Drone7 
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
- Total Posts : 199
- Joined: 2014/12/17 01:31:11
- Status: offline
Sonar on Mac
Pure curiosity...
Has there even been talk by Cakewalk of a dedicated Mac version of Sonar? Is it or has it ever been on the radar? Is there any rumours? What would be the difficulty? The idea of having to crap-around with Boot-Camp turns me off, plus the extra cost of having to buy a copy of Windows also would take the shine off things. Surely Sonar on Mac would bring-in a few hundred thousand dollars profit for Cakewalk wouldn't it? Just guessing.
|
Andrew Rossa
Max Output Level: -56 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1910
- Joined: 2006/04/14 13:33:18
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/24 19:42:58
(permalink)
No plan for SONAR on Mac at this time.
|
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 6783
- Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/24 20:06:37
(permalink)
I can't speak for Cakewalk, of course. But the Mac DAW market strikes me as a tough landscape to make money in. Logic and ProTools utterly dominate, Garage Band has it sewn up for hobbyists, and Apple can fight, and has fought, a far tougher price war there than any other developer. So I can well imagine the proposal not surviving a serious profit-and-loss study.
http://johntatlockaudio.com/Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
|
ampfixer
Max Output Level: -20 dBFS
- Total Posts : 5508
- Joined: 2010/12/12 20:11:50
- Location: Ontario
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/24 20:20:32
(permalink)
If you've got a MAc install logic X and call it a day.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
|
Drone7
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
- Total Posts : 199
- Joined: 2014/12/17 01:31:11
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/24 23:52:08
(permalink)
John T
Logic and ProTools utterly dominate, and Apple can fight, and has fought, a far tougher price war there than any other developer.
Now that you put it like that, I suppose it would be pointless. And now that i think about it, if all that wasn't bad enough, they would still have Cubase and Studio One and Digital Performer to contend with. I see your point, wouldn't be worth it! Andrew Rossa, thanks for the prompt reply. Cheers.
|
kitekrazy1
Max Output Level: -40 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3524
- Joined: 2014/08/02 17:52:51
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 13:04:10
(permalink)
John T
I can't speak for Cakewalk, of course. But the Mac DAW market strikes me as a tough landscape to make money in. Logic and ProTools utterly dominate, Garage Band has it sewn up for hobbyists, and Apple can fight, and has fought, a far tougher price war there than any other developer. So I can well imagine the proposal not surviving a serious profit-and-loss study.
They are still losing in the desktop market. The amount of PCs used on a planet makes Apple still quite minimal. Remember they are a hardware company. Imagine if Logic was released for PC? MOTU's DP is now cross platform. Sony has ventured into Mac land with audio and some are hoping they do that with video. If a company begins cross development, more resources would have to go to the Mac side. Updates are more frequent for a Mac OS. Bootcamp is always an option. Live 8 users found that Live worked better on Bootcamp/W7 than their Mac OS.
post edited by kitekrazy1 - 2015/01/25 13:11:52
|
kitekrazy1
Max Output Level: -40 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3524
- Joined: 2014/08/02 17:52:51
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 13:05:58
(permalink)
ampfixer
If you've got a MAc install logic X and call it a day.
Best advice. DAWs are not religions or a marriage. You can break up or even practice polygamy (multiple DAWs).
|
Sanderxpander
Max Output Level: -36.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3873
- Joined: 2013/09/30 10:08:24
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 13:08:32
(permalink)
Logic is incredible value. I'm happy with PC/Sonar but I really think there is no contest value-wise when you're already on Mac. For new buyers, that is. EDIT: by the way, Logic used to be on PC. It wasn't until Apple took over from EMagic that it stopped PC support. I'm not betting on them ever reversing that.
post edited by Sanderxpander - 2015/01/25 13:18:35
|
Marshall
Max Output Level: -78 dBFS
- Total Posts : 602
- Joined: 2007/06/14 04:28:16
- Location: Alicante, Spain
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 17:52:27
(permalink)
I would personally love to see it on the Mac. I am passed moving to another DAW and am pretty much wedded to Sonar for life. It would be great if Cakewalk would let us know why there are no plans, and why there never have been as far as I know.
|
Drone7
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
- Total Posts : 199
- Joined: 2014/12/17 01:31:11
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 18:18:43
(permalink)
Financial resources required for a Sonar Mac version vs financial returns would probably make it unfeasible. Mac only has 8% of the PC market hardware wise. So, let's see, for example, 92,000,000 Windows PC's vs 8,000,000 Macs. The slice of the pie for Sonar sales on Mac considering all current competitors would just seem like it's not worth it, especially when Bootcamp can work fine for anyone who prefers Sonar but insists on using Mac.
|
Sanderxpander
Max Output Level: -36.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3873
- Joined: 2013/09/30 10:08:24
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 18:30:16
(permalink)
While I agree with your conclusion due to Logic and ProTools' dominance (and the price point of the former) I don't think those percentages hold for the musician/engineer crowd. It's true there are far more "regular" PCs in the world than Macs, but among musicians Macs are more common than PCs. Additionally, people with Macs arguably have more money to spend on hardware and software than the average PC user.
|
denverdrummer
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
- Total Posts : 278
- Joined: 2011/01/10 12:15:24
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 18:52:16
(permalink)
Guys this is a money loser from day 1. If they port to Mac, they have to increase their development staff to fix bugs on Mac, as well as PC. Either that, or double their work load. And all this because more musicians use Mac? Apple probably sells logic for break even or even at a loss due to their other profits from other areas of the company. Garage Band is a gateway drug to logic, and at $200 a lot more appealing than $700 for PT. So Sonar goes into a brand new market where they have no foothold competing against two DAW's that combined make up about 90% of the Apple DAW market.
Studio One for as successful as it's been out of the gate, holds 5% of the Mac DAW market, and they've been around since 2009 trying to make a dent. But they have done damage in the PC market, mainly off their strong hardware sales offering free S1 Artist versions.
It's far better for Sonar to try and grab a bigger share of the PC market than waste money trying to make a Mac version work, where it may or may not succeed, and perhaps alienate their core customer base, who are 100% Windows.
Win 10 Pro 64 bit, Dell Inspiron 15, core i7, 16GB RAM, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20, Mackie MR5 Mark 1 speakers
|
Splat
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 8672
- Joined: 2010/12/29 15:28:29
- Location: Mars.
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 18:54:30
(permalink)
Linux though is crying out for a DAW that doesn't look like it's written for MS DOS.
Sell by date at 9000 posts. Do not feed. @48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38. Sonar Platinum(64 bit),Win 8.1(64 bit),Saffire Pro 40(Firewire),Mix Control = 3.4,Firewire=VIA,Dell Studio XPS 8100(Intel Core i7 CPU 2.93 Ghz/16 Gb),4 x Seagate ST31500341AS (mirrored),GeForce GTX 460,Yamaha DGX-505 keyboard,Roland A-300PRO,Roland SPD-30 V2,FD-8,Triggera Krigg,Shure SM7B,Yamaha HS5.Maschine Studio+Komplete 9 Ultimate+Kontrol Z1.Addictive Keys,Izotope Nectar elements,Overloud Bundle,Geist.Acronis True Image 2014.
|
denverdrummer
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
- Total Posts : 278
- Joined: 2011/01/10 12:15:24
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 18:55:13
(permalink)
Sanderxpander
Logic is incredible value. I'm happy with PC/Sonar but I really think there is no contest value-wise when you're already on Mac. For new buyers, that is.
EDIT: by the way, Logic used to be on PC. It wasn't until Apple took over from EMagic that it stopped PC support. I'm not betting on them ever reversing that.
No they're not going to port it back to PC. The main reason for the buy was to create garage band, Logic just turned out to be a surprise gem for them, but at the price they sell it, as I said, I'm pretty sure they lose money on it or break even. They don't care, they're apple, it's all about selling you into the walled garden.
Win 10 Pro 64 bit, Dell Inspiron 15, core i7, 16GB RAM, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20, Mackie MR5 Mark 1 speakers
|
Drone7
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
- Total Posts : 199
- Joined: 2014/12/17 01:31:11
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 19:14:42
(permalink)
denverdrummer
and at $200 a lot more appealing than $700 for PT. So Sonar goes into a brand new market where they have no foothold competing against two DAW's that combined make up about 90% of the Apple DAW market.
I see over at Avid that the new Pro Tools 12 is now $899 for the standard non-HD version. I don't think Avid are doing themselves any favours with such a pricing scheme. They must be thinking if they can't compete with LogicProX on pricing, they might as well make people pay big time. There would obviously have to be a very specific reason for people to go with Pro tools, and so Avid are clearly taking advantage of that. What a ruthless world we live in. PS: Avid have now jumped on the subscription bandwagon, with same formula as Sonar.
|
denverdrummer
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
- Total Posts : 278
- Joined: 2011/01/10 12:15:24
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 19:42:31
(permalink)
Avid is the worst company in the world. When they were delisted from the stock market, I'd hoped that someone would buy out PT from them. They waited out the storm, and are now relisted on NASDAQ, although their stock has gone down ever since they were relisted, and if PT12 doesn't take off, they will be in trouble.
At some point the rubber will meet the road. PT is still the mainstay in big studios, the only problem being the big studios are going out of business left and right. The budgets from record companies on new albums are drastically reduced. This is why everything new coming out sounds so processed and stale, it's the same country clubbers running the show, and there's no room for creativity. PT just doesn't have the lock it once did on the market, and with reduced budgets for new records, it's only going to push more cost effective alternatives.
Sonar has had very solid and loyal customers. I really hope that with the Gibson/TASCAM relationship, that will push those numbers upward. I think there are too many DAWS on the market, and that at some point some of the outliers will either have to change or fold. I mean seriously is there a reason Tracktion still exists? They are less than 1% of the market.
Win 10 Pro 64 bit, Dell Inspiron 15, core i7, 16GB RAM, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20, Mackie MR5 Mark 1 speakers
|
johnnyV
Max Output Level: -48.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 2677
- Joined: 2010/02/22 11:46:33
- Location: Here, in my chair
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/25 20:48:16
(permalink)
But 1% might represent $30,000 a year for 3 people working part time at home. Software is cool because no you really don't need to put it in a box or physical store. The more units Sonar sells on line the higher the profit. Those boxes and DVD's must cost at least $10 or more each.
On line delivery is the push.
The new control center is part of solidifying the overall on line model of delivery. I'm seeing that it is already causing a lot of extra support time to make it work. But they will have it all running smoothly in a short while I would think.
The Control Center is basically the same idea as Steinbergs E Licencer app. Steinberg gives you the option of the soft version or the hardware USB version. I hope Sonar does the same someday. I really don't like this internet dependency for my studio daw which I would rather not have to connect. The option for a USB licencer gets my vote. I said option, not mandatory as I know their are many who hate dongles.
Sonar X3e Studio - Waiting for Professional Scarlett 6i6Yamaha Gear= 01v - NSM 10 - DTX 400 - MG82cx Roland Gear= A 49- GR 50 - TR 505 - Boss pedalsTascam Gear= DR 40 - US1641 -Mackie Gear= Mix 8 - SRM 350's i5 Z97 3.2GHZ quad 16 Gig RAM W 8.1 home buildTaylor mini GS - G& L Tribute Tele - 72 Fender Princeton - TC BH 250 - Mooer and Outlaw Pedals Korg 05/RW
|
Spencer
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
- Total Posts : 299
- Joined: 2005/06/21 00:12:35
- Location: Montréal, QC
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/26 02:02:17
(permalink)
the moment that sonar for mac is announced, I'm looking for something else. it's probably the only thing that could make me switch to another daw actually.
|
Rain
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 9736
- Joined: 2003/11/07 05:10:12
- Location: Las Vegas
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/26 02:13:06
(permalink)
As much as I'd personally love to have access to a Mac version of Sonar, for totally selfish reasons, Cakewalk has every reason NOT to port Sonar.
Digital Performer finally being ported to Windows after so many years gives us a pretty good indication of the state of the market on Mac.
Apple sells hardware, so they can afford to provide affordable and even free software. Hard to compete with that - and that's not taking into account the level of integration allowed by the fact that the same manufacturer provides the hardware, the OS AND the software.
TCB - Tea, Cats, Books...
|
Drone7
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
- Total Posts : 199
- Joined: 2014/12/17 01:31:11
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/26 03:03:16
(permalink)
And Apple have just released the Logic Pro X 10.1 update three days ago, a significant update by the looks of it; many things have been added including a new drum-machine (looking very much like NI Battery 4) plus 6 new analog modeled compressors, also all new presets and 8 voice unison to the Retro Synth, 6 new automated drummers to the Acoustic Drums module, plus big refinements to the midi grid/piano-roll input methods, and new VCA faders, and new mellotron samples, and refinements to the user-interface. Quite frankly this is making it very hard for me to resist going Mac all the way. It seems that Apple is trying to make it very hard for any rival DAWs to compete. One would have to be mad to purchase another DAW on Mac unless they've got money burning a whole in their pocket and need to spend it on something. In fact, the pricing of Logic makes it feasible for people to run and own two DAWs on Mac quite easily and without regret; regardless, it seems at the current price of Logic, Apple is nearly guaranteed that 'anyone' making music on a Mac will buy a copy of Logic Pro X no matter what. Slick move Apple, very slick tactics. I guess when a company has mega purse strings like Apple, they have the advantage of being able to play hard ball at their own discretion and bring a sledgehammer down on the head of any rivals.
post edited by Drone7 - 2015/01/26 03:10:54
|
Rain
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 9736
- Joined: 2003/11/07 05:10:12
- Location: Las Vegas
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/26 03:12:26
(permalink)
Drone7
And Apple have just released the Logic Pro X 10.1 update three days ago, a significant update by the looks of it; many things have been added including a new drum-machine (looking very much like NI Battery 4) plus 6 new analog modeled compressors, also all new presets and 8 voice unison to the Retro Synth, 6 new automated drummers to the Acoustic Drums module, and big refinements to the midi grid/piano-roll input methods, VCA faders, and new mellotron samples and refinements to the user-interface.
Quite frankly this is making it very hard for me to resist going Mac all the way.
It seems that Apple is trying to make it very hard for any rival DAWs to compete. One would have to be mad to purchase another DAW on Mac unless they've got money burning a whole in their pocket and need to spend it on something. In fact, the pricing of Logic makes it feasible for people to run and own two DAWs on Mac quite easily and without regret; regardless, it seems at the current price of Logic, Apple is nearly guaranteed that 'anyone' making music on a Mac will buy a copy of Logic Pro X no matter what.
I concur. :P Slight correction though, the compressor GUI has been redesigned and greatly improves the usability, and they've added a few things like a graph mode (similar to FabFilter's) but the different compressor modes where already there for the most part. That being said, if you're on PC, Sonar is it as far as I'm concerned.
TCB - Tea, Cats, Books...
|
Anderton
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 14070
- Joined: 2003/11/06 14:02:03
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/26 03:16:44
(permalink)
johnnyV
The Control Center is basically the same idea as Steinbergs E Licencer app.
I'm not sure about that. IIRC the eLicenser doesn't handle downloading updates and such. I think a closer analogy would be NI's Service Center, although it doesn't let you roll back or ahead to different versions.
|
ProjectM
Max Output Level: -36 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3941
- Joined: 2004/02/10 09:32:12
- Location: Norway
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/26 04:44:05
(permalink)
I'm dreaming of Sonar for Mac as well but it doesn't seem to be any good reasons at the moment for Cakewalk to port it over. That's ok by me, though. Having said that, Sonar X3 flies on my iMac in Bootcamp with Windows 7. However, I am really enjoying Logic these days as well. Logic is for OS X what Sonar is for Windows. They are both really good and perfect for their platforms.
(Sonar Platinum - Win10 x64) - iMac and 13" MacBook - Logic Pro X ++ - UA Apollo Twin DUO - NI Maschine MKII - NI Komplete Kontrol S61 - Novation Nocturne - KRK Rokit 6 SoundcloudNegative Vibe Records
|
dwardzala
Max Output Level: -61 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1470
- Joined: 2008/05/26 19:18:33
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/26 08:34:23
(permalink)
Drone7
denverdrummer
and at $200 a lot more appealing than $700 for PT. So Sonar goes into a brand new market where they have no foothold competing against two DAW's that combined make up about 90% of the Apple DAW market.
I see over at Avid that the new Pro Tools 12 is now $899 for the standard non-HD version. I don't think Avid are doing themselves any favours with such a pricing scheme. They must be thinking if they can't compete with LogicProX on pricing, they might as well make people pay big time. There would obviously have to be a very specific reason for people to go with Pro tools, and so Avid are clearly taking advantage of that. What a ruthless world we live in.
PS: Avid have now jumped on the subscription bandwagon, with same formula as Sonar.
Except its not the same formula. Avid's subscription model is a rental agreement where you stop paying and your software stops working (and its $30 per month according to their presser).
DaveMain Studio- Core i5 @2.67GHz, 16Gb Ram, (2) 500Gb HDs, (1) 360 Gb HD MotU Ultralite AVB, Axiom 49 Midi Controller, Akai MPD18 Midi Controller Win10 x64 Home Sonar 2017.06 Platinum (and X3e, X2c, X1d) Mobile Studio - Sager NP8677 (i7-6700HQ @2.67MHz, 16G Ram, 250G SSD, 1T HD) M-Box Mini v. 2 Win 10 x64 Home Sonar 2016.10 Platinum Check out my original music: https://soundcloud.com/d-wardzala/sets/d-wardzala-original-music
|
denverdrummer
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
- Total Posts : 278
- Joined: 2011/01/10 12:15:24
- Status: offline
Re: Sonar on Mac
2015/01/26 14:20:15
(permalink)
Anderton
johnnyV
The Control Center is basically the same idea as Steinbergs E Licencer app.
I'm not sure about that. IIRC the eLicenser doesn't handle downloading updates and such. I think a closer analogy would be NI's Service Center, although it doesn't let you roll back or ahead to different versions.
Agreed, command center is just a nice centralized location to download updates, and manages the license keys so you don't have to manually enter them in the past. It's a great new feature, and much easier than the old way of installing new updates, and add ons. E-licenser is like iLok, except that there is a software version rather than having to use a dongle. I'm not a fan of those technologies.
Win 10 Pro 64 bit, Dell Inspiron 15, core i7, 16GB RAM, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20, Mackie MR5 Mark 1 speakers
|