Helpful ReplyOngoing midi problem...

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tindog13
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2014/08/30 11:33:57 (permalink)

Ongoing midi problem...

I'm not big on midi, too complicated for my feeble brain, but I do try to use it on occasion... but if I have any midi track (usually for drums or percussion) on my project I can't turn them off on my keyboard (Casio Privia PX-300), so that if I try to go back and play keyboard type part, piano or whatever, the keys sound both the keyboard and the drum sounds at the same time... I've turned local on and off, but that's the only suggestion I could find with a search. They only way I've been able to fix the issue is to dump my midi track to an audio track and delete the midi track, then reboot the keyboard. What am I missing?
#1
dwardzala
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 11:47:10 (permalink)
Once you have recorded the midi drum track, turn input echo off (it will change itself to auto thru, but that's ok).
Alternatively, you can select a different input on the midi drum (None).

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#2
tindog13
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 11:56:58 (permalink)
Hmmm, none of that worked... I have the Input Echo off, it does say "Input echo = Auto thru", that didn't fix the issue, and the midi Input won't let me change it to None... when I click it the drop down it says I've chosen None, but Omni remains in the window. The keyboard is still playing drum tones and key tones at the same time.
#3
Anderton
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 12:16:46 (permalink)
Make sure input echo is turned off on the drum track, not the one with the keyboard.
 
Try setting the drum track to respond to MIDI channel 16. I doubt the Privia is generating anything on that channel.

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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 12:28:07 (permalink)
Your Casio Privia PX-300 does not support Local off which is how one normally turns off a midi instrument.
 
Try setting you keyboard to transmit and receive on another channel.

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#5
tindog13
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 12:40:14 (permalink)
Setting the channel to 16 works... is that a work around or sop?
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Anderton
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 13:14:17 (permalink)
tindog13
Setting the channel to 16 works... is that a work around or sop?



Both. Don't know why turning off MIDI input echo doesn't work; it always works for me. In any event SOP is to set the receiving and transmitting channels differently so they won't communicate. Turning off input echo blocks MIDI data from arriving at the track, which is a more convenient solution.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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tindog13
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 16:35:15 (permalink)
Sadly, and frustratingly, I've never been able to get a handle on midi, so I use it sparingly, I was just hoping for a drum track with more precision... I'm also fighting with the Piano Roll method of inputting, (haven't figured out how to separate the parts for processing), between that and midi, I think I'll go to a movie. Thanks for the help, looks like a decent work around for me.
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Bajan Blue
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 18:01:02 (permalink)
I think when you start with Midi if you are not totally sure of what you are doing it can seem daunting - i know when i started with Midi back in the day i found it very challenging - but its worth persevering with because after a while all becomes much clearer! Instead of trying to record something specific why not just set aside some time just to play with some Midi and see if you can start to fathom it out - that's how i started to get to grips with it - i found that a better way than trying to sort it out when i wanted to record something i had in my head - and if you come across some things you can't sort out I'm sure there will be plenty here who can help with specific issues - cheers Nigel

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konradh
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 18:51:33 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Living Room Rocker 2014/09/03 12:18:37
The good news is that you are getting close to mastering MIDI.  Once you get the echo thing resolved and then understand MIDI channels, you will be able to do a lot.
 
You can then learn a few controllers here and there as you need them, read up on quanitizing, and you'll be pretty close to a MIDI expertl
 
For what it's worth, in Preferences | Playback and Recording | Playback I have a check by "Always echo current MIDI track."  Whenever I select a track, that track responds to my MIDI keyboard.  If I start hearing other instruments, I go to them and "unblue" them by turning off Input Echo.

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#10
robert_e_bone
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/30 20:57:40 (permalink)
Yup - with the option checked, as noted above, when you highlight a midi track, it should automatically set the midi Input Echo On to On, and when you click to highlight a different midi track, Sonar should turn it off for the track that is no longer highlighted, and should turn it 'on' for the newly-highlighted midi track.
 
You can manually turn additional midi track's midi input echo on on/off, if you want to hear a layered sound from multiple midi instruments responding.
 
Hope that helps, 
 
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Blades
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/08/31 13:08:39 (permalink)
Hey tindog13,
I find someone around here once in a while trying to do what you are with drum tracks that are midi recorded and want the triggered audio to be processed separately.  My answer is almost always Drum Maps.  Please go out to my website (signature) and follow through the Music - Sonar - Individual topics section, where you will find a video on how to use drum maps.  It's not terribly long and it goes over the process pretty much from start to finish and why you would want to use it.
 
Hope this helps.

Blades
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#12
tindog13
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/09/01 11:40:11 (permalink)
Thanks guys, I have a lot to learn I know, but I try to not stop producing just because I have to figure stuff out... I've been exposed to midi for over two decades now and it still doesn't sink in so I doubt it will... I'll check out the drum maps video for sure and try all the other suggestions here. But at least I was able to keep working.
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Anderton
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/09/01 11:50:27 (permalink)
Start here, and then consider my book "MIDI for Musicians." Yes, I'm plugging my book and yes, it was written years ago, but it's still valid and oriented toward beginners. There's also a Kindle version.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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tindog13
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/09/01 14:42:41 (permalink)
Hmmm, think I'll just keep shooting from the hip, glad you guys are here though. Could not follow that video... I think I finally figured out which windows you are working in (doesn't look quite like my X3) but when I created the map the notes stopped sounding, when I tried to rename the mod it just disappeared, and I could not see where or how you were assigning the individual drums to specific panning. Just way above my familiarity level which Sonar at this point, but I'll bookmark it and possibly come back to it. Love to be able to do what you're doing in there, exactly what I'm trying to do right now, just isn't clear enough to follow. Thanks though.
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Blades
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/09/01 19:03:56 (permalink)
Tindog13,  Yeah - that video was created with Sonar 5, so it's definitely been a while and many versions since I created it.  I've been meaning to get around to re-creating the video in the X3 software but just haven't had time to do so, especially since the drum maps themselves haven't changed a whole lot (unfortunately) in this many versions.
 
Sorry you weren't able to follow it.  If you are a midi "newbie", I imagine that it is really going a bit past the midi basics, but it IS worth the effort if you can try again to follow it.  I'm sure there are other drum map tutorials around that you could find to follow.
 
Good luck.

Blades
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Living Room Rocker
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Re: Ongoing midi problem... 2014/09/03 12:28:04 (permalink)
Thanks, Konrad!  I was wondering why no one had mentioned that setting.  I was going to post the same, but you beat me to it.
 
Kind regards,
 
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