Rain
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Going Flatwound...
Will take some getting used to. Feels like my fingertips are numb or something, I just can't "feel" the strings properly. But sonically: just what the doctor ordered. :P
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michaelhanson
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/01 17:07:33
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Rain
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/01 17:52:11
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Bass. Incidentally, I've just tried getting back to bigger strings on the guitar - the SG would have been perfect for that. But just like I apprehended, the joints in my fretting hand index finger started getting painful after 48 hours or so. So it's back to .09 for me. I can't risk making it worst.
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michaelhanson
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/01 20:05:49
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Rain, I switched to La Bella Flatwounds on the bass a while back. I also went to a lighter guage because of the overall tension of the strings. I had originally put Rotosound Flats, 45-105 on my Rick, but the tension was so high, that it was actually putting a lot of stress on the neck. I started to read up on it and Rick's have a recommended tension max that they say not to exceed. I didn't particularily like the feel of the Rotosounds either, so I went with the La Bella's, I believe 40-100 instead, based on a lot of recommendations from Rick users. I love the feel of these strings, silky smooth, and the tension feels just right for me. Thomas Infields were also HIGHLY recommended on a Rickenbacker for sound and feel. The tension on those strings is supposed to be about as low as you can get on bass strings and people either seem to love the feel, or hate it. Most people that chimed on TI Flatwounds, seem to REALLY like their tone. I have noticed that I have lost a little bit of that distinctive Rickenbacker growl that they are known for; I get more of the McCartney sound with the flatwounds.
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Rain
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/01 20:17:57
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I'll definitely go for a lighter gauge next time - these are way too big - .050 to .105. But since it's a short scale, it's not as bad. My wife bought those when she bought the bass, as a few bass playing friends had recommended flatwounds to her. Local GC only had 2 brands/types - not much of a choice, so she just picked one, randomly.
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michaelhanson
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/01 20:19:59
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On guitar, I have pretty much fallen back to 9's; but Hybrids, so that the 4,5 and 6 strings are a little heavier. I was up to 11's at one point, but it caused so many issues with my tendonitus in my hands that I just play what I am comfortable with these days. Shoot, I read somewhere that Billy Gibbons plays something like 8's...if he can get that kind of tone on that light of strings... I have also read that Jimmy Page played 8's.
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michaelhanson
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/01 20:24:44
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☄ Helpfulby Rain 2014/06/02 14:33:28
Local GC only had 2 brands/types - not much of a choice, so she just picked one, randomly. I checked every GC and mom and pop guitar store in the Dallas area and no one carries squat for Flatwounds. All heavy guages. My understanding is that flatwounds have naturally more tension because of the way they are made. I ended up ordering online from Bass Strings Online. Talk Bass is a great forum site for information on anything Bass related.
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Rain
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/01 20:32:08
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MakeShift On guitar, I have pretty much fallen back to 9's; but Hybrids, so that the 4,5 and 6 strings are a little heavier. I was up to 11's at one point, but it caused so many issues with my tendonitus in my hands that I just play what I am comfortable with these days. Shoot, I read somewhere that Billy Gibbons plays something like 8's...if he can get that kind of tone on that light of strings... I have also read that Jimmy Page played 8's.
I didn't know for Gibbons, but, yeah Page definitely uses small gauges. Same for Tony Iommi, because of his missing fingertips. According to his website: Here are Tony’s string gauges on the live guitars:For the D# tuning,.008p, .008p, .011p, .018w, .024w, .032w.For the C# tuning,.009p, .010p, .012p, .020w, .032w, .042w. Actually, .09 -.42 I usually use don't offer as much resistance as I'd like them to on the SG, hence why I was looking to try bigger ones. But the .10 won't work, not tuned to 440 anyway. To bad because 1/2 a step lower and they're perfect, but I need to commit to 440 on the projects I'm working on. And between the lack of grip and my fingers giving up on me, the choice is simple. The hybrids are the ones I'd previously tried - I loved them, but after a year or so, they started hurting my fingers. But I loved the sound I got out of them.
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Leadfoot
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/01 21:46:00
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I use the GHS custom lites 9-46 on my SG. I like the sound of the fat low E. :)
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Rain
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/02 02:29:00
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I used GHS for a while and I loved them a lot - but I happened to break a bunch a E strings in a row. There could have been a bunch of different reasons I guess, but the first thing I tried was to try Ernie Ball Slinkies instead. Never had the issue again. Could have been just an unlikely run of bad luck with strings, but I stayed w/ Slinkies since. Someday I'll give those GHS another try.
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57Gregy
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/02 09:46:28
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As a kid learning guitar in Germany, the only strings we got were Black Diamond flatwounds, guitar and bass. The first time I bought strings here in the States, they were roundwounds. I thought something was wrong with them. I didn't know there were different types of strings back then.
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ampfixer
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/02 17:47:16
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After trying flatwounds on the bass I couldn't go back to round wounds. Way less noise and much easier on my fingers. I don't do the pop and slap techniques so flat's where it's at. Straight 10's on my Gibson electrics and 10-52 on the strat. I like to fret the low E with my thumb quite often, and the heavy gauge seems to help with pitch control.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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spacealf
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/02 18:05:51
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Flatwounds for guitar don't have to be big. At Sweetwater. Bass, I would have to take a look if I had a bass guitar. Something to do though so probably will.
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spacealf
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/02 18:09:44
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Yes, they have bass guitar flatwounds also there. Look at the pretty pictures. I don't know what strings ya know.
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Rain
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/02 18:19:31
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For the bass, I'm now looking for light gauge short scale flatwounds - so far, I've found Rotosound's and LaBella's, IIRC. The ones I have on now are regular scale and much too thick. .40 would sound about right, I think. In terms of sound, after re-recording one of our songs with them last night, I'm ecstatic - that is exactly the type of bass sound I was after - very percussive, narrow and focused, and awesomely warm. You can easily play a relatively busy bass line or walking bass type of things without taking too much sonic space in the mix. Much easier to manage when it's time to mix. That's another case of getting the sound you want on its way in, instead of fixing it afterwards... Next on my list - a simple hardware EQ, or maybe one of those inexpensive Presonus Channel Strip, with preamp, compression and EQ.
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yorolpal
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/02 18:38:15
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GHS David Gilmour Blue Set on all my solid body electrics.
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michaelhanson
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/02 23:22:17
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This bellow is something that I grabbed off the Talk Bass site a while back and copied to my "notes" page.
If you're looking for low tension flatwounds, I recommend any of the following sets from (get ready) lowest to highest tension, low-tension sets:
Thomastik Infeld 43-100 La Bella FX 39-96 GHS Precision 45-95 Ernie Ball Group IV 40-95 D'Addario Chromes 40-95 Sadowsky Black Label 40-100 D'Addario Chromes 40-100 La Bella 760FL 43-104 GHS Precision 45-105 Fender Super Light 40-100 Rotosound 77 40-100
*Left out other brands due to my unfamiliarity with them. Many apologies to the other flats out there.
Remember that all of these gauges are, for the most part, low tension, with Thomastik Infeld (TI) coming in at an average of 34lbs. while La Bella, GHS, and EB & Chromes come in very close with tensions ranging within the 37-39lbs. Once you break into Sadowsky territory and up, the tension is extremely minor with an average "feeling" of 38-42lbs. of tension. Basically, if you want the lightest of the light, go with TI flats, but if 3-5lbs. of tension is not going to be a significant factor with your playing style, then any of these light to light-medium sets are fine, fine choice. And as always, select accordingly so that your brand matches your sound, as all strings (let alone flatwounds) are not made equally.
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michaelhanson
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/02 23:52:00
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Rain,
There were three things that I did not like about the Rotosounds. One, they had a half round feel to them. I was switching to flats, because I wanted that silky smooth feel of flats. Two, the tension was so high that they were hurting my hands. I use lighter gauge guitar strings to keep from getting tendentious in my hands and these bass strings were going to get me there faster than any guitar strings I had used. They were bowing my neck. I was going to have to do some major truss rod work on my Rickenbacker if I was going to get the Rotosounds to play nice with my neck.
I guess a fourth reason was that Rickenbacker flat out had a maximum tension recommendation for the Rick and those strings where easily exceeding that threshold. In fact, if you send the Rick into the plant with those strings on it, it would void any warranty work with Rickenbacker.
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spacealf
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/03 00:19:21
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Quote "Next on my list - a simple hardware EQ, or maybe one of those inexpensive Presonus Channel Strip, with preamp, compression and EQ."/Quote I have those, and although they are not great at all, I suppose they work. It can add some noise if not careful, and tube change usually will help. I have not dealt into all the tubes mentioned, all I did was buy some Mullards medium sound (that is all they had at Sweetwater) so that is what I ended up with. I don't expect real good anything with those, but for the price I guess if you get those with the manual which will help (different settings) they can help with basic EQ and Compression. If not careful and outputting the gain at normal (0) level there will seem to be noise added, and I have not tried guitar with them, just my synth mainly and a microphone. Although adjustable on input level, it depends on the patch on my synth, as some can be loud, loud it seems and others soft soft, and adjusting the master volume on my synth for each patch only can help so much. Afterall, it is just the patches nature of the beast with that stuff. I am not sure if there would be enough gain for a guitar at all with those channel strips. Nope probably need another gain box before that unit. Oh, I have used a guitar amp effects box simulator I guess before getting to that unit (as in a digitech or perhaps a Boss ME-25 like) but now with amps that can have stereo out effects and all for just as much money, I think I will use those for guitar. I should do that too. Oh well, other work to do also which may delay me doing anything for awhile. http://www.sweetwater.com/c633--Guitar_Pedals_Multi_effects Ya know, one of those before the channel strip and I think low impedence out. Good grief I would have to look at the manual again to even know if that channel strip takes a guitar straight in. Where am I? http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/StudioChan/Nope really does not say "guitar" so that is what I would go by, not really made for guitar unless something is used before it. Pretty sure on that. Low-end theory - that's me (as over on Gearslutz). I would not necessarily go by reviews of other people anymore either, because.............................. (there is much better equipment if you like to pay for it and way higher price I guess). (I am using it on my crappy signature links, well a couple of them.) God, I have work to catch up on. And yes I could have done better on the mixes and all of that also.
post edited by spacealf - 2014/06/03 00:21:00
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sharke
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/03 00:40:08
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I just put some D'Addario Chromes (.011's) on my Telecaster. I had some flatwounds on a while back and they worked out pretty well. I liked the sound. With these ones however, the G-string is buzzing like mad up to the 7th fret so I'm thinking I need a neck adjustment? Trouble is I'm absolutely useless at any kind of guitar maintenance (don't trust myself not to make a hash of it at all) and so I'll probably end up having to take it to my guitar guy. Or maybe just go back to my regular .011's. Come to think of it I always end up getting annoyed with that wound G....what a dilemma man, great sound, great feel, but neck adjustment needed and annoying wound G.
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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spacealf
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/03 02:33:15
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Those Presonus have an input (instrument) on the front and it says for a passive instrument (guitar, bass, etc). I use the one that is in the back. Duh? When an instrument is plugged into the instrument input, the microphone preamp is bypassed, and the Studio Channel becomes an active instrument preamplifier. Okay, whatever that means. Ah, I tired, that's it.  I had my own opinions about that since it has no reverb or anything like that to add I guess. Add it later? Whatever????
post edited by spacealf - 2014/06/03 05:43:31
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Rain
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/03 15:32:44
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Mike - man, thanks a bunch for this exhaustive list and all the input! This has just been copied to my notes. :) Spacealf - thanks a lot for the feedback on that unit. My mind isn't made up yet and to be honest, I wouldn't expect much from the "tube preamp" at that price point - the EQ is the first thing I'm concerned with, a passable compression would be nice. Because I'm always on a budget, I've always preferred to stick to solid state/transparent hardware. I figured that unless I could invest a sufficient amount of money, I could only buy a poor approximation which would actually do more harm than good. I still have my trusty M-Audio DMP-3 which has tons of gain and is very clean, and my Focusrite audio interface also has its own preamps. But the convenience of having everything in one rack unit would be awesome.
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spacealf
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/03 18:34:05
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Well, I could take everything in one unit that has the works in it, but they do not make it, and it probably would not be cheap. Oh, and that post before came out of the manual for it, finally found it tucked away. I guess I should try that front input for the heck of it, but then.................newer amp (probably not great Mustang V2). As well as they have a Super Champ for slightly more that can do many things also (which is a tube amp and has models and effects I guess). http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/SupChampX2/ But I use the channel strip on everything, since the compression can be the same (or different each time). Well, someone came this morning at 6:15AM while I got to bed at 5AM, putting on siding next door, making noise and stuff. I need a nap. Something new everyday it seems. Me eyes are blurring.(and the fingers are missing the keys typing). Buy something and the next day something new comes out it seems anymore. Oh, well. For the price I guess the Presonus is fine enough to work well enough. Where to try out though first is the hard part. Some talk about the Art Pro whatever it is, but then it just did not seem to be any better and maybe not as good. I need a nap.
post edited by spacealf - 2014/06/03 18:40:11
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spacealf
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Re: Going Flatwound...
2014/06/08 17:31:22
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