Helpful ReplyDrum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE

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King Conga
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2014/01/14 19:39:36 (permalink)

Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE

I know there's a Feature Wish List somewhere on the CW site, I just can't remember, and I've got work to do. I'm a drummer of 45+ yrs, and CWalk user of 25 yrs.  At 1st glance, the Drum Mgr is a great concept, and VERY necessary.  Here's where improvements HAVE to be made.  Whenever a s'ware synth is deleted out of the rack it loses it's place in the Drum Map, and it takes for FREAKIN' EVER to rebuild it to it's original glory.  I know why that happens; however, if you have 3,4, or 5 different modules that make up even 1 Map, let alone if you have multiple maps, it makes it impossible to remember all of the correct mappings when any, or ALL of those synths are taken out of the mgmt order.
 
There HAS to be a way that when those maps are deleted out of the rack, that a place marker is automatically left there so the user can remember what sample, or synth HAD been there.  I mean, there's no way to print, or copy the map to a ANSI spreadsheet, and as I said, this takes MAJOR precious studio time to rebuild a map.
 
PLEEZE HELP
KC

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Splat
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2014/01/14 19:44:26 (permalink)

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icontakt
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2014/01/14 20:23:44 (permalink)
I've just read your post a few times but I'm not sure if I understand the issue. Are you aware that you can name and save the map you've created by using the "Presets" field and the floppy disk icon to the right of it?

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chuckebaby
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2014/01/14 20:33:21 (permalink)
sonar comes loaded with drum maps but if you need to make your own its actually very easy.
it takes a little while but once done, it can be saved and re used over and over again.
 
Addictive drums has one going around here some where on their site  (for download)
 
this is the best tut on making a drum map for sonar, treat it like gold
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0Bz8iPy9mIkNyX2dTcXRzSEVSUlNscXdETTROZTIyZw&usp=drive_web&urp=http://forum.cakewalk.com/Video-quality-m2949938.a&pli=1#
 
sonar info on drum maps
http://www.cakewalk.com/Documentation/default.aspx?Doc=SONAR%20X2&Lang=EN&Req=DrumEditor.04.html
 

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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2014/01/15 02:43:31 (permalink)
I know what you mean about the synth disappearing. Not a great problem if they are only one or two assignments but a real pain if you have loads and they are spread across many drum maps.
 
I put in a feature request years ago for an improved drum map manager. The whole interface is very Windows 3.1. I'm hoping for an upgrade too at some point. It is a very handy feature to have that is a little "clunky" to put it kindly.
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icontakt
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2014/01/15 03:04:14 (permalink)
Ah...I don't create hybrid kits these day so I forgot about the issue, but now I remember it. It's about the Out Port field not remembering the correct synth (out port) after you delete a synth that was listed before it, isn't it? I also want to see a new, modern-looking interface. Thanks for sending in the FR.

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King Conga
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2014/02/24 18:54:27 (permalink)
 After all, the Drum Map is a feature that goes back to Sonar 1, is it not? I just posted on their FR page.  Stinkin' Drummers never get NO STINKIN' respect! Just a li'l humor.

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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2014/02/25 16:20:54 (permalink)
Have to say, I agree with everyone about Drum Maps.
 
Even though I use them in every project, and not just for drums, and I know how to create/edit/delete maps & presets without issue, I've probably spent more time on this than any other single activity.
 
An overhaul would be very welcome here.

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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2014/02/25 23:36:59 (permalink)
Agreed. And if you use drum maps your solo button functionity may break (that's another thread). Probably the weakest link in sonar right now which ain't good because it's pretty essential functionality rather than a nice to have.

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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2014/02/26 01:49:22 (permalink)
I love drum maps but hate that I can't use the solo button.

Grem

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andyhamm
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/07/08 06:47:33 (permalink)
Is my problem the same as yours? 
 
My synth was off so the drum map lost the output port and defaulted to another.  Now I cannot get it back even if I delete the drum map and reload.  Drum map manager does not allow a global output port change as far as I can tell (a serious fault in my opinion).  Rebuilding the drum map will take hours - it is huge.
 
I think Sonar is seriously flawed in how it handles midi devices disappearing and reappearing.  Sonar only allows one global preset as far as I can tell - which stinks because what I have online can change from one session to another.
post edited by andyhamm - 2015/07/08 07:01:11

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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/07/08 08:01:23 (permalink)
Yup been banging on about it for years. This monstracity need replacing! (Used the M word to get more traffic ;) ).

Do this

1) Get rid of it from preferences and give it a dockable form. That way we will at least be able to audition changes on the fly.

2) Redesign the UI to be more like AD2 maps.

The only hard work development wise would be designing a slick UI. Most of the back end code already exists of course. It's a fairly simple job in the grand scheme of things.

This is meat and potatoes functionality ! :) Right now the meat is missing giving us a rather disappointing meal..

(Okay maybe remove the exclamation mark next time).
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/07/08 08:08:54

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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/07/08 08:06:09 (permalink)
andyhamm
Is my problem the same as yours? 
 
My synth was off so the drum map lost the output port and defaulted to another.  Now I cannot get it back even if I delete the drum map and reload.  Drum map manager does not allow a global output port change as far as I can tell (a serious fault in my opinion).  Rebuilding the drum map will take hours - it is huge.
 
I think Sonar is seriously flawed in how it handles midi devices disappearing and reappearing.  Sonar only allows one global preset as far as I can tell - which stinks because what I have online can change from one session to another.


You can select all the rows with shift down arrow. When you select the drop down hold down crtl (or it is alt or both can't remember).

And stand one one leg.

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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/07/08 09:03:13 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Doktor Avalanche 2015/07/08 09:11:44
It's ctrl

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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/07/08 09:06:07 (permalink)
Thanks for clarifying...
 
Also if the leg you stand on doesn't work... please use the other leg.

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King Conga
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/07/08 10:24:43 (permalink)
The work around that I figured out was the following:
Take a certain softsynth (SampleTank 3), as opposed to many different synths, like I used to do, and make maps for each "section" of drums.  For instance ST3 - Kicks, ST3 - Snares, ST3 - Toms, ST3 - Cymbals, etc.  This way if it disappears for whatever reason, which it will, when you need to use it again, you obviously know how to map it because the channel output #'s remain the same.  Also, what's cool about using this approach is you can use a LOT more samples for each "section".  So, here's an example.
 
In ST3 I set it up where I assign ALL 16 chs to my favorite drum kits, and that, more than likely, will give you more than enough samples for each "section". Then, create the maps and use whatever channels you need to assign to whatever, and however many samples you need for kicks, snares, toms, cymbals, etc.  Now, the only drawback is if you use the Sonar Step Sequencer then you'll only be able to use one section at a time; so essentially, you CAN'T use Sonar's Step Sequencer.  However, I DO believe that SampleTank has it's own step sequencer, as do quite a few other software synths.
 
So, until the developers at Sonar decide to AT LEAST take this OUT of the Preferences, and do MANY other updates, I'm afraid this is what we're stuck with.
 
BaDumpBump...PSSHH!
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andyhamm
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/07/08 12:42:52 (permalink)
 
 
Thanks for the insight of how you configure drums.  I'm just getting into this so my mind was focused on one method - which is using my Motif - it has quite a good selection of drum kits.
 
What I did reluctantly was to turn off all midi output ports except the motif, and the drum map jumped back to the Motif port.  Then turned back on the midi output ports hoping nothing got messed up - like control surfaces.
 
I sure wish Cakewalk would focus on getting existing features working correctly before they add in more.  This is surely the most consistently buggy software I have ever used and I've been using this since Sonar 7, when I once had hair.
 
(I get the impression Sonar is written in Basic.) 

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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/07/08 12:45:10 (permalink)
andyhamm
 

I sure wish Cakewalk would focus on getting existing features working correctly before they add in more.  This is surely the most consistently buggy software I have ever used and I've been using this since Sonar 7, when I once had hair.


Amen Inc the hair bit.

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morganfm71
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/09/03 00:02:44 (permalink)
The Drum Map Manager has always fought me at every turn. Is there a way to sort the columns? I have one map where the note numbers are so out of whack it will be quicker for me to create an entirely new drum map rather than drag the rows around until they are sorted to my liking. 
post edited by morganfm71 - 2015/09/03 00:10:58
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/09/03 03:42:30 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby morganfm71 2015/09/03 03:51:34
No, you have to drag them one at a time to their desired position

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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/09/03 03:44:33 (permalink)
Absurd! Lol. I'm getting rather quick at making new drum maps from scratch. I got a lot already in the can for some Toontrack EZX packs. 
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/09/03 03:50:05 (permalink)
Once you've built 30 or so , the process is fairly intuitive

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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Drum Map Mgr Needs MAJOR UPGRADE 2015/09/03 04:42:37 (permalink)
Bristol_Jonesey
Once you've built 30 or so , the process is fairly intuitive



When you've built 30 you learn to stand on one leg whilst doing it don't you ? 
 
a) The "spreadsheet" is not intuitive at all esp to newbies, or even Excel aficionados.
b) If you want to preview one sound at a time you have to get out of preferences, then you have to go back into preferences, select the right tab etc. Takes forever. Leads to the question - why the heck is it in preferences?
c) The way Addictive Drums handles maps is intuitive imho.
d) It looks ugly.

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