pf123
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vocals disappear
Recorded a recent song then saved it and emailed the track to my iphone to see how it sounds through the phone speaker but the vocals almost disappear and sound very distant/reverby (is that a word?). I have sent to other peoples phones and it's the same issue but when the phone is plugged through a hi fi/car stereo the mix sounds fine again. I have also emailed to my pc and again it sounds fine. This has happened before but not on every track I mix and it is only the vocals that almost disappear, everything else sounds as the original mix. Any help please?
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Kalle Rantaaho
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/22 05:03:39
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What are you actually doing? As you can't send a cwp-file to an iPad or phone, the song is exported first in some form. Which, what, how? Producing final mixes that transfer well to all soundsystems is the most difficult thing in home recording.
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Leadfoot
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/22 06:18:34
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You've got some phase issues with your vocals that are causing them to disappear when you play the song in mono. Try panning the lead vox straight up the middle.
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Guitarhacker
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/22 07:46:38
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This sounds like you're only getting one channel of the stereo mix playing. My jack converter (1/4" to 1/8th) sometimes does that when I plug in the cans and that's exactly what it sounds like..... do a mono mix and test that the same way.
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bitflipper
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/22 09:03:24
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I can think of two likely explanations for this phenomenon. The first is that you are using some mono-incompatible widening technique on either the vocal or on the full mix. If, for example, the left and right channels are out of phase when you fold them to mono you'll lose stuff that's center-panned, including vocals. To test if this is your problem, set the interleave on the master bus to mono and listen for extreme differences. The other possibility is that it's just a translation issue. The real trick of mixing is figuring out how to make your song sound acceptable on a wide variety of playback systems, including those at the bottom of the fidelity range. The iPhone is about as lo-fi as it gets. On the one hand, it's incapable of reproducing some frequencies, so any mix elements that depend on those frequencies disappear. But it will also overemphasize other frequencies, exaggerating other mix elements and exacerbating whatever masking effects they're causing. Masking makes things disappear.
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Cactus Music
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/22 11:24:40
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Interesting topic as I am just finishing an album so uploaded a few of the tracks to Sound clicks. I told a friend about the album and got him to go to the web page and we listened to few and I was impressed they they actually translated perfectly on his iphone. I was unaware that they are mono too. In my old age I've gotten pretty good at this translating game ,, pat on back if my arm wasn't so sore... There's a MONO button on your master buss,,, use it.
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pf123
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/23 04:46:31
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Thanks all, first post so much appreciated. I was simply converting the file to an mp3 so it could be emailed and listened to on other devices to see how it sounds. Don't think I am doing anything tricky with the vocals but will check this and also try switching to mono to see if it solves the problem.
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Kalle Rantaaho
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/23 05:02:31
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Re-reading the OP and the answers I'm also sure it's a phase issue due to mono playback. I just wanted a confirmation that the original exported version is checked to be OK.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/24 08:25:09
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pf123 Thanks all, first post so much appreciated. I was simply converting the file to an mp3 so it could be emailed and listened to on other devices to see how it sounds. Don't think I am doing anything tricky with the vocals but will check this and also try switching to mono to see if it solves the problem.
Ok, you say you're converting "the file" What file? how did you get your music out of Sonar?
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Cactus Music
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/24 10:03:51
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And I didn't mean export in mono, I meant to "check"you mix in mono, Then export in stereo.
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pf123
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/25 08:29:51
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Thanks for feedback, following on from suggestions I set the master bus to mono and it gave exactly the same issue as playing on the iphone, sounds like only a 'wet' reverb signal on the vocal tracks is playing. So I decided to try something else......the vocals/backing vocals are routed to a bus with eq, compression and Perfect Space Reverb (main vocals panned middle). I tried exporting/emailing the track to my phone (same method as previous) without Perfect Space and the vocals sound fine and back up front again (but without reverb of course). Is it some setting in perfect space I am doing wrong, not had chance to study the set up yet but if anybody has any obvious theories? Forgot to check if I am exporting in stereo but am mixing in mono. Good reminder to switch to mono occasionally, will put a note next to my 'NOW SAVE, IDIOT' sign after loosing hours of work on numerous occasions!
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Cactus Music
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/25 11:41:40
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That explains it. You don't normally add reverb in series to your signal. You add it in parallel. I'll give you an example of how I set up a mix. For simplicity I will not use any sub mix buses. A sub mix buss would be put between your tracks and the master. In the Top Pane: will include the Audio,MIDI and soft synth tracks. The Audio and Soft synths Audio are all output to the Master Buss. In the bottom pane: A Master Buss - output to interface A Reverb Buss - output to master A Delay Buss - Output to master And there could be one more for guitar effects like Chorus or Leslie. and you might also have a metronome and headphone buss (that have nothing to do with your mix) Tracks and buses all have an effect bin. I will put EQ or compression in the track bins. I realize some would also put guitar effects here like distortion, I record those sounds live, so each to there own in this matter there is no right or wrong. All other effects will go in a Buss effect bin. And only one Effect per buss. I will put the LP 64 Multi band in the Master bus bin. This is in bypass mode until final export to avoid tracking latency issues. . All your tracks have the ability to insert an effect send to any of the inserted buses. You use this to send part of your tracks signal in parallel to that effect. This also has all your tracks sharing the same effects which makes for a more natural sounds-cape. People are not used to hearing sound with 6 different spacial "rooms" They want to be in one place. Of course you could put an effect in the track bin and use the wet/dry to mix, but it is so much better when using console view to set it up like I do. All your controls are easy to see and reach, and you can solo the effect buses or mute them.
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pf123
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Re: vocals disappear
2014/06/25 12:31:06
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Thanks Mr Cactus Music, much appreciated, still have a lot to learn!
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