Helpful ReplyARC 2 - Minimal Changes after Acoustic Treatment

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mudgel
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Re: ARC 2 - Minimal Changes after Acoustic Treatment 2015/04/10 05:53:12 (permalink)
streckfus
I appreciate everyone's feedback!  Sounds like there are some who've found ARC 2 to be very useful, and some are on the other side of the fence.
 
I should note that I took the largest amount of measurements possible (15, I believe), all of them within my primary listening positing.  Some additional info about my setup:
 
My mixing desk is about 1 foot away from the wall and centered between the side walls.  The desk is quite large and has a monitor shelf.  Due to space limitations, I can't put my monitors on stands so they're sitting on that monitor shelf on top of Primacoustic Recoil Stabilizers.  I've got Alesis M1 Active MKII monitors.  Yes, you may snicker.  They're all I could afford when building the studio, and without a proper room, I don't think it makes sense to dump a bunch of cash into better monitors. That's money better spent on treating the room.  :)
 
Others have talked about ignoring the graph/picture and instead looking at ARC 2's impulse response.  Where would I find such a thing?  Aside from the resulting before/after graph after taking measurements, I don't see any other options for detailed results/analysis.
 
fwrend
My questioin to the OP: so, what's the difference "audibly" between Arc ON and Arc OFF post-treatment? Regardless of what the chart shows, perhaps this would speak more about the difference between actual treatment and software based correction.

Just a thought.



To be honest, audibly ARC 2 sounds bad when the correction is on.  Some have stated that turning ARC 2 makes their speakers sound great, I've found the opposite to be true.  The speakers sound quite peaky and glassy, but I understand that ARC 2 isn't necessarily going to make the monitors sound better; it's designed to make the mix sound better by accentuating/attenuating frequencies that are problematic in the room.  I haven't done a full mix with/without ARC 2, but I have done some quick tests by throwing an EQ on the master bus to tweak the sound of the mix in accordance with what I'm hearing through ARC 2.  (Yes, I disable ARC 2 when I bounce.)  I've actually found that the mixes sound better without monitoring through ARC 2, then again, I haven't done a start-to-finish mix using it, and throwing an EQ on the master fader isn't the same as tweaking individual instruments as the mix is built up.  (Plus, the mix was a work in progress anyway, so it was far from perfect to begin with.)
 
I definitely need to do some more experimenting with ARC 2 and eventually I'll figure out if it helps my mixes or not.  If not, at least I got an extra mic out of it. :)

In my experience it's the people who don't own and use Arc2 who are its biggest critics or tend to minimise its effect. Those who own it and set it up properly tend to be either pleasantly surprised or ecstatic about its positive effect. Myself, I've been a user for a long time and recommend it highly. The amount of money spent on Arc2 would not produce the same effect if spent on room treatment alone.
Of course if it was financially and structurally feasible I'd prefer a perfectly treated environment but for a guy on a budget I can get damn close with Arc 2.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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drewfx1
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Re: ARC 2 - Minimal Changes after Acoustic Treatment 2015/04/10 13:38:43 (permalink)
mudgel
In my experience it's the people who don't own and use Arc2 who are its biggest critics or tend to minimise its effect. 



I can say that, having used it in various environments here, in some cases in can make a dramatic improvement (two locations I have here that had big problems), but in others not nearly as much (mixing position in a room with a fair amount of traditional acoustic treatment). So I suspect that some of the differing opinions are due to differences from the rooms it's used in.
 
I do believe that some people seem to just be philosophically opposed to it for whatever reason and/or don't really understand exactly what you can and can't fix using DSP.

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Guitarpima
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Re: ARC 2 - Minimal Changes after Acoustic Treatment 2015/04/10 14:49:06 (permalink)
I got proper monitors a few months back and find myself not using ARC. My room is not treated but is probably ideal in that I have wood shelves from floor to ceiling behind me and even though their full of crap, act to capture the sound and stop the reflections.
 
It's difficult to take measurements as I had to mark different spots around my room so I could place the mic in the different locations as accurately as possible. Not easy when you can barely see.
 
I do mix with and without ARC but would rather see ARC implemented differently. I would rather it be integrated into the audio of the computer, between the software and AI as opposed to a VST.

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sharke
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Re: ARC 2 - Minimal Changes after Acoustic Treatment 2015/04/10 15:17:44 (permalink)
Guitarpima
I got proper monitors a few months back and find myself not using ARC. My room is not treated but is probably ideal in that I have wood shelves from floor to ceiling behind me and even though their full of crap, act to capture the sound and stop the reflections.
 
It's difficult to take measurements as I had to mark different spots around my room so I could place the mic in the different locations as accurately as possible. Not easy when you can barely see.
 
I do mix with and without ARC but would rather see ARC implemented differently. I would rather it be integrated into the audio of the computer, between the software and AI as opposed to a VST.


You can simulate this but it's a little awkward. I bought Virtual Audio Cable which allows you to route audio anywhere in your system. I think it was about $25. I also downloaded a free program, Pedalboard, which hosts VST's. It's just a matter of loading ARC2 into Pedalboard, setting VAC as the input, then selecting VAC as the default audio device. It's not really intuitive to set up without reading the instructions but after some trial and error I managed to get it working and can set it up really easily when I have to. It means I can listen to ALL audio through ARC2 - Spotify, WMP, iTunes, YouTube, Netflix etc. It's great having movie audio through it, really enhances your movie watching experience.

James
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#34
Crowned One
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Re: ARC 2 - Minimal Changes after Acoustic Treatment 2015/04/10 18:35:57 (permalink)
Mine is setup similar to Sharke and once setup you can save your settings as a template to make recall easier.
 
I have also been using pedalboard and you can also get a virtual cable which is donationware to save some money.
 
http://vb-audio.pagesperso-orange.fr/Cable/index.htm
 
 
#35
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