Helpful ReplyThe "Sonar X4 Release + Survey Question Speculation" katamari super thread.

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jbow
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/30 13:12:41 (permalink)
Who am I kidding... I'm not going anywhere. I'll roll with whatever Cakewalk does. I've never been treated poorly by Cakewalk so I'll give whatever is decided a chance and more.
 
BTW X4 link: X4
 
J

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Anderton
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Re: Is it true, that cake is moving to a subcription plan? 2014/10/30 13:13:51 (permalink)
scook
There faces should still be egg free. From what I have read there has been no comments about future purchasing and licensing schemes of Cakewalk products. There have been comments about the survey and product delivery.



True. The only official comment I saw was that implementing the Adobe model was highly unlikely, or words to that effect.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
InstrEd
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Re: Is it true, that cake is moving to a subcription plan? 2014/10/30 13:20:05 (permalink)
Off topic I know but,
I wish Cakewalk would add Gift Cards to buy. My wife knows I like Cakewalk products and it would be an
easy gift to get me.

Instred
Chicagoland, IL 

mettelus
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 13:37:36 (permalink)
+1
 
I definitely appreciate when Noel takes the time to post here and give us the "why" candidly. It is rare to see this in any forum. The CW folks (all of them) go "above and beyond" many times in ways that we sometimes take for granted...
 
... now for our coffee mugs!!!

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deswind
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Re: Is it true, that cake is moving to a subcription plan? 2014/10/30 13:50:44 (permalink)
If they need money, charge for special updates and features.  For instance, I would not mind paying $$ for more color options.
post edited by deswind - 2014/10/31 20:46:28
Anderton
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 13:55:06 (permalink)
kitekrazy1
I can understand the paranoia because of Sonar now being a Gibson product and people don't trust them based on history.

 
Well, compare the history of pre-Gibson X2 to post-Gibson X3. FWIW last time I checked, Stanton's market share of turntables was close to 50%, KRK's Rockit series is still #1 in monitors, and TASCAM has had their best year in a long time. So they're all doing OK by Gibson. Remember, Henry uses SONAR as his only DAW and has since the days of DOS. He'll do anything to keep the company in business 
 
BTW those auto tuners on the new Gibsons are not well received by their fans

 
Depends on who you ask, and whether they've actually used the tuners or not. A lot of traditionalists don't like the idea of a piece of electronics on their guitar, which I understand. But others like having something that tunes all six strings simultaneously in seconds and makes alternate tunings practical.
 
I originally thought a self-tuning guitar was unnecessary. However now I would not want a guitar without it. Last weekend while SONAR was running, I tuned up between verses without stopping the transport. It's also a godsend when recording sound libraries, where the tuning has to be perfect all the time. 
 
I've had subscription software before and eventually cancelled it because it seems the value eventually ends or I feel the developer isn't living up to their end.

 
This is one of the fundamental differences I see between a magazine subscription and an Adobe subscription: The magazine has to do something literally every 30 days to convince you that it's worth renewing your subscription, because it costs a lot more money to sign up a new subscriber than retain an existing one. Adobe will automatically retain existing subscribers as long as those subscribers need the program to do their work. 
 

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
Andrew Rossa
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Re: Is it true, that cake is moving to a subcription plan? 2014/10/30 14:51:57 (permalink)
joden
What will be funny, is the egg on faces if CW do move in this direction. Maybe these comments should be bookmarked for when CW "heavies"  come out at a later date and say it will be subs based after all. Well they could always trot out the old line  "...well we believed what we were saying at the time..."  that amongst a plethora of other "valid reasons and excuses" for CW being forced down the (subscription) path


 
Great, definitely bookmark this thread :)
 
Andrew Rossa
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/30 14:58:33 (permalink)
paulo
Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]
 
 
This survey wasn't about a bunch of bean counters trying to maximize profits. It's about us understanding how customers use our software and other products in the market place. Pure market research. And the goal is to help improve SONAR and also make the experience better for customers. 




I remain curious as to why you don't ask all of them ?




That's literally impossible to do...some customers don't want to be contacted or don't open their emails. We worked with some pros to figure out the right amount that would make it statistically significant. We've definitely done that. We feel good about the data we received.
 
The interesting thing is that the answers really didn't change much over time. The first 100 people answered about the same way the first 1000 did and so on.

I'm still not sure why you don't get emails. We've tried to fix the problem a few times. PM your current email again and I'll see what we can do to fix it.
...wicked
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Re: Is it true, that cake is moving to a subcription plan? 2014/10/30 15:25:17 (permalink)
Holy jeebuz, can we get all these threads merged already? 

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...wicked
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 15:26:25 (permalink)
Yeah, so like I said, moving us to a "pay $9/mo instead of $200/yr" and having it allow Cake to roll out updates as they complete them instead major versions every 12 months sounds good to me. 

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The Fog People
===========

Intel i7-4790 
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Win10/64   

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swamptooth
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 15:35:20 (permalink)
I'm just getting a chuckle reading these threads on an android and seeing a big blue button after thr last post that says "subscribe"! :)

 
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scook
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 15:38:09 (permalink)
Android or not, someone subscribed to something in order to post anything here.
cincyjack
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 15:49:43 (permalink)
Glad Noel weighed in.
My experience with subscriptions is that the vendor touts "more frequents updates" but new features are added with about the same frequency, roughly once per year.
I support CW operating as efficiently as possible in all of our interests.
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
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Re: Is it true, that cake is moving to a subcription plan? 2014/10/30 16:59:27 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby swamptooth 2014/10/30 23:24:17
...wicked
Holy jeebuz, can we get all these threads merged already? 


Your wish is my command. 

Welcome to the katamari. 

Best Regards,
Seth
paulo
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/30 17:02:53 (permalink)
Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]
paulo
Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]
 
 
This survey wasn't about a bunch of bean counters trying to maximize profits. It's about us understanding how customers use our software and other products in the market place. Pure market research. And the goal is to help improve SONAR and also make the experience better for customers. 




I remain curious as to why you don't ask all of them ?




That's literally impossible to do...some customers don't want to be contacted or don't open their emails. We worked with some pros to figure out the right amount that would make it statistically significant. We've definitely done that. We feel good about the data we received.
 
The interesting thing is that the answers really didn't change much over time. The first 100 people answered about the same way the first 1000 did and so on.

I'm still not sure why you don't get emails. We've tried to fix the problem a few times. PM your current email again and I'll see what we can do to fix it.




Thanks for responding. I get that not everyone will reply or even open the email. I'm not particularly bothered that you didn't ask me as opposed to someone else, I just wondered if it's not everyone, then how do you select which people to ask ? By not giving all your forum members whose details you have the opportunity to take part do you not run the risk of making them feel like second rate customers whose opinions don't count, especially as you also then reward the chosen few for being picked ? Obviously I haven't seen the questions, so I don't know how they are framed, but I was just thinking that a pro or power user would probably have a different set of priorities and opinions than a part -time, spare room wannabe like me, so which do you target / do you even know who is who when you send the email ? 
 
 
backwoods
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 17:07:41 (permalink)
Anderton
kitekrazy1
I can understand the paranoia because of Sonar now being a Gibson product and people don't trust them based on history.

 
Well, compare the history of pre-Gibson X2 to post-Gibson X3. FWIW last time I checked, Stanton's market share of turntables was close to 50%, KRK's Rockit series is still #1 in monitors, and TASCAM has had their best year in a long time. So they're all doing OK by Gibson. Remember, Henry uses SONAR as his only DAW and has since the days of DOS. He'll do anything to keep the company in business 
 
 




I wasn't privy to the behind the curtain machinations of the Gibson buyout, so I don't know the details of the timeline. But based on what Noel was saying earlier- 3 or months 4 squashing bugs then moving onto bnext version- wouldn't that mean X3 was made under Roland's watch. Very possibly I am totally wrong on this point :) But If I am not, it weould be quite insulting to claim X3 was Gibson's doing alone.
Anderton
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 17:24:57 (permalink)
backwoods
 
I wasn't privy to the behind the curtain machinations of the Gibson buyout, so I don't know the details of the timeline. But based on what Noel was saying earlier- 3 or months 4 squashing bugs then moving onto bnext version- wouldn't that mean X3 was made under Roland's watch. Very possibly I am totally wrong on this point :) But If I am not, it weould be quite insulting to claim X3 was Gibson's doing alone.



First of all, any software is Cakewalk's doing. I guess saying "post-Gibson X3" wasn't sufficiently clear. By that I meant what happened with X3 post-Gibson. There were a lot of complaints that X2 was abandoned after X2a, whereas after X3 there were multiple updates and continued forward motion. I do believe that had a lot to do with Gibson's vote of confidence in, and support of, Cakewalk. They moved to new quarters, were immediately given authorization to hire more people, and Henry gave me the slack to work with Cakewalk as much as possible given my other obligations.
 
Roland is a fine and innovative company. Downloads for the V-Studio remain available and if it breaks, Roland will fix it. The TTS-1 is still a welcome part of SONAR. But "fit" matters, and it's important not to underestimate the value of Gibson's CEO being a huge fan of Cakewalk and SONAR. Some would say I've kinda been helpful, too 

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
backwoods
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 17:47:04 (permalink)
Thanks for the clarification craig. I ahve always had tremendous respect for your understanding of computer music and feel pretty happy when you say things are going well :)
Anderton
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/30 17:56:12 (permalink)
Speaking of "fit," I should also add that it's not just a "Gibson" thing...TASCAM and Cakewalk get along really well and I'm sure that will lead to good things in the future (as one current example, the new US-2x2 and 4x4 interfaces were tested extensively with SONAR), and a lot of the Gibson USA players are switching to SONAR...not because they have to, they just dig it. I believe there will be more examples of cross-pollination among the brands that will benefit Cakewalk, and vice-versa. 

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
deswind
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Re: Please don't move to a subscription model 2014/10/31 00:20:43 (permalink)
Kudos to you, Craig.
I am just happy I got to post on a "super thread."
 
Jonness
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/31 02:04:54 (permalink)
"Sonar X4 Power" was published November 26, 2014 but is not yet available in stores. Software will soon follow.
 
Format: Trade Paperback
Dimensions: 500 pages, 10 × 8 × 0.68 in
Published: November 26, 2014
Publisher: Course Technology PTR
Language: English

ISBN - 10: 1305493583
ISBN - 13: 9781305493582

 

 
Paul P
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/31 13:19:58 (permalink)
 
Are you talking to us from the future ?
 

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Anderton
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/31 13:30:10 (permalink)
Paul P
Are you talking to us from the future ?



Stock tips, please?

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
TerraSin
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/31 14:12:14 (permalink)

TerraSin
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/31 14:22:40 (permalink)
It's Halloween. Where is my X4 announcement? :(
pbognar
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/31 16:46:00 (permalink)
TerraSin
It's Halloween. Where is my X4 announcement? :(




It would be poor form to make the X4 announcement while there is still a 33% off Sonar X3 Producer upgrade in effect until Oct. 31st.
 
We can start to panic on Monday.  
Splat
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/31 18:05:52 (permalink)
pbognar
We can start to panic on Monday.  


Keep watching the skies. You have been warned.

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InstrEd
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/10/31 23:31:44 (permalink)
I'm more worried about the underground. Will I be able to use Sonar to tame the spirits.

Instred
Chicagoland, IL 

Jonness
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/11/01 01:55:38 (permalink)
Anderton
Stock tips, please?



Don't fight the Fed.
Skyline_UK
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Re: When is Sonar X4 coming out 2014/11/01 06:11:26 (permalink)
jbow
Who am I kidding... I'm not going anywhere. I'll roll with whatever Cakewalk does. I've never been treated poorly by Cakewalk so I'll give whatever is decided a chance and more.
 J


Sums up my mood, J!
 

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