Ground loop issue, looking for temp solution via battery powered device ?

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tomixornot
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2015/07/15 07:41:43 (permalink)

Ground loop issue, looking for temp solution via battery powered device ?

I'm quite certain that my house is having a ground loop problem. While the mic signal is clean, my ele.guitar and ele.bass will have noise / buzz, sometimes louder while sometimes it's clean enough to record. I'm waiting for the electrician to come by in about a week time to check / fix.  When i go to my friend's house a few blocks away with a good ground loop, there is no noise from the guitar amp.
 
I'm going to do some tests soon.. I'm trying to answer the following questions. If you do know the answer, or what do you think the outcome will be ?
 
1) I have a Roland guitar cube amp that can run with battery - so technically I should get a clean sound with my ele.guitar without buzz from the speaker right (running with battery) ?

2) What if I power the amp via a power adapter, instead of battery ? (the power adapter is without ground)

3) I'll also have a Tascam 2-tracks portable recorder that can be powered with battery. And if I connect the ele.guitar direct to the Tascam while running with battery, I should not have any buzz too right ?

4) And to complete the test, I'll also test the Tascam with a power adapter setup (adapter with no ground).
 
Cheers!

Albert


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#1

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    bitflipper
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    Re: Ground loop issue, looking for temp solution via battery powered device ? 2015/07/15 08:24:03 (permalink)
    As it's just the amp that's producing the hum, and not your other gear (i.e. your audio interface), and given that the amp performs better elsewhere, that leaves the circuit that you amplifier's plugged into as the probable culprit. 
     
    There are two possibilities. One is that the circuit is improperly wired, the other is that there is something else connected to the same circuit that's injecting noise into the line, such as a refrigerator.
     
    If the problem hasn't always been there, and just recently began, you can probably eliminate the first possibility. You can confirm that by taking the amp to another part of the house and plugging it into a different circuit. Just make sure it's really a separate circuit - you could make sure by turning off the outlet you normally use via the circuit breaker.
     
    If the problem has always been there, then it's likely the circuit is not wired correctly. Your electrician should be able to test that easily if he has the proper equipment. Have him verify that three wires are coming to the outlet and that the ground wire is connected. He may have a tester that can indicate whether the ground wire is too short, i.e. daisy-chained to another outlet as opposed to running all the way back to the neutral-ground bond in the service panel.
     
    If all else fails, you can get an isolation transformer. In many ways, that's the ideal solution. Get one hefty enough to handle all of your audio equipment and plug everything into it. That'll solve all grounding issues and most EMI issues, and many RFI issues.


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    #2
    tomixornot
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    Re: Ground loop issue, looking for temp solution via battery powered device ? 2015/07/15 08:48:12 (permalink)
    Thanks Dave,
     
    The problem has always been there. The noise is there when I connect my guitar directly to the audio interface too. As well as a few different amps.
     
    I'm currently using a voltage regulator and everything is powered via the regulator, but I guess it's not a true isolation transformer. I will also test the amp at another part of the house too.

    Albert


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    #3
    tomixornot
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    Re: Ground loop issue, looking for temp solution via battery powered device ? 2015/07/16 03:43:53 (permalink)
    I tried #3 and #4 but instead of using battery or power adapter, I power up the Tascam with a usb power bank via a USB to (Sony) PSP type cable. This setup is great as it's truly portable without having to worry about buying batteries and the power bank will last for a very long time. I've been using it for about an hour and it only used up 1% or less charge.
     
    I've exported the backing track from Sonar to Tascam and everything works perfectly - it's so nice not hearing any noise at all and I can concentrate on my guitar part.

    Albert


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    #4
    Cactus Music
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    Re: Ground loop issue, looking for temp solution via battery powered device ? 2015/07/17 21:40:20 (permalink)
    Question, are you using USB power for your audio interface? There are lots of people reporting bad hum when using a USB buss powered interface. The solution for most is a USB cable with a Ferrite Yolk. 

     
    You certainly don't need an electrician to tell you if you have a bad ground. For one thing around here the hydro company will gladly offer this for free as this is often their problem. 
    And you can buy a tester from the hardware store for a few bucks. I have a couple and there's always one in my live performance rig. I don't play unless the 2 green lights are on... 

    post edited by Cactus Music - 2015/07/17 21:48:44

    Johnny V  
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    #5
    robert_e_bone
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    Re: Ground loop issue, looking for temp solution via battery powered device ? 2015/07/26 05:30:45 (permalink)
    I picked up a couple of passive direct boxes, and put them in line to my speakers, and that knocks out anything I  had been hearing,
     
    I will look at picking up some flavor of isolation transformer, in a month or 2, as I have been chasing off dollar vultures for the past couple months - and they are likely going to remain for at least the next couple of months too.
     
    Oh Well, at least things seem OK now, for the most part.
     
    Bob Bone
     

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    #6
    tlw
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    Re: Ground loop issue, looking for temp solution via battery powered device ? 2015/07/27 12:06:29 (permalink)
    Just a thought, but if the bass and guitar use single coil pickups taking them anywhere near a PC (except possibly some laptops) is likely to generate lots of hum and noise. PCs can emit all kinds of radio frequencies and electrical noise from the power supply, motherboard, drive motors, monitor, graphics card.... that guitars and some pedals and amps are very sensitive to.

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    #7
    Wood67
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    Re: Ground loop issue, looking for temp solution via battery powered device ? 2015/08/03 12:11:05 (permalink)
    Definitely check the USB cable as Cactus Suggests.  I had a very weird ground problem that cropped up when I installed new KRK R5 monitors last week.  Weird because it only happened using powered speakers from the balanced outputs, and the frequencies where not simple AC harmonics.  On top of that, engaging phantom power produced a really pronounced hum cycle.  I tried changing all the leads, flipped the speakers, used different isolated sockets all to no avail.  Then I changed the USB lead to the powered Audio Interface, using what seemed a better spec'd one I was using for my controller keyboard and that cleared pretty much all of the problem.
     
    Worth a shot - this was certainly a cheap option for a fix!

    Wood

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