getting the Sonar reported Total Roundtrip Latency to at or a little less than 10 milliseconds.  
     
    Until you do pick up an audio interface, try to keep your plugins to a minimum during your tracking, and that will help keep the latency down a bit.  Once you finish tracking, you can adjust your latency up for mixing, and that will allow you to add the effects you want.
     
    Also, if using ASIO4ALL, you might consider using a sample rate of 44.1 k, and if latency is still too high, perhaps recording in 16 bits would help, as it would make the CPU work a lot less.  The downside to that is of course that the audio quality would not be as good as if recorded at 24 bits, but at least you would have a better shot at being able to record and overdub.
     
    If your computer has a WI-Fi adapter, I also strongly encourage you to temporarily disable that while doing Sonar sessions, as these frequently can cause high latency spikes.  You can enable it again after completing your Sonar session.
     
    I hope any of the above helps, 
     
    Sonar is a very powerful program, and feature-rich, but you really have to consider giving it the horsepower it needs to be able to give you quality results.  Using ASIO4ALL makes your CPU responsible for all of the analog/digital conversion, and that is why you are having latency issues.  You may get some relief by the techniques I posted above, but at best these would be short-term band aids to the situation.
     
    Picking up and properly configuring a purpose-built dedicated audio interface is really an essential item for getting good results with Sonar.
     
    Bob Bone
     

    Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
     
    Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
    Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
    Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
    Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others
    MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es
    Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms  
    #3
    microapp
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    Re: Latency again 2014/02/27 18:40:12 (permalink)
    It sounds like you are using your  PC soundcard as audio out.
    Does the Mic work as WDM? If so get rid of ASIO4all and set sonar for WDM for the Mic and soundcard. Chances are you could get better than 32 ms with WDM.
     
    Michael

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    #4
    mookie
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    Re: Latency again 2014/03/01 00:04:35 (permalink)
    Thanks for the above.  I own a Allen&Heath ZED 10 FX that has an USB output so I plugged this into the lappie thinking it might act as this audio interface. Well it did connect and I was able to record some but unfortunately the latency was the same. I had to switch to MME driver mode because the ASio4all driver claims the lappies mic as its own and will not allow me to shut it off. Anyway. latency was the same using the Allen&Heath. I guess this little mixer is not an audio interface.
    Using the WDM driver setting makes for a whole lot of crackle when I pull it down to 10MS. WDM seems to be pretty crackly all in all. And it doesnt recognize the YETI USB mic. 
    A little OS appropriate audio interface will solve all my problems, huh? Sounds like I'll hit the store tomorrow.
    post edited by mookie - 2014/03/01 00:28:13
    #5
    Cactus Music
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    Re: Latency again 2014/03/01 01:09:07 (permalink)
    Yes it is well documented that the A&H does not come with drivers. When ever you see product information like " Does not need drivers" you know your in hot water.   You can use it with simple programs like audacity or Wavosaur to record a stereo track.  Sonar is very picky about drivers and you'll be pulling your hair out. 
    SO most people use those programs to record their live gigs. But there's no practical way to do overdubs so it's not at all a good interface for multitrack recording. . 
     
    If your only working alone then something like the Scarlett 2i2 is all you need. Make sure to figure out what connectivity you need. Make sure the monitoring set up is also flexible. 

    Johnny V  
    Cakelab  
    Focusrite 6i61st - Tascam us1641. 
    3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
     http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
     
     
    #6
    mookie
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    Re: Latency again 2014/03/01 19:49:58 (permalink)
    Thank you. 
     
    #7
    mookie
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    Re: Latency again 2014/03/30 19:30:04 (permalink)
    I bought a v studio 100 at a good price and all is solved now. well one other thing. I want to use an USB mic sometime. I'll need to plug it into the computer directly. Can I get the interface to allow me to use USB mic and interface at the same time? SONAR X3 recognizes the USB mic, but it doesnt pop up in devices so I cannot select it to use it. 
    #8
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