MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e?

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anxiousmofo
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2014/07/18 15:39:16 (permalink)

MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e?

Has Sonar ever been fixed so MMC works in the 64 bit version?  I'm considering upgrading to Studio, but don't want to if I have to program transport for my MPK61 (I work long hours and would rather spend my music time making music).
 
I'd appreciate any insight. Thanks!
#1

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    robert_e_bone
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/18 16:29:47 (permalink)
    There is a free 30-day demo for download, and you can test out all of the core functionality - just add on components won't be present (Melodyne, etc..)
     
    Bob Bone
     

    Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
     
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    #2
    anxiousmofo
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/18 17:01:15 (permalink)
    Thanks, but I already own X3 standard.  I haven't been able to get it to work, but I am a neophyte and admittedly could be missing something.  That said, it appears that this was an issue with Sonar since its very first x64 release.
    #3
    robert_e_bone
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/19 09:12:04 (permalink)
    I found some thread posts:
     
    http://forum.cakewalk.com/MMC-Machine-control-not-working-on-Sonar-X3b-64bit-m2920888.aspx
     
    http://www.cakewalk.com/Documentation?product=SONAR%20X3&language=3&help=Synchronizing.13.html
     
    I don't know anything about using MMC in Sonar, even though my midi controllers have transport buttons, I just use my computer keyboard and/or mouse.  Hope something in the above links gives you information that will help you.
     
    Bob Bone
     

    Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
     
    Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
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    #4
    anxiousmofo
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/21 15:41:52 (permalink)
    Thanks, Bob.  Looks like no upgrade for me, then, as there is still no working MMC in 64 bit.
     
    This seems like such an odd thing to leave unaddressed for so long.  It's not like Akai is a bit player in the controller market.
     
    This is a shame, because I have otherwise quite liked x3e. Oh well.
     
     
    #5
    Sanderxpander
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/21 17:21:35 (permalink)
    I know Sonar standard doesn't support a few sync options, are you positive that's not the issue? Just double checking.
    #6
    robert_e_bone
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/21 17:58:26 (permalink)
    I will go back through those threads, and also do more digging.  I hope there is SOME kind of way for you to have things work for you.
     
    Bob Bone

    Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
     
    Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
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    #7
    azslow3
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 05:48:07 (permalink)
    Bob, OP wrote in the first post directly - he is not going to move a finger for that, too busy...
    It is obvious that MPK61 does not need MMC to function properly, and OP has not mentioned any device which required it. Save your time for music, as OP does

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    #8
    robert_e_bone
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 06:30:10 (permalink)
    Well, I found a link that is for a different Akai keyboard, BUT many times ACT settings for 1 model will also work for another model in Sonar.
     
    Here is some text from the site that talks about some files included in a download link, and maybe this will work for you:
     
    Below is a link to download a set of files including directions on how to setup the MPK88 and Sonar X2 so they’ll play nice together. Also included is a Sonar X2 preset that can be loaded onto the MPK88 using the Vyzex MPK88 software editor that you can download from the Akai website. And finally, included is an MPK88 ACT MIDI Control Surface preset and directions on how to import it into Sonar X2. Enjoy!
     
    http://www.unrelatednotes.com/mpk88/Akai%20MPK88%20Sonar%20X2%20Files.zip
     
    The main page's link itself is at:
     
    http://www.unrelatednotes.com/update-how-to-setup-the-akai-mpk88-with-sonar-x2/
     
    Good luck, 
     
    Bob Bone
     
     
     

    Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
     
    Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
    Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
    Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
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    #9
    Anderton
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 09:20:38 (permalink)
    anxiousmofo
    Thanks, but I already own X3 standard.  I haven't been able to get it to work, but I am a neophyte and admittedly could be missing something. 



    MMC is a specification that involves several elements. Not all gear supports all aspects. Sonar's MMC does what it's claimed to do. One person came in here saying that MMC didn't work because he couldn't sync to Sonar using MMC. He didn't understand that the gear he wanted to control from Sonar didn't support synching through MMC; it needed MIDI clock and song position pointer messages, which of course Sonar can send. 
     
    So if you can describe exactly what it is you want to do, that would help.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #10
    Dan Cate [Cakewalk]
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 14:18:04 (permalink)
    Hi anxiousmofo,
     
    The MMC control surface in Sonar is an older module created by a 3rd party developer that was never ported over to x64. Sonar, without and completely separate from the MMC control surface, does support transmitting MMC start/stop and location messages that work in conjunction with MIDI Timecode sync generators (i.e. MIDI Timepiece AV, Universal Slave Driver, etc...). An overwhelming majority of synchronization scenarios use MMC as the transport master to send start/stop messages to a synchronizor sending MIDI time code to Sonar. MMC pre-dated control surface protocols like Mackie Control or ACT and is limited to start/stop and location messages and in olden times could be used to transport Sonar from a device like an LRC or DA-88 with SY-88 card. The Akai MPK series keyboards include the option for MMC transport messages, however this particular feature is not needed to use as a transport master in Sonar. It may, however, be necessary to work with other DAWs.
     
    Sonar's control surface protocol ACT allows more control over strips, plugin parameters, as well as transport messages. I recommend using either the ACT MIDI control surface or the Cakewalk Generic control surface with the MPK-61. In Sonar Preferences - Control Surfaces add either ACT or Cakewalk Generic Control surface. Open the Control Surface property page in Utilities. I don't know for sure but I suspect the "Akai MPK49" preset will work across the MPK series control surfaces. If not, you can "learn" the various buttons and knobs and save your own preset. Using ACT as a control surface allows you to transport Sonar, arm tracks, automate tracks trips and plugins and pretty much anything that has a menu item in Sonar. If you are synchronizing the playback of the MPK's arpeggiator, set Sonar to transmit beat clock in Preferences - Project - MIDI by enabling Transmit MIDI start/continue/stop/clock. 
     
    Hope this helps.


    Thanks!
    Daniel Cate [Cakewalk]  
    #11
    Anderton
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 14:30:13 (permalink)
    First, you don't have to use MMC with the MPK61, the transport buttons can transmit MIDI stop/start commands as well as controller data. There are lots of ways to control Sonar's start/stop and start/pause functions:
     
    • Keyboard shortcut
    • Generic control surface setting
    • Set your MPK61 transport to transmit MIDI start/stop commands, which is far more common than MMC anyway. Then, follow these directions (from Sonar's documentation):
     
    1. Configure the external MIDI device you want to use as the master device to transmit MIDI Sync [i.e., set the MPK61 to transmit MIDI start/stop instead of MMC].
    2. Go to Edit > Preferences > MIDI Devices.
    3. Make sure that your MIDI interface is highlighted in the Inputs list, and click OK.
    4. Click the Transmit MIDI Sync button  in the Sync module to use the MIDI Sync clock source.
    From now on, SONAR starts playback and recording only after the appropriate message is received from the master device.
     
     

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #12
    anxiousmofo
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 15:30:56 (permalink)
    Anderton
    anxiousmofo
    Thanks, but I already own X3 standard.  I haven't been able to get it to work, but I am a neophyte and admittedly could be missing something. 



    MMC is a specification that involves several elements. Not all gear supports all aspects. Sonar's MMC does what it's . One person came in here saying that MMC didn't work because he couldn't sync to Sonar using MMC. He didn't understand that the gear he wanted to control from Sonar didn't support synching through MMC; it needed MIDI clock and song position pointer messages, which of course Sonar can send. 
     
    So if you can describe exactly what it is you want to do, that would help.


    Thanks all for the responses, including to Bob for his ongoing assistance.  As for what I would like to do, I would like for my transport controls, track arming buttons and the knobs/faders to work in X3, as well as the arpeggiator and similar buttons, with a minimum of exertion. 
     
    As for the gent who seemed to indicate that I was lazy in not wanting to program things and should be duly ignored, I offer that I work 13-16 hours a day. I also parent a toddler.  As such, I have precious little free time.  I get great enjoyment out of making music, and prefer to do that in my downtime as opposed to programming a DAW. I hope that is somewhat understandable.
     
    I will try the above offered suggestions over the weekend and get back to you. Many thanks to all!
     
     
    #13
    Anderton
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 16:27:23 (permalink)
    anxiousmofo
    As for what I would like to do, I would like for my transport controls, track arming buttons and the knobs/faders to work in X3, as well as the arpeggiator and similar buttons, with a minimum of exertion.

     
    Then I think Dan's solution in post #11 is likely to be the ticket. 
     
    As for the gent who seemed to indicate that I was lazy in not wanting to program things and should be duly ignored, I offer that I work 13-16 hours a day. I also parent a toddler.  As such, I have precious little free time.  I get great enjoyment out of making music, and prefer to do that in my downtime as opposed to programming a DAW. I hope that is somewhat understandable.



    For some reason, we've had several people come in here lately (or maybe it's all the same person posting under an alt) claiming to be "professionals" who are soooo busy they can't be bothered to actually take the time to learn things or type a few words into a search engine. I think you were mistaken for one of those. 

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #14
    anxiousmofo
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 17:46:43 (permalink)
    I greatly appreciate the help from all and will report back as soon as I have had time to work through this. 
     
    For what it is worth, I googled at length trying to figure this out before I came here, and I consider learning to be a lifelong pursuit and pleasure. :)
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    Anderton
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 18:44:25 (permalink)
    anxiousmofo 
    For what it is worth, I googled at length trying to figure this out before I came here, and I consider learning to be a lifelong pursuit and pleasure. :)



    Well, then you're definitely not one of the usual suspects.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #16
    robert_e_bone
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/22 20:31:27 (permalink)
    Yup - you seem to be human, SO far.  :)
     
    Post back when you get a chance to try out some of the suggestions.
     
    Bob Bone
     

    Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
     
    Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
    Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
    Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
    Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others
    MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es
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    #17
    anxiousmofo
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/29 22:08:46 (permalink)
    So, I made some headway over the weekend using ACT, but not a complete solution.
     
    I first tried the suggestion in post 11, but the Akai MPK49 preset did not work at all with my MPK61.  I then downloaded and imported the MPK88 X2 preset file that Robert posted in post 9.  That got my basic transport working, but I am still unable to use the faders, rotary knobs or track arming buttons. I tried to work with the preset in order to get the rest of the stuff working, but screwed it up and had to delete the preset, reimport and start over.  I then ran out of time, but it is a start.
     
    I've appreciated the help thus far.  If anyone has any quick n' dirty tips on how to get the rest working, I would appreciate it, but will otherwise see if I can find what I need in the manual or online when time allows (read: someday?).
     
    I was pleased enough by the working transport that I did upgrade to Studio, for what it is worth. Hope I can get the rest in order. 
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    azslow3
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/30 05:17:51 (permalink)
    My first reply was "unfriendly", but Anderton has explained the reason.
    Well, you are "real human", so I should apologize for my (mis)behaviour. Please understand that I had a small problem with your original post: I see that I can try to help, but all my proposal are going to consume your time and you explicitly mark that you do not have it. From what I know there is no simple solutions (AKAI provides no special support for SONAR).
     
    There are several resources about ACT, but I can recommend my own site (see my signature), especially
    http://www.azslow.com/index.php/topic,107.0.html
     
    You can skip my jokes and my plug-in descriptions to save time, but from my knowledge that is the only complete description for ACT MIDI plug-in, with all limitations explained.

    Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro
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    #19
    anxiousmofo
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/30 11:54:40 (permalink)
    Thanks, azslow3.  I will definitely check out your site as time allows.  I hate to sound so busy, but I am.  My work schedule has been driving me up the wall, and I apologize for having that spill over here.
     
    I recognize how frustrating it can be when people come on forums expecting that there is a pushbutton magic trick to everything and that things should just fall in one's lap with no learning involved. There is craft and acquired skill in almost everything worthwhile, so that approach is largely BS.  That said, Sonar is the only DAW I have encountered where my Akai didn't work right out the gate; maybe I had just come to expect that sort of thing.
     
    Either way, making progress, and I appreciate the continued help!
    #20
    Anderton
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    Re: MMC in 64 bit Sonar X3e? 2014/07/30 15:53:01 (permalink)
    You might find this article helpful. It explains a different way to approach ACT that I find better-suited to my needs.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #21
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