Cybertizzen
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Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
I find it very strange that the gain trim is ignored when rendering audio effects from the insert bin on individual tracks. This must surely be an oversight?
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bitflipper
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/12 22:03:52
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Trim happens before the fx bin, and is not considered an effect. That it remains active after freezing or applying effects is a great benefit.
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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Cybertizzen
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/13 04:54:01
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Well, I only see the problem with that: it means that any gain-sensitive effect in the fx bin will sound different when rendered. How can this be of benefit? Wouldn't it be more reasonable to consider the trim part of the effects, and simply set it back to zero after rendering?
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scook
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/13 07:52:13
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Freeze or bounce the track
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John
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/13 08:10:26
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Cybertizzen
I find it very strange that the gain trim is ignored when rendering audio effects from the insert bin on individual tracks. This must surely be an oversight?
This is the first time I have heard of this. Are you sure that you have it correct?
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gswitz
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/13 08:47:19
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☄ Helpfulby Cybertizzen 2014/04/13 17:55:48
He said Apply Audio FX. Is it possible Cybertizzan is applying FX like when you choose Process > Apply Effect and it's going straight to the clip without going through the gain stage?
Cybertizzan, I don't usually use Apply Effect so I'm not much use. But I think it is possible that apply effect works differently than Freeze Track. Freeze Track actually bounces down the track and keeps it inline. I think that's what you're after here. Apply Effect is really limited to just the FX applied and the related clips.
If you want a new track with the FX applied to the wave form exactly as you have it, you can use bounce to tracks. It's not quite the same as Apply FX, but it might serve.
If your goal is just to free up processing power, you should use Freeze Track.
StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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Cybertizzen
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/13 17:36:13
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Thank you for the helpful reply. gswitz
He said Apply Audio FX. Is it possible Cybertizzan is applying FX like when you choose Process > Apply Effect and it's going straight to the clip without going through the gain stage?
This is exactly what I'm doing. gswitz
If your goal is just to free up processing power, you should use Freeze Track.
Well, my goal is not primarily to free up processing power, but to apply effects that are bound to my iLok to tracks that are to be exported to a separate laptop to serve as backing tracks for live use. Freeze track is an alternative, but comes with its own set of issues if I were to unfreeze them; any subsequent edits get reverted. I think for my case, the best workaround will be to replace the trim with a gain-plugin first in the effects bin.
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Anderton
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/13 17:40:39
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Why not just bounce the track to another track, which you then export? It will reflect the gain settings and include the iLok-bound effects. Or, bounce the track to itself if you don't need to keep the original for some reason.
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Cybertizzen
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/13 17:48:59
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Anderton
Why not just bounce the track to another track, which you then export? It will reflect the gain settings and include the iLok-bound effects. Or, bounce the track to itself if you don't need to keep the original for some reason.
Sure, that will probably work as well. I will just need to get all the "bounce to track"-settings right (for instance excluding bus inserts etc.), but then again - I could always the bounce-settings as a preset once I get it to behave in the desired manner.
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scook
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/13 18:53:15
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To add a gain control in the FX bin add an empty FX Chain, Channel Tools or a plug-in like Sonalksis FreeG
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bitflipper
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/14 18:26:48
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Gain/Trim should most definitely be calculated when bouncing ("Apply Effects" is essentially a bounce-in-place). Not doing so, as you point out, would wreak havoc on level-sensing plugins. Can you suggest a test scenario that shows this not being the case?
For example, if you insert a compressor and note the maximum peak value in the track, the peak value should be unchanged after applying effects.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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gswitz
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/14 22:00:51
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StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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KPerry
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Re: Gain trim and "apply audio effects"
2014/04/15 05:23:45
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I think you're in a catch-22 situation: if you apply gain when applying effects, then the gain will be re-added afterwards (since gain is at the track level and there may well be other clips on the track); if you apply gain and zero the track gain as part of the apply effects process, other clips on the track will have the wrong gain afterwards; if you don't apply gain, you will - as you say - end up with some effects not being hit with the correct input level.
Simple solution...don't use apply effects :-)
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