Helpful ReplyPROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3

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Kamilion
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2014/10/23 22:16:58 (permalink)

PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3

Hello, I am so done with asio and all it's troubleshooting issues, but hopefully someone here can help before I have to just resort to the MME driver mode.
 
Here are my specs:
1. asio4all - version 2.12
2. SONAR X3 SETTINGS
    a. audio > devices > asio4all v2 IN (duo capture ex) 1 / asio4all v2 OUT (duo capture ex) 1
    b. audio > driver settings > Playback timing master > asio4all v2 OUT(duo capture ex) 1
                                             Record timing master >  asio4all v2 IN(duo capture ex) 1
    c. audio > playback and recording > driver mode > ASIO ------ASIO PANEL shows duo capture highlighted in green under               WDM list
    d. buffer size - 512
    e. playback I/O buffer size under sync and caching are both 512 kb
3. windows 8.1/64 bit/1 terrabite 
4. conexant smartaudio HD - This is what all my sound goes thru on my computer such as youtube, fl studio, everything!
5. Roland Duo Capture EX audio interface
6. Roland keyboard
 
Here's the problem: I was able to get sound and record audio from my keyboard into #2 and do everything just fine through #5 and #4.  However, I was experiencing latency and pops SO my problem came when I installed asio4all in order to get a better sound.  Per different forums it says to disable my computer soundcard, which I did (#4), and closed youtube, etc that uses audio then restarted my computer.  Sonar automatically checked all the asio devices above.  Now the only sound that comes through is humming and also the sound of the metronome that I used to record the audio(why would it playback the metronome?).  Sometimes NO sound comes through at all.  What's happening and how do I fix it?
 
**Only reply is you know the solution or can get me there step by step. Thanks!
 
 
 
#1
johnnyV
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/23 22:28:07 (permalink)
Wooh Nelly, who told you to install ASIO4all ? that's real bad advice. Please don't google "trouble with sound " ,, the internet will feed you bad advice, please ask your questions here , these folks know Sonar and interfaces inside out.  And nobody here will tell you to use asio4all because of the dozens of posts where it has caused huge issues with audio.  
You are someone who has a proper audio interface that comes with proper drivers.  You will have to uninstall asio4all COMPLETELY and I mean every trace of it. Then install the drivers that come from Roland and all will work perfectly. 

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#2
Kamilion
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/23 22:39:23 (permalink)
I got the advice from cakewalk technical support and many sonar and fl studio users whose tutorials seem to work just fine for them but asio NEVER agrees with me
#3
johnnyV
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/23 23:13:03 (permalink)
I find it hard to believe that Cakewalk staff would recommend using ASIO4all instead of the Roland driver. What was your issue when using the Roland ASIO driver? 

Sonar X3e Studio - Waiting for Professional
 Scarlett 6i6
Yamaha Gear= 01v - NSM 10 - DTX 400 - MG82cx
Roland Gear= A 49- GR 50 - TR 505 - Boss pedals
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Mackie Gear= Mix 8 - SRM 350's 
i5 Z97 3.2GHZ quad 16 Gig RAM W 8.1  home build
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#4
Kamilion
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/23 23:20:13 (permalink)
Whether it's hard to believe or not it happened.  Perhaps he wasn't biased..
#5
John
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/23 23:21:29 (permalink)
CW may have advised that some time ago when Sonar didn't support ASIO. LOL
 
If ASIO isn't working for you use WDM Kernel streaming. And when I say ASIO I am not talking about asio4all. No one should use it. 
 
 

Best
John
#6
Kamilion
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 00:59:36 (permalink)
yea CW did say ASIO not asio4all.  They seem to be used interchangably.  If someone has the answer on the setup of ASIO please help.  Thanks!
#7
johnnyV
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 03:12:09 (permalink)
Oh I see, anyway.. All one needs to do is install only the drivers that are found on the web site for the audio interface they are using. Disks that come with the interface are quickly out dated. So these days we all check the support link and see what's there. Here's yours:
 
http://www.rolandus.com/products/details/1248/download

Sonar X3e Studio - Waiting for Professional
 Scarlett 6i6
Yamaha Gear= 01v - NSM 10 - DTX 400 - MG82cx
Roland Gear= A 49- GR 50 - TR 505 - Boss pedals
Tascam Gear=  DR 40 - US1641 -
Mackie Gear= Mix 8 - SRM 350's 
i5 Z97 3.2GHZ quad 16 Gig RAM W 8.1  home build
Taylor mini GS - G& L Tribute Tele - 72 Fender Princeton - TC BH 250 - Mooer and Outlaw Pedals  Korg 05/RW
 
#8
John
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 03:26:04 (permalink)
ASIO is a driver model for audio devices developed by Steinberg to assure that their DAW would have a low latency multi channel driver that they could use to work with audio hardware. At first only Steinberg supported it. Then others found it useful too, especially developers that had cross platform DAWs. 
 
Windows had MME and later WDM drivers for streaming audio. Steinberg however choose not to support WDM so a enterprising coder created Asio 4 ALL so that hardware that had no ASIO driver could still work with Cubase by wrapping the MME or WDM driver within Asio 4 All. Asio 4 all is not ASIO. It is a converter of either MME drivers or WDM drivers so they appear as if they were ASIO to Cubase.
 
ASIO is a good and well understood driver model. Many people prefer it to WDM. Yet WDM is a more advanced model but it only works with Windows platforms plus it variants.
 
Sonar is one universal DAW under the Windows platform that support all Windows driver models.  It will not do well with a wrapper used to trick Cubase into thinking its dealing with a real ASIO driver. Its unnecessary and problematic. It puts a layer between the DAW and the hardware that can only slow things down and increase latency. To be fair it was never intended for DAWs that could handle Windows own drivers like Sonar.
 
Now you know why it is frowned upon here. 

Best
John
#9
Kamilion
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 04:26:03 (permalink)
Thanks Johnny I do have the latest version of the driver for my interface.
 
John, thanks for your post, but I've already read all that.  I think I've pretty much read everything about ASIO and/or asio4all, WDM, MME, Kernel streaming, API'S, directX, Kmixer, everything!  
 
I need to know WHY it's buzzing as I need to learn everything about audio and troubleshooting to make me that much more educated on audio, etc.  If something is not working, I'd rather know why so I can have a better understanding of everything that has to do with music and audio.  I don't know how your mind works, but that how mine works.
 
 
Again, anybody have the actual answer to my original question.  Thanks!
#10
lawp
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 08:15:10 (permalink)
fwiw, i've personally never had any trouble with asio4all, across multiple machines, xp and 7, 32/64, multiple daws, multiple soundcards, i still use it with my alesis photon x25 and laptop as the alesis drivers suck(ed) big time, and i also use it without issue with the same laptop with a numark dj interface...
 
try with another daw or audio app that supports asio, see if it still buzzes, this will remove asio4all from the equation (or not)
 
good luck!

sstteerreeoo ffllllaanngge
#11
johnnyV
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 11:07:58 (permalink)
What I'm saying is why are you using ASIO4all as your timing master? Get rid of it and use the Roland's drivers. Until you do that there's no way your system will be working properly as it should. 
Lawp you are using asio4all because you have an interface that is well known to come with bad drivers, You say you don't have issues? I bet  you'd see how crippling it is if you switched to a proper interface with good drivers. I speak from experience..long time ago I was in the same boat. 

Sonar X3e Studio - Waiting for Professional
 Scarlett 6i6
Yamaha Gear= 01v - NSM 10 - DTX 400 - MG82cx
Roland Gear= A 49- GR 50 - TR 505 - Boss pedals
Tascam Gear=  DR 40 - US1641 -
Mackie Gear= Mix 8 - SRM 350's 
i5 Z97 3.2GHZ quad 16 Gig RAM W 8.1  home build
Taylor mini GS - G& L Tribute Tele - 72 Fender Princeton - TC BH 250 - Mooer and Outlaw Pedals  Korg 05/RW
 
#12
Splat
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 11:15:45 (permalink)
As others have said please get rid of ASIO4ALL.

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@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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#13
Grem
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 11:40:10 (permalink)
If there is a buzz, what about a cord being bad?
 
And like the others suggest, try a different driver/DAW to make sure it's not a cord or something else.
 
As for ASIO4ALL, I have had mixed results with it. I tried it on this PC back when I still had a old dual core Penti in it. It was a hit and miss to get it to work.
 
Now I have an AMD 6core and am using the Realtec drivers in WDM/KS for now. I never use this PC for recording. Just playing around and testing mostly.

Grem

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#14
lawp
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 12:18:13 (permalink)
Well I also have a edirol ua-1000 and a esi waveterminal 192 m, can't say I've noticed... But you're correct in saying the alesis has crap drivers ;-)
"ymmv" of course

sstteerreeoo ffllllaanngge
#15
azslow3
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 16:13:56 (permalink)
I use ASIO4ALL for several devices. It wins every time compare to all not native ASIO approaches with the same hardware.
 
But in case there is a working native ASIO driver, it should be used instead (as was mentioned several times already).
 
For ASIO4ALL: in case there are more then one audio device exists in the system, ASIO4ALL will by default connect to all of them and neither are going to work. You can disable not required devices in the ASIO4ALL settings (I do not mean SONAR settings), and do not forget to restart the driver/system after that change. Start with really big buffer, like 1024. From my experience ASIO4ALL can not go really low with USB devices.
 
For hardware: check that you do not have any USB hub / long cables between your interface and the computer. Start testing with all other USB devices (and hubs) disconnected. Try several ports before you come to any conclusion (depending from the system, different ports can even have different hardware on computer side and in all cases interrupts distribution makes some ports better then other).
 
With Latency Monitor check that you do not have something "heavy".
 
I could always get ASIO4ALL working ok, even on 10m long USB extender with hub and crappy interface. But I will not claim I could enjoy playing software synth throw such system
 

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#16
lawp
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 16:45:11 (permalink)
+1 for checking asio4all is only wrapping a single device

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#17
lawp
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 16:46:45 (permalink)
And, I use asio4all for "live " situations, never for recording

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#18
lawp
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 16:47:20 (permalink)
Well, I say "never "...

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#19
dubdisciple
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 17:02:23 (permalink)
asio4all can be very polarizing on this forum.  those who hate it tell everyone to never use it under any circumstances and some will testify how well it has worked for them. I can't think of any reason to use asio4all if you already have a interface with decent drivers.  There are a few cheap interfaces that have drivers so poor  that it is a possibility, but if the interface is that bad, you may be better off using WDM.  With that said, asio4all has been a lifesaver when using laptops or underpowered computers without an interface.  CPU effecient programs like FL studio and Acid work on very modestly powered computers using asio4all. i know some of the resident tech snobs here claim it only hurts , but I have seen firsthand times when asio4all worked when all other methods failed misreably.  perhaps it is a mass delusion, but it a mass delusion that has allowed many people who were not in the position to upgrade computer and/or interface to use various audio software.  In fact at the studio i work at, we have two computers that have FL studio running with asio4all (fl studio actually gives option to install asio4all during install) and they work fine.  no clicks, pops or any other problems.   I wouldn't recommend it for programs like Sonar, Cubase, Pro Tools, but it can be useful for lightweight programs for people on budget.
#20
lawp
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 17:37:53 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby dubdisciple 2014/10/24 18:05:07
I think the key is to always do your own research

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#21
tlw
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Re: PROBLEM GETTING SOUND WITH Asio4all AND SONAR X3 2014/10/24 21:41:48 (permalink)
1. ASiIO4ALL may help if you had to use the conexant sound chip, which has no low-latency drivers of its own. ASIO4ALL can be useful under those circumstances, but can be a beast to get working. However, you don't need ADIO4ALL because you have a Roland interface that has its own ASIO drivers. Roland drivers are generally very good, work well and are far easier to get working than trying to configure ASIO4ALL.

2. Your lack of sound/buzzing may be a driver problem, it may be a hardware issue (even something as simple as a bad lead or an earth loop) or it may be a routing problem in how you have set up routing in Sonar or the interface itself. As a first step eliminate the driver problem by uninstalling ASIO4ALL and checking the only driver Sonar can see is the Roland one.

3. Having done that open Windows control panel/system and check in the devices list that there are no other audio devices showing other than the Roland. If there are, right click on them and disable (not uninstall) them. Video drivers often load HDMI audio drivers, and unless your screen has speakers and uses them, right click on the devices and disable them. Check the entries under game controllers as well because such drivers often turn up there.

4. Set the Roland interface to be your default sound device in Windows/control panel/sounds. Windows will now route all audio from any application through that. I suggest setting the Windows sound scheme to "none" and checking in the sound scheme tick boxes that all the Windows sounds are set to none. Now open iTunes, media player or similar and try playing back audio from your drive, a CD or even youtube. If that works OK you now know that the interface works properly and speakers etc. are connected correctly.

Once you've got that far we can then start to look at audio routing in Sonar and the dropouts/clicks and pops. There are free applications that monitor the PCI bus latency in the computer. PCI bus latency is the delays while Windows, drivers and hardware catch up with queued jobs and do their thing. If that latency is too high then the result is audio dropouts, pops etc. in Sonar or any other DAW. Wireless network adaptors are the most common cause of PCI bus latency and for that reason it's usually necessary to disable them in control panel/system. You may find that solves the dropouts problem on its own.

If not there's still many things that can be looked at, especially to do with power savings settings, but let's go one step at a time.

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