SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This?

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konradh
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2014/07/20 18:08:56 (permalink)

SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This?

When adding a virtual instrument today—two years or more after going to X1!—I realized that there is an SI-Drum Kit (in addition to Session Drummer 3 and all the drum libraries I've added).  How did I never notice this before?
 
The cymbals are a little trashy and short for my personal style, and I am not wild about the toms, but I would absolutely use some of the kicks and snares.  For some people and styles of music, there would be lots of good sounds in here, especially with judicious processing.  Basically, more drum sounds for free!
 
That's one impressive thing about Sonar: it comes bundled with a LOT of stuff.

Konrad
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    jb101
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/07/20 19:16:29 (permalink)
    Hallo, Mighty Konrad.
     
    I think the SI drums came before Session Drummer 1 & 2, as part of the S.I. bundle - S.I. Strings, S.I. Drums and S.I. Electric Piano.
     
    I think the Drums were pretty good for their time, but agree that some of the snares and kicks could still be useful.  Pre-EZ2 release, I would now wax lyrical about Toontrack, but nuff said.  I am thinking of updating to Add Drums2.
     
    I still think the SI strings and Electric Piano can hold their weight..
     
    I recently opened an old project (Fusion kind of track) with S.I. Electric Piano in, and spent ages trying to replace it with Lounge Lizard (great E.P. vsti, IMO), until I realised that all I was trying to do was make Lounge Lizard sound like the original track.  Sometimes these synths just sit nicely in a mix.
     
    Hope all is well with you, Mighty K.
     
    Jonathan.

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    #2
    John
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/07/20 19:27:42 (permalink)
    The Studio Instruments are probably the most underrated synths around. They are simple and quick. Yet can sound good. Will they compete with Dimension Pro or Kontakt? No, but for quick work they can't be beat! 

    Best
    John
    #3
    scook
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/07/20 19:33:08 (permalink)
    Session Drummer predates all the sfz engine synths including the SI series and Session Drummer 2 and 3. It was an MFX plug-in used to create MIDI sequences. Years later (2006), Session Drummer 2 the sfz based drum synth was introduced with the SI series coming a year or so after it.
    #4
    konradh
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/07/20 19:38:44 (permalink)
    I am very happy with the SI-Elec Piano and use it a lot.  I have used the SI-Bass many times.  Now I that have Scarbee Jay Bass, P-Bass, and Rickenbacker as well as Craig's excellent Gibson 5-string, I don't use SI-Bass much, but there is nothing wrong with it.  To me, the default program sounds like a good Precision Bass recorded DI.

    Konrad
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    #5
    jb101
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/07/20 19:42:27 (permalink)
    konradh
    I am very happy with the SI-Elec Piano and use it a lot.  I have used the SI-Bass many times.  Now I that have Scarbee Jay Bass, P-Bass, and Rickenbacker as well as Craig's excellent Gibson 5-string, I don't use SI-Bass much, but there is nothing wrong with it.  To me, the default program sounds like a good Precision Bass recorded DI.




    Yeah, how could I forget the SI Bass.  I still use it when writing, and sometimes it stays there, even though I have a PJ and J bass siting in the corner.
     
     

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    robert_e_bone
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/07/20 20:01:56 (permalink)
    Just be aware that, to the best of my knowledge, it seems you cannot route kit pieces within SI-Drums to separate audio outputs, like you can in other drum synths.  (there is another thread within the past week about splitting SI-Drums).
     
    So, I suppose you would need a separate instance for each kit piece to accomplish separate control of each kit piece.
     
    Just be aware of that, (if I recall correctly from the other thread - I don't happen to use SI-Drums)
     
    Bob Bone
     

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    #7
    Splat
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/07/20 20:06:05 (permalink)
    Aren't they 32 bit? It was good software but that's what put me off them in the end. Call me fussy.

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    #8
    scook
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/07/20 20:13:01 (permalink)
    There are 32bit versions of the SI plug-ins but 64bit versions install with 64bit SONAR.
    #9
    Splat
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/07/20 20:47:02 (permalink)
    I stand corrected thanks...

    Sell by date at 9000 posts. Do not feed.
    @48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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    Tkrain
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/02 10:58:59 (permalink)
    I used to use SI Drums exclusively (when that was all I had)... 
    Splitting tracks is time consuming, but not terribly hard... you don't need separate instances, but you do need to use freezing or bouncing... (i.e. wait till you've set your drums in stone). 
    I used to solo the kick, freeze it, drag it to a new track, solo the snare, freeze it, drag it to a new track, etc. 
     
    Once I got EzDrummer, I never looked back at SI Drums, and now that I have AD2, I'll never look back at any of the others.

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    #11
    Anderton
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/02 11:05:05 (permalink)
    But let's not forget SD3, because you can create your own kits with it relatively easily. 

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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    gswitz
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/04 21:32:47 (permalink)
    I'm a big Session Drummer fan. I use it much more than Addictive Drumz 2. It's fun and I'm used to it.
     
    The SI one is fun too, but I'm faster at getting what I want with Session Drummer.

    StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen.
    I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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    musicroom
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/07 16:55:00 (permalink)
    I have a track template that has 2 instances of SI Drums loaded/tweaked/mixed to a sound I like. I use it a lot. I agree the cymbals are not my go to. But the kick and snares are very good. 

     
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    #14
    Anderton
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/07 17:47:54 (permalink)
    musicroom
    I have a track template that has 2 instances of SI Drums loaded/tweaked/mixed to a sound I like. I use it a lot. I agree the cymbals are not my go to. But the kick and snares are very good. 



    If you want cymbals, the Zildjian Digital Vault models are off-the-hook excellent. They don't sound "grainy" at all and have a beautiful transparency. Shop around, as prices vary wildly - street price these days seems to be $90, but I've seen it on special for as little as $25.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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    ...wicked
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/07 18:31:15 (permalink)
    The SI - Bass is extremely underrated. I used to use Broomstick bass and now use SI-Bass for all my idea-sketching. I'd say about half the time I don't even replace it when it's time to beef the track up. The instruments load fast and are CPU light, so great for quick idea capturing.
     

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    musicroom
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/08 10:15:12 (permalink)
    I want to throw a plug in for the SI Strings as well. Not quite EastWest, but I have been surprised at some of the sounds that can be tweaked from that VSTi. Again, sometimes more than one instance with different settings is always worth checking out if you're seeking richer sounds. They are all fairly light on the resources.

     
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    #17
    Grem
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/08 10:42:14 (permalink)
    gswitz

    but I'm faster at getting what I want with Session Drummer.



    I have to also agree with this. When I want quick, basic drums, Session Drummer 3 always gets the call. That's why I got some of the expansion packs for it. Sometimes it stays as the drummer.

    Grem

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    konradh
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/08 17:34:36 (permalink)
    I bought a number of expansion packs for SD3, but not all of them are useful.  When I want to load a single drum from a kit (like change kicks in a kit), some of the expansions have flac files instead of wav files.  Loading a flac into a kit results in a very low volume drum.

    Konrad
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    #19
    Beepster
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/08 18:12:50 (permalink)
    Just a brief note to all Session Drummer fans. If you see the Andy John's kit on sale (or even if you don't mind paying full price) snag it. It is minimalistic (compared to the AJ kits for other sequencers) but sounds spectacular.
     
    Aside from that... I am very much looking forward to having all my input experiments wrapped up so I can begin exploring the wide range of synths (and their patches) that came with Sonar... including the SI stuff.
     
    Fancy and complex is good but sometimes so is simple and "does what you need".
    #20
    RobertB
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/08 23:48:46 (permalink)
    musicroom
    I want to throw a plug in for the SI Strings as well. Not quite EastWest, but I have been surprised at some of the sounds that can be tweaked from that VSTi. Again, sometimes more than one instance with different settings is always worth checking out if you're seeking richer sounds. They are all fairly light on the resources.


    I have to second that.
    I picked up SI when it first came out, mostly out of curiosity.
    Bear in mind, SI was was conceived as a no frills VSTi to give new users a comfortable introduction to MIDI.
    It's not deep. It's not supposed to be. That's the whole idea.
    It's charm lies in its basicness.
    The drums, EP, and bass are ok, and then there's this really nice string section. It responds well to keyboard input.
    i personally believe that SI was a well executed project, and met its design target.
    It's not complicated, it just does it's thing, and it does it fairly competently.

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    konradh
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/11 13:45:39 (permalink)
    Beepster or others, I bought the Andy Johns kit a long time ago.  My issue is that if I try to load individual sounds from it—like a snare or a kick—I have to pick a flac file which plays at a very low volumes.  Some other kits have wavs that work well.  The kits with flac files will have a large number of files for each sound and loading just one sounds really bad.
     
    How does one pull a single sound from Andy Johns into a kit?

    Konrad
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    #22
    Beepster
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/11 14:36:14 (permalink)
    hmm... I can't recall whether I've tried to use a single kit piece like that (been a while since I used SD3 with the AJ kit). If I remember I'll try it out.
     
    However I'd imagine a brute force way around it would be to use two instances on SD3 (which IIRC is supposed to be pretty low impact as far as resources) and just write the MIDI drums so they send out to the correct instance.
     
    I've had really good experience with customer support from Platinum Samples so maybe drop them an email to see what's up. They're the ones who put out that kit. You should definitely be able to mix and match without any weirdness AFAIK. Maybe you didn't download all the files and are working with a more basic version of it or there has been an update or something.
     
    Now I'm curious.
    #23
    kitekrazy1
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/12 19:12:04 (permalink)
    gswitz
    I'm a big Session Drummer fan. I use it much more than Addictive Drumz 2. It's fun and I'm used to it.
     
    The SI one is fun too, but I'm faster at getting what I want with Session Drummer.




    I thought having AD as an upgrade promo was very strange.  It's like saying our included drummer is not as good as this one.   Session Drummer does have a larger library. 
    #24
    Anderton
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    Re: SI-Drums - How Did I Not Know This? 2014/08/12 22:47:36 (permalink)
    AD has those "miking options" like Room and Overhead, and a ton of effects and processors. It's more like Battery that way, except for not being able to load your own kits...which SD3 can do. Of course you can run SD3 with separate outputs and add as much processing as you want, but there's a high convenience factor with AD.
     
    Personally I think the two complement each other very well.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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