Helpful ReplyWell it's official, Ebola is here in NYC.

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sharke
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2014/10/23 21:39:44 (permalink)

Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC.

Over the past few weeks I've just become angryed beyond my wildest dreams at the sheer stupidity of people involved in this outbreak. Coming home from infected areas of Africa and going out for soup, flying on planes, taking cruises, you name it. Some of them so-called health "professionals." The selfishness and recklessness of these idiots just fills me with despair. 


So the latest idiot flies home to New York after working with Ebola victims in Africa, becomes sick with a fever and has now been tested positive for the disease in Bellevue hospital just a little ways up from me on 1st Avenue. And what was he doing the night before the fever started? Why he took an Uber cab to Brooklyn and went bowling. Now that place has been closed down until further notice and god only knows what will happen to it. It'll probably end up costing them hundreds of thousands in lost revenue and disinfection, that's if they don't lose their business entirely. 
 
All because a "doctor" (and I use the term loosely) decided that quarantine wasn't for him and that he'd just head out into the throngs of New York and have a night out on the town. Yes I am ******* livid. God knows how many lives he's put at risk. They should strike him off. Grrrr!

James
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#1
clintmartin
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/23 22:04:19 (permalink)
I completely understand and agree with everything you said...and I'll add, it's utterly stupid to allow anyone into this country from those areas until they have waited in quarantine and are 100% sure they are not infected. It's common sense.

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#2
backwoods
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/23 22:17:05 (permalink)
They all should have listened to Bill O'Reilly.
#3
sharke
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/23 22:19:55 (permalink)
I cannot believe the hubris of some of these healthcare "professionals" involved in this. And frankly I'm becoming very cynical about the motive of some of the people who go out to work with Ebola patients in Africa. Not everyone of course, but especially this guy. I have a feeling he thought his Doctors Without Borders involvement would look good on his resume and score him brownie points, not least of all give him something to brag about at dinner parties. If he's so unconcerned about the lives of the people at home that he goes out on the town days after returning home, BEFORE he was given the all clear, and reportedly AFTER he started feeling "sluggish" the day before, then what does that say about him as a humanitarian? Well, I guess he wasn't going to get any social media brownie points for showing humanitarian concern for the people of New York was he. 

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#4
Leadfoot
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/23 22:25:25 (permalink)
My wife and I were just discussing what a stupid, selfish move it was.
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michaelhanson
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/23 22:44:11 (permalink)
We have been saying all of these same things in Dallas for several weeks now. I don't understand why we are not taking this seriously, shutting down flights from the infected areas of N Africa and quarantining any one who has come from these areas for 21 days. This could get completely out of control if pockets of Ebola start popping up all over the U.S..

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#6
sharke
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/23 23:07:40 (permalink)
To be honest I'm not that worried about catching it myself. It's the people he's come into direct contact with that I'm angry for. His girlfriend is probably going to be infected. The people who live in his building in Harlem are bound to be freaking out. Bellevue isn't one of the best organized hospitals in New York, that's for sure - and you can bet your ass that, like most other hospitals which have been involved with this disease, mistakes are being made and protocols being ignored by careless people. I have first hand experience with Bellevue and how it's run. Not that impressed. You can also bet your ass that there will have been some careless people involved in his transportation from Harlem to Bellevue too. I know all too well how things go down in this city....lol!
 
And what about the bowling alley he went to last night? They possibly stand to lose their business after this. Hysteria or not, who's going to want to go to the Ebola Alley? At the very least they're going to have to clean and disinfect the place from top to bottom. Yet no matter how thoroughly they do that, you know what people are like: "Shall we go to the bowling alley?"..."No way man, that dude with Ebola was there..."
 

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Kalle Rantaaho
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/24 01:22:51 (permalink)
I've been wondering that lack of quarantine as well. I would've guessed it's the most obvious and effective action. We're going to pay dearly for that, maybe.

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fwrend
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/24 08:31:54 (permalink)
Yep, my wife is an RN and night house supervisor. It gets more concerning than that. Out of the blue the sup's were told they were responsible for training all the nurses on protocol. Wait, shouldn't that mean we should be trained? So, after working her 4th straight 12 hour shift she had to stay three more hours and sit in front of a TV screen with a handout and watch a video. Really??

Then there are the hospital administrators whose bottom line is $$$ - "oh the gowns and gloves will suffice - let's tape up some plastic sheeting in this hallway and we can contain them there." Really?

Then there are the beauro-politi-speaks fluent in vague speech (to save their own butt) who have no clue how to contruct and implement a basic plan of action and see it through. Really?

This isn't a panic thing - it's a reasonable, responsible, logical attempt at conversation and action. But it only works if the above are actually honest, forthright, & willing to do the hard thing regardless of cost or inconvenience.
#9
spacealf
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/25 16:51:20 (permalink)
Ya, Remember Washington D. C. has Obola and something may have to be done to New York to contain the Ebola, while the rest of the Nation concerns its self with Ibola, and Ubola, and the Abola goes away in every detail with rubber rooms and others dressed up in costumes containing it all.
 
You may have to just consider to leave the Big Rotten Apple in the end.
 
 
 

 
 
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mgh
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/25 17:13:15 (permalink)
yes, these selfish ****s who are risking their lives trying to help some of the folks in the poorest countries in the world with an epidemic which is killing over 50% of those infected...thank God you are able to fire up Sonar in NYC!
 
 
 
I seriously cannot believe your post and really really hope you a long and happy life. Unlike this poor doctor may have.

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mgh
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/25 17:30:08 (permalink)

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sharke
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 00:11:40 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby jbow 2014/10/26 15:27:39
mgh
yes, these selfish ****s who are risking their lives trying to help some of the folks in the poorest countries in the world with an epidemic which is killing over 50% of those infected...thank God you are able to fire up Sonar in NYC!
 
 
 
I seriously cannot believe your post and really really hope you a long and happy life. Unlike this poor doctor may have.



 
Well yours seems to be a common response to anyone who has a problem with this doctor breaking his quarantine to have a night out on the tiles, so I'll address it. 
 
First of all, traveling to Africa to help others isn't a blank check to come home and show an immediate disregard for the health and safety of the people in this country. I don't know why people think it is. Yes, helping the sick and poor is a virtue, we get it. But the guy is supposed to be a doctor, and just a few days after returning home from a gig in which he was at a high risk of contracting the disease, and a full day after he reportedly started "feeling sluggish," he decides that screw this quarantine, I'm going out for meatballs and bowling in one of the busiest cities in the world and I'm going to use public transport. Remember at this point, as far as he was concerned, he might well have Ebola. Did he stop to think what would happen to the businesses he visited should he turn out to test positive? Already they've had to be disinfected from top to bottom at great expense, not to mention any business they may have lost. What if, in his "sluggish" state, he'd suddenly taken a turn for the worse on the subway and vomited? I've sure as hell had the onset of a bout of flu happen during a subway ride before. Got on feeling a little sluggish, and half an hour later I had a cold sweat and was aching all over. Symptoms can come on very quickly. 
 
We're continually told that there was no risk. But if there's no risk involved when a "possible" Ebola patient breaks his quarantine and mingles in crowds, then why a 21 day quarantine in the first place? Why bother? The quarantine period is there for a reason, and it's vital that people who have been identified as "at risk" stick to it. Easy enough to comprehend, yes? So spare me this "how dare you" crap, please. 
 
I read your New York times article, and others like it. Yes the flu kills more people than Ebola. But that's because we haven't had an outbreak of Ebola before, and people generally aren't whisked away to isolation units by hazmat teams when they get it. The flu is, to the vast majority of people, a low risk virus. It only really kills people who are weak to start off with. Ebola has a much higher mortality rate and can kill a strong, fit person very quickly. If it started spreading like flu due to the carelessness of a few people, you could start seeing a hell of a lot more deaths than flu. I really hate this whole "condition X or disease Y kills more people than Ebola" argument. You could say that about anything. Why worry about prostrate cancer, when more people die of breast cancer? Why worry about gun deaths, when more people die of drink driving accidents? The point is that no matter which way you spin it, people are quite legitimately worried about a possible outbreak of a virus which has an extremely high mortality rate. Which is why Dr. Ebowla's getting such a bad press. 

James
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#13
Kalle Rantaaho
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 07:55:06 (permalink)
mgh
yes, these selfish ****s who are risking their lives trying to help some of the folks in the poorest countries in the world with an epidemic which is killing over 50% of those infected...thank God you are able to fire up Sonar in NYC!
 
 
 
I seriously cannot believe your post and really really hope you a long and happy life. Unlike this poor doctor may have.




Being unselfish doesn't authorize you to risk tens of thousands of lives. Anyone who has worked in the ebola area in Africa, should know even better than the rest of us, how careful one should be. If anyone, a doctor should understand that.
 
If ebola becomes something like a pandemia, or even close, it happens with the help of people who think that "it doesn't happen to me". In that fight "something like it" or "that's about it" doesn't do. The precautions and attitudes must be extremely strict and exact. The line between life and death can be so incomprehensibly thin. Like in the case of the nurse: One accidental reflex, a split second, touching your face when changing clothes. And that's it.
 
 

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dubdisciple
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 12:52:58 (permalink)
I will avoid the political aspect of this convo other than to say, Bill O'Reilly is one of the last people I would listen to. I think the doctors involved in this, like most people have admirable and not so admirable traits. It is wonderful they risk themselves to help others. At the same time it is absolutely irresponsible and effed up to not quarantine themselves afterwards. Humans, even trained professionals do things without thinkong at times like coughing. A sudden hearty laugh can project spit in the air. I know I am not the only person who has had someone speaking to me so enthusiastically that they accidently spit on me. Doctors should understand this better than most and act accordingly. 21 days of quarantine sucks but is the smart thing to do. With that said, as scary as ebola is, the mass panic thing scares me more. If it's any comfort to anyone, I have simulated scenarios of making an ebola like virus on the game Plague Inc and it is pretty hard to wipe out humanity with it and my variation was like Ebola on steroids ;)
#15
sharke
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 12:56:26 (permalink)
Ha apparently sales of Plague Inc have shot up over the last few weeks. I had it on my phone a year or so ago but lost interest for some reason, even though it seemed like a really cool game. I think I was obsessed with Blendoku at the time. 

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#16
dubdisciple
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 13:53:26 (permalink)
I got the expansion packs and havebeen enjoying the guilty pleasure of using the zombie like virus and the planet of the apes one. Also enjoyed the black death and smallpox immensely. What's wrong with me!!! The game does make you see some of the benefits of living in greenland. Live narwals and better chance of surviving plague!
#17
bayoubill
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 13:55:22 (permalink)
Why do I get the feeling all this attention from the media and government is more than ebola going on? 

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#18
dubdisciple
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 15:08:40 (permalink)
bayoubill
Why do I get the feeling all this attention from the media and government is more than ebola going on? 

I would guess because you lean towards distrust of government in general, particularly current administration. That's not a judgement or anything, just seems obvious. :) I do love how whether I read leftwing or rightwing rhetoric regarding things like ebola it gets spun into virtually the same rhetoric but ebola specific on why [insert hated group of choice here] is up to something..blah blah [ insert insulting generalization or conspiracy].

Ebola scare will likely blow over just like the last few disease scares have. Yes, this one will change some things like how volunteers/medical workers coming from high risk areas are handled, but we will just get on to the next thing to be outraged by in no time. HIV made many changes to how we go about simple things. Remember when athletes could continue to play while dripping blood? That seems crazy now but when I played childhood sports my coach would have ripped my head off if I asked to come out due to blood unless I was gushing like a geyser.
#19
bayoubill
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 15:48:34 (permalink)
I would guess because you lean towards distrust of government in general
 
 
So many agendas,so little time

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#20
bayoubill
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 15:56:00 (permalink)
That reminds me. When I was playing high school football I think I received 2 concussions in a game. I remember being taken to the side lines by someone. My head hurt. Coach put me right back in.  The next hit I received is kinda foggy and all I remember is asking my grandma what was for supper.  
 

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#21
dubdisciple
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 16:43:55 (permalink)
bayou..things have changed.  i recall playing with cracked ribs once.  Not sure if that stuff made us tougher, dumber or both.
#22
jbow
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 18:23:42 (permalink)
bayoubill
I would guess because you lean towards distrust of government in general
 
 
So many agendas,so little time


Since it is legal for the government to lie to us and all the agencies, directors, spokes people, etc seem to make a habit of it, no matter the agency... CDC included, it is hard to trust them. Then again, I'm sure they know what is best for us.
 
J

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#23
dubdisciple
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 19:30:26 (permalink)
I had hoped bad attempts at humor would keep this from becoming political.  I don't trust anybody.  Hell, my kids might kill me in my sleep (jk..they love me..I think).  My lack of worry about Ebola is not about trusting the CDC or government.  It's about science. Ebola's deadly nature is exactly what makes it less likely spread in the way that historically deadly plagues have. Obviously it sucks for the relatively few people who do die, in the same way that it sucks when people slip in tubs and die, but all of us have a better statistical chance of neing struck by lightning twice than getting Ebola.  I'm playing Plague inc now and waiting for the CDC to ask my advice since I managed to infect and destroy the world within a year without anyone being aware there was a disease!!! Benign parasite that is so mild nobody bothers eve ngoing to the doctor that I mutated practically overnight to cause massive organ hemorrhaging  and failure.  7 billion dead within weeks!! I mock Ebola!!
#24
backwoods
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 19:35:03 (permalink)
I'm more worried about antibiotic resistance than ebola. 
 
But Africans don't fly around the place like Americans so Ebola has that going for it if it somehow got introduced to polite american society :)
 
disclaimer: I have never played Plague Inc.
#25
dubdisciple
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 19:47:12 (permalink)
backwoods
I'm more worried about antibiotic resistance than ebola. 
 
But Africans don't fly around the place like Americans so Ebola has that going for it if it somehow got introduced to polite american society :)
 
disclaimer: I have never played Plague Inc.


LOL  Every time i tried to simulate Ebola West and Central Africa got annihilated with scattered deaths around the world. Cure is always found within two years. I think the developer is trying to tell us something about Canadians because many times when I have had a truly pandemic disease, Canada took the step of bombing their own cities to kill the infected. We have some hardcore neighbors to the north!
#26
Mosvalve
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/26 23:36:36 (permalink)
jbow
bayoubill
I would guess because you lean towards distrust of government in general
 
 
So many agendas,so little time


Since it is legal for the government to lie to us and all the agencies, directors, spokes people, etc seem to make a habit of it, no matter the agency... CDC included, it is hard to trust them. Then again, I'm sure they know what is best for us.
 
J


The head of the CDC is not lying when he say's it's hard to catch Ebola because he said this and I quote, " You can't catch Ebola on a bus you can only give it" Ok enough said.

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#27
sharke
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/27 00:13:23 (permalink)
Obama made the following statement a couple of weeks ago: "Ebola is not spread through the air like the flu.."
 
But on the CDC's own website: http://www.cdc.gov/vhf/ebola/transmission/qas.html
 
"Although coughing and sneezing are not common symptoms of Ebola, if a symptomatic patient with Ebola coughs or sneezes on someone, and saliva or mucus come into contact with that person’s eyes, nose or mouth, these fluids may transmit the disease."
 
But coughing and sneezing don't have to be symptoms of Ebola for someone with Ebola to cough or sneeze on you. People get things stuck in their throat which tickle; they breathe in dust which makes them sneeze. 
 
Opinion seems to vary about whether or not you can contract it from sweat, although the W.H.O. says you can. It certainly seems to be able to survive on dry surfaces for a few hours. So you could have a scenario whereby a carrier experiences the onset of symptoms but, figuring they just have the flu, decided to go to work anyway. They wrap up in warm winter clothing and get on the subway, where they immediately start to sweat (I know I do with my winter clothing on). They wipe their sweaty brow with their hand and touch a subway pole. There's your virus, right there on the pole. Some unsuspecting straphanger touches the pole after them, then scratches the corner of their eye. Boom. 
 
This is the kind of scenario which will spread the disease quite quickly if a critical number of people contract it. The danger is that it'll start spreading to unsuspecting people who have no idea they've been in contact with an Ebola carrier. It's one thing to see it spread among the people who have been knowingly in contact with a carrier (like the girlfriend of Dr. Spencer, and those who treat him). Those kinds of cases can be tracked and contained. But if it starts spreading among people who really have no idea they're at risk of having it, you'll have people getting onto public transport with the onset of symptoms because they think it's just a regular bout of cold or flu. Of course by the time they realize it's more serious than that, the damage has already been done. That's why it's so important to contain a virus like this and why Dr. Spencer was so irresponsible. 

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#28
Vastman
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/27 00:51:30 (permalink)
Oh, boy have you guys raised an issue....This is far more complex and deep than the MassMedia is playing at and the utter STUPID prison planet fools are spewing about... and Sharke, your NYC problem is just the tip of many icebergs... while we may get this under control, it doesn't look good...
 
I deal extensively in climate change, collapse, and other long range planetary scenarios...have been an infomaniac/futurist my entire life...I know lots of heavies in the field and spent most of my early life running long range scenarios for the Office of Special Programs in GAO. I chuckle at the "conspiracies" and other simplistic (although often true but irrelevent) boiling down of huge issues into little bits of stupid ranting.  Humans are a very flawed species... and, while it may seem harsh to all of us living in our little "bubbles", ebola may just whittle down the population to a level where planetary survival is possible.  We don't have an effective system to contain this; too busy cutting budgets to bail out the rich, all of whom are at risk.  And your call for quarantine is typically ignorant human hysteria...OReilly?  OMG!
 
Might want to give these two links a perusal...They're the best REAL thinking I've seen on this situation and you won't hear it on cable/network mush...
 
http://cluborlov.blogspot.ca/2014/10/ebola-and-five-stages-of-collapse.html This is chilling and not a bunch of stupid "government plot" crappola ala Alex Jones garbage...Dmitri nails what may very likely to evolve. 
 
http://thearchdruidreport.blogspot.com/2014/10/the-buffalo-wind.html?m=1 This is an eloquent post by
John Michael Greer, a deep and prescient thinker in these trying times...while Dmitry is wham bam thank you mam, jmg is truly magical... He will walk you through the trajectory we are on, both the efforts to save parts of the eaarth and the avalanche we are bumbling towards...
"... the current shudderings of the economy, the imminent risk of pandemic, and the distant sound of buffalo bellowing in the Montana wind are omens. The Buffalo Wind is rising now, keening in the tall grass, whispering in the branches and setting fallen leaves aswirl. I could be mistaken, but I think that not too far in the future it will become a storm that will shake the industrial world right down to its foundations." This on top of a rapidly eroding planetary climate system... which anyone who spends a moment digesting any of this: http://www.ecoshock.info/ and the associate links/podcasts on endless tipping points we are cascading over... Being an infomaniac these days is very challenging....creating edible gardens bonds me to eaarth... being a songwriter keeps me both sane and in tears...   
post edited by Vastman - 2014/10/27 01:12:36

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backwoods
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Re: Well it's official, Ebola is here in NYC. 2014/10/27 02:20:16 (permalink)
deleted. 
post edited by backwoods - 2014/10/27 02:36:21
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