Automation bug - data not being read during playback

Forgot to mention that you can often make it work by saving, closing & reopening the project.
On most occasions this works. Though I know that sometimes other parameters are then not working.
 
The inconsistency is the issue - i am not sure if a project is playing back properly especially if I have many automated parameters.
 
Chuck

I don't think so - when I click on the timeline, the fader jumps to the automation level & then plays (without changing level from there.
In the case I recorded, as soon as I saved, closed & reopened everything worked as expected again.
 
The frustrating thing is this is happening randomly. Sometimes I open a project  that has previously being playing properly & it isn't playing all automation; close / reopen & it starts working again.
 
Chuck

This was actually on an audio track with no audio on it & no other plug ins.
 
Does sound similar to the thread above otherwise though.
 
It is a particularly frustrating bug because you can't tell when it will happen and it isn't reproducible on demand.
 
Chuck

It's not lanes as when I close and reopen the project, the automation starts playing as expected.
 
So somehow, it gets into a state where it wont play back until something is flushed out of the system.
 
Chuck

I can't replicate here, tried to do what you appear to be doing with the instrument track. I haven't encountered this before. Can you give steps to reproduce?

dcumpian
Beep,
 
I agree that if there are problems in the code with automation, they should be fixed. I'd like to add that I've never run into any automation issues except for the bug that turns on the PC when I edit a node on an envelope. Really weird glitch that one.
 

I'll have to keep an eye out for that one. I think a lot of it is I am kind of "new school" in the sense I hopped on board after the X series (started on with X1 Prod Suite) so I don't encounter the problems the long terms users have (because I learned the "new" ways from the start) and am used to the more streamlined interface.
 
To me automation (aside from the one improvement of lanes) is very old school. It's not nearly as slick and easy to use as everything else. A lot of the stuff I'd expect to happen like being able to link/group things (as we can with many other elements in the program) doesn't seem to exist so it has to all be done one at a time and laboriously copied around (which has all sorts of quirks itself like selections being lost after one action). Toss in these irregularities like certain controls not obeying automation or only obeying automation when the parmaters are in view (or sometimes simply ignoring automation randomly) and it turns into a really headache for a spoiled newbie brat like meself.
 
Of course it's a far cry better than having to do it ALL on the fly via a hardware console live going to tape like the old days (which I was not a part of) and having no "undo" or editing options but it is certainly jarring to run into an aspect of the program that seems to not be nearly as efficient and cooperative as the rest of it.
 
There are few other old school elements in the program too that I think could be modernized as well to keep up with the X series "feel/flow" but automation, being such an important part of modern production, seems like a good place to really dig in.
 
I'm getting more behind the idea of Automation "Tracks" or "Sandbox" type setups where you can go apeballs on the automation and just route it wherever you want in a project and/or copy it to various/multiple places in one action. That would make things soooo much easier for me personally.
 
But I am indeed a spoiled "X" gen brat.
 
;-)
 
Cheers.

Anderton
I can't replicate here, tried to do what you appear to be doing with the instrument track. I haven't encountered this before. Can you give steps to reproduce?

I built a new project ( from my master template) with 2 instruments & 1 audio track & immediately saw the same problem exhibited & found one new one
 
So my steps to repro
1) create new project
2) add audio track
3) record automation via EUCON (not sure if this has anything to do with the problem or if it is universal)
 
result
Regardless of automation mode ( say touch) automation is recorded
It wont play back until it the project is saved and reopened
 
check this video for a bit more information http://screencast-o-matic.com/watch/co6tczhiXG
 
Chuck

I've had that happened with manual creation of a volume envelope as well as with my Faderport but could never consistently reproduce it so I just save and reopen.
After reopening it, the automation works correctly as well as any edits that I make to it.

DonM
Chuck:
Clearly a terrifying problem if occurring on a huge project where countless automation envelopes/lanes could be in motion and go unnoticed.  A couple of questions:
#1 Is it always Volume that is problematic?
#2 [assuming the answer to #1 is 'No'] Does it matter which lane/automation envelope you create first?
#3 [again assuming the answer to #1 is 'No'] Has this ever happened to MIDI automation?
#4 Have you ever tried to temporarily change the Meter or Tick resolution (I know this sounds crazy, but I seem to recall an issue of this back in the day...)
 
...trying to help
 
-D

Thanks Don,
 
Here are my answers so far
#1 - Volume is what I have observed so far - It's the most obvious as I see if the faders are moving & there is automation on the track - there may be other problems but I am not noticing as much.
2# haven't noticed any association with particular lanes.
3# haven't seen it with MIDI automation so far but will investigate further
4# haven't tried changing meter/tick resolution but next time I encouter it I will try.
 
basically, as soon as I close/reopen things start to work again. so that is the easiest way to 'reset' things
 
I have noticed on occasions that I open an existing session & the automation isn't playing & this step of close/reopen works again.
 
It's the inconsistency that is freaking me out & reducing my trust in Sonar.
 
Chuck

Synaptic
try to change automation modes on Artist Mix (Shift + Rec/Auto button next to Fader)
 

 
I guess this is a button specific to your control surface. The automation mode setting in SONAR is grayed out during playback. This doesn't excuse a crash, of course, but changing it is disallowed during playback so at best you would get no result if everything worked as expected.
 
Looking at your video, I think something must not be right between your control surface and SONAR. I'm not seeing any of these problems with my old Behringer BCF2000 (not touch-sensitive) using Mackie Control. I don't much use it any more, but I fired it up and Touch mode does not record in a section with no automation when I'm not moving the fader, and automation is playing back as expected immediately after it's written.

I believe that this is not a new problem, as I have seen it mentioned before in these forums. I have experienced it myself with clip automation being ignored during playback in several different versions of Sonar. In fact it happened to me earlier this week (using X3). The problem disappeared after closing and re-opening the project. But I have only noticed it happening with clip automation though rather than track or bus automation. And it is never possible to replicate the problem.

Hmmm...I searched on Euphonix Artist Mix Problems and there were a bunch of hits that involve connection problems, which sort of sounds like it might be the issue here. This one seemed like it might be relevant.

brundlefly

Synaptic
Within the software, you can enable automation on the fly while playing. So my thought is it should be able to do this from the surface ...

 Enable writing, yes, but not change write modes.
 

Totally - the Modes are greyed out as soon as the engine plays, and that's what i expect.