Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew?

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The Maillard Reaction
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2014/07/24 22:18:40 (permalink)

Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew?

...besides the RME UCX or UFX (cause I'm afraid his dad will get mad at me) :-)
 
My young nephew is an ace guitar rocker but he hasn't done any project recording. He owns some nice amps but he's become enamored with guitar modeling and the fantasy of having dozens of amps in a one stop interface. He's going to spend a day in the studio with me tomorrow and I'd like to help him set a goal for saving up and buying a low latency usb I/O box, a starter DAW, and an amp sim so he can get started with learning about recording.
 
It seems to me that the best way to start is with a small and low priced usb rig that has a great driver, but I haven't been paying much attention to what's best these days.
 
Thanks.
 


#1

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    RobertB
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/24 23:13:52 (permalink)
    Of course you will get all the usual suspects, but at least look at this one:
    http://www.akaipro.com/product/eiepro
    I took a chance on it, because I liked some of the special features it offers, and I couldn't be more pleased.
    The original drivers truly sucked, and spawned a lot of bad reviews, but the current (2.9.55) drivers are rock solid.
    I don't have any real amps here, so I am using amp sims exclusively. I also record a lot of soft synths played live.
    In both scenarios, low latency performance is crucial, and it hasn't let me down.
    Yes, it has an old school look to it, but those front panel controls offer a lot of flexibility.
    It absolutely cannot be USB powered, and requires the included 3.5 amp power supply.
    It's a sleeper, but for my money, it smokes other units in its price range($249)

    My Soundclick Page
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    Shimozu-Kushiari or Bob
    #2
    lawajava
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/24 23:35:26 (permalink)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRpCXWSC8TE

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwBR1OfHRtM

    Awesome for a zero latency experience and fantastic for guitars and microphones. Probably available around $250.

    Two internal 2TB SSDs laptop stuffed with Larry's deals and awesome tools. Studio One is the cat's meow as a DAW now that I've migrated off of Sonar. Using BandLab Cakewalk just to grab old files when migrating songs.
    #3
    Cactus Music
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 00:18:59 (permalink)

    Johnny V  
    Cakelab  
    Focusrite 6i61st - Tascam us1641. 
    3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
     http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
     
     
    #4
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 07:01:00 (permalink)
    Hi Robert,
     Thanks for the news about the Akai. I had helped a local with one of these a year or so back and remember the older drivers. That's some good news you have to share.
     
     Hi Lava,
      The KB37 format seems like it could be a great way for him to get started fast. Thanks for the idea.
     
     Hi Cactus,
       I'm a big fan of DAW bench, as it seems to focus on the more fully functional gear, but sometimes I think it seems both dated and incomplete. I've been thinking of "down grading" to a MOTU PCI-e 24 I/O and the chart reminded me why. :-)
     
     Thanks everyone.
     
     I thought I recalled there were a few cheap USB rigs that really outperformed the others for latency. The Roland boxes and the M-audio Ultras come to mind. Yes? No? Have the drivers for many of these devices achieved parity?
     


    #5
    Rimshot
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 09:19:53 (permalink)

    Rimshot 

    Sonar Platinum 64 (Lifer), Studio One V3.5, Notion 6, Steinberg UR44, Zoom R24, Purrrfect Audio Pro Studio DAW (Case: Silent Mid Tower, Power Supply: 600w quiet, Haswell CPU: i7 4790k @ 4.4GHz (8 threads), RAM: 16GB DDR3/1600 
    , OS drive: 1TB HD, Audio drive: 1TB HD), Windows 10 x64 Anniversary, Equator D5 monitors, Faderport, FP8, Akai MPK261
    #6
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 14:21:51 (permalink)
    Thanks Jimmy!


    #7
    clintmartin
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 17:21:59 (permalink)
    My Presonus 44VSL has a 7.3ms roundtrip latency.

    Cakewalk, Harrison Mixbus 4, Waveform 9, ADK intel i7 2600 3.40 ghz, 8gb Ram, Win 7, Presonus Audiobox 44VSL. 
    http://www.youtube.com/c/clintmartinmusic
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    https://open.spotify.com/artist/4x4TBz32i56bTJkgu7b4tN
     
     
     
    #8
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 18:26:31 (permalink)
    Thanks very much Clint.
     
    That is exactly the info I am looking for and it is also the info that seems so hard to find.
     
    The 44VSL was one unit I had eyeballed before posting the OP.
     
    I have also been looking at the M-audio M-Track Quad and that is because I think I recall the M-Audio ultra at having ultra quick drivers.
     
    May I ask; are you using a 128 sample buffer? If so, is there a 64 sample option?
     
    Thanks!


    #9
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 19:41:49 (permalink)
    I just learned that with the M-Track Quad you can only access the sample buffer size selection within the DAW. They don't have a separate driver dialog. It's unclear to me if "DAW" means Pro Tools only or if any DAW will access the sample buffer size selection.
     
    Crazy.


    #10
    RobertB
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 21:55:54 (permalink)
    I believe that would be via the ASIO Panel in Sonar.
    I know you could get to the M-Audio2496 that way, and my EMU-0404 and the Akai work the same way.
    The EMU had Patchmix to control routing, which was separate, but latency was controlled from within Sonar.
    Here's what I see with the Akai:

    I haven't pushed the 64 sample setting yet, because 128 is actually pretty comfortable, and feels a lot tighter than the numbers seem to indicate. I might check it out this weekend, because this newer machine is considerably more capable than anything I have had previously.

    My Soundclick Page
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    Shimozu-Kushiari or Bob
    #11
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 22:05:05 (permalink)
    Thank you Robert for posting that screen shot.
     
    It tells me what I am hoping to learn.
     
    For example; on my old Win XP machine my old MOTU firewire Traveler mk1 does approximately 3.5ms (measured by me using a loop back) round trip at 64 sample buffers.
     
    With SONAR, the way my MOTU drivers work seems similar to your AKAI works. If you open the Audio Console from within SONAR you actually open the same hardware's driver dialogs you can open from Windows.
     
    What I was reading about the new M-Audio M-Track Quad is that there is no way to open the drivers using just Windows... which even the M-Audio reps seem to think seems unusual. :-) The M-Audio rep couldn't speculate if there would ever be an update that allowed for that most basic option. 
    post edited by mike_mccue - 2014/07/26 06:31:58


    #12
    Rimshot
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 22:15:29 (permalink)
    I can get about 15ms round trip at 128K with the UR44 without audio glitches or dropouts. 
    Doesn't the speed of our PC's effect this round trip results?  I don't have the fastest PC that's for sure.
     

    Rimshot 

    Sonar Platinum 64 (Lifer), Studio One V3.5, Notion 6, Steinberg UR44, Zoom R24, Purrrfect Audio Pro Studio DAW (Case: Silent Mid Tower, Power Supply: 600w quiet, Haswell CPU: i7 4790k @ 4.4GHz (8 threads), RAM: 16GB DDR3/1600 
    , OS drive: 1TB HD, Audio drive: 1TB HD), Windows 10 x64 Anniversary, Equator D5 monitors, Faderport, FP8, Akai MPK261
    #13
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 22:22:03 (permalink)
    Hi Jimmy,
     The speed of the PC's CPU definitely factors into how small a buffer you can run before you experience glitches or drop outs, but the overall round trip speed or latency that you experience, at any given choice of sample buffer size, is determined by the hardware and its specific driver. In this day and age, a lot of the gear uses relatively generic hardware components so often times it is the software, or driver that is unique and separates the good from the very good choices.
     
     Thanks for letting me know about the UR44's round trip at the 128 sample buffer. That is very helpful info for our shopping adventure.


    #14
    scook
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/25 23:12:11 (permalink)
    The 44VSL @ 44.1 supports 64 sample buffer, X3 reports 4.9ms RTL
                            
    #15
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/07/26 06:39:12 (permalink)
    Thank you Scook.


    #16
    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/08/05 09:53:45 (permalink)
    The Presonus AudioBox VSL units are exactly what you're looking for, Mike.
    • 4.9ms round-trip latency at a 64-sample ASIO buffer size/44.1k
    • Solid drivers
    • Pretty good sound
    • Affordable

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
    jim@studiocat.com
    www.studiocat.com
    #17
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/08/05 09:57:45 (permalink)
    Thanks very much Jim.


    #18
    AT
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    Re: Lowest latency 2 or 4 channel USB I/O that I can recommend to my nephew? 2014/08/05 11:01:38 (permalink)
    Well Mike, don't recommend the Tascam UH-7000.  I have an 8 core computer (with a lot of dongles and such, although I haven't usb tuned it) and I get 10 ms roundtrip.  Superior sound but a tad expensive, so that knocks it out too.  But it is a great bit of kit.
     
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