AnsweredEntry level headphones for monitoring??

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RamboFB
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2016/04/23 10:34:13 (permalink)

Entry level headphones for monitoring??

Hello All,
            Let me start of by saying I'm really new to recording. At the moment I'm using MC7. As the title suggests I'm looking for a decent set of entry level headphones. My budget is roughly £50($70 or €65). At the moment I have two audio interfaces, the Boss GT-10 (guitar effects pedal) and the Boss BR-800 (Standalone recorder with USB). Also I currently use the onboard sound from my motherboard ie I don't have a separate sound card.
 
So I have tried to give as much info a possible and I have two questions 
 
  1. Should I think about updating my sound card? What would I get from this? Is monitoring at the audio interface the best option?
  2. Could anyone recommend a decent set of headphones for the budget already mentioned? 
I just going to stick with headphones at the moment but when I get up to speed I might consider buying monitors also. At the moment I'm just trying to get to grips with using the software so just taking one step at a time.
 
If anyone could spare the time to give their thoughts I really would appreciate that?
 
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    Leadfoot
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/23 10:40:39 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby RamboFB 2016/04/23 10:59:35
    I would look at Audio-Technica. They have some decent offerings in that price range.
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    RamboFB
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/23 10:45:09 (permalink)
    Leadfoot
    I would look at Audio-Technica. They have some decent offerings in that price range.



    Thanks for the reply. Well the ATH-M20X are in my price range and the seem to get great reviews.
     
    Thanks alot for that!
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    pwalpwal
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/23 11:08:40 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby RamboFB 2016/04/23 11:26:41
    slightly more than 50 squids, but also check the sony mdr7506, very happy with mine :-)

    just a sec

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    RamboFB
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/23 11:12:34 (permalink)
    pwalpwal
    slightly more than 50 squids, but also check the sony mdr7506, very happy with mine :-)




    Thanks for the reply! £70 for these ones! Could be a shout! Is there anything I should look for or is just a case of what works for the user? 
     
    Thanks again!
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    pwalpwal
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/23 11:21:36 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby RamboFB 2016/04/23 12:39:34
    comfort if you're wearing them for long periods of time, leakage if you'll be recording mic while wearing them, flat frequency response (ie, no "bass boost" etc)
    ideally you should try them in a shop
    good luck!

    just a sec

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    tlw
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/23 11:39:42 (permalink) ☼ Best Answerby RamboFB 2016/04/23 12:39:44
    If you want to record vocals against a click or any tracks you've already recorded you'll need closed back headphones to monitor with. Open backed headphones allow sound to leak out, which microphones can (and usually will) pick up. I'd suggest adding Sennheiser to the list of phones to consider, the HD25 range is pretty good. They're aimed at DJs who need to hear one thing while a PA is pumping out something else, so have good isolation (low leakage) and are fairly honest, at least as honest as most affordable headphones get.

    Headphones aren't ideal for mixing, because they present a very different picture to speakers, especially regarding panning and the problem where a sound in one stereo channel negates something in the other. Usually obvious on speakers, but not headphones as the sound from them doesn't blend in the air before it reaches your ears.

    A built-in sound card might be OK if you just use it for playback, but they are usually very poor if used for recording purposes. Their microphone input preamps are generally very noisy and low quality. If you use software synths, samplers etc. or need to monitor anything through the DAW software built-in sound cards are unlikely to provide low enough latency to be usable. Latency being the time it takes for the audio to get into the computer, be processed and sent out again or the time it takes for a software instrument to produce the sound and it then to be made audible. This is easy to spot because you'll get a noticable delay between triggering a note and hearing it.

    Avoid ASIO4ALL if possible. Some people on some forums seem to recommend it as an "ideal solution", even suggesting it be used when the interface manufacturers supply a very good driver of their own. It isn't ideal, far from it. It's an admittedly clever and complicated hack that attempts to compensate for the lack of an actual low-latency ASIO driver, but it's still a complicated hack. It can be very difficult to configure and cause havoc in all kinds of ways, including interfering with other audio drivers on the system.

    There's a lot to consider when putting together a DAW and home studio, but that's the nature of the beast I'm afraid.

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    RamboFB
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/23 12:46:00 (permalink)
    pwalpwal
    comfort if you're wearing them for long periods of time, leakage if you'll be recording mic while wearing them, flat frequency response (ie, no "bass boost" etc)
    ideally you should try them in a shop
    good luck!


     
    Thanks for the reply and the information. 
    tlw
    If you want to record vocals against a click or any tracks you've already recorded you'll need closed back headphones to monitor with. Open backed headphones allow sound to leak out, which microphones can (and usually will) pick up. I'd suggest adding Sennheiser to the list of phones to consider, the HD25 range is pretty good. They're aimed at DJs who need to hear one thing while a PA is pumping out something else, so have good isolation (low leakage) and are fairly honest, at least as honest as most affordable headphones get.

    Headphones aren't ideal for mixing, because they present a very different picture to speakers, especially regarding panning and the problem where a sound in one stereo channel negates something in the other. Usually obvious on speakers, but not headphones as the sound from them doesn't blend in the air before it reaches your ears.

    A built-in sound card might be OK if you just use it for playback, but they are usually very poor if used for recording purposes. Their microphone input preamps are generally very noisy and low quality. If you use software synths, samplers etc. or need to monitor anything through the DAW software built-in sound cards are unlikely to provide low enough latency to be usable. Latency being the time it takes for the audio to get into the computer, be processed and sent out again or the time it takes for a software instrument to produce the sound and it then to be made audible. This is easy to spot because you'll get a noticable delay between triggering a note and hearing it.

    Avoid ASIO4ALL if possible. Some people on some forums seem to recommend it as an "ideal solution", even suggesting it be used when the interface manufacturers supply a very good driver of their own. It isn't ideal, far from it. It's an admittedly clever and complicated hack that attempts to compensate for the lack of an actual low-latency ASIO driver, but it's still a complicated hack. It can be very difficult to configure and cause havoc in all kinds of ways, including interfering with other audio drivers on the system.

    There's a lot to consider when putting together a DAW and home studio, but that's the nature of the beast I'm afraid.


    Thank you so much for taking the time to write such a detailed reply. I really do appreciate it very much!
     
    Ok now I know about the closed or open backed heaphones point I really feel I can make a much better descion. Just wondering why would you ever want open back headphones for recording? In what situation would these be helpful?
     
    I know, I have been researching on this matter! Being honest with you sometimes I get in late at night and I have neighbours etc so I just want to be able to do something. At least with the headphones I can still get a bit done!! I know its not perfect but to be honest again, mixing is the least of my problems at this stage, lol!!
     
    Like I said I have recording interfaces which I use, ie I'm never using the onboard sound card to record. Interestingly I did have some latency problems when using the virtual keyboard at the start but this was fixed by chaning the mixing latency to fast rather than safe. So far I havent changed this setting but I havent had any problems..........yet!!!
     
    I dont know anything about this ASIO4ALL you speak of. I will need to research that one, find out what I can!
     
    Yep totally! For me its just all the options, theres just too many for newbies like me but I suppose you just learn what works and what doesn't!!
     
    Again thanks alot. I really appreicate you taking your time to answer me!!!
    #8
    tlw
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/23 13:54:03 (permalink)
    Open backed headphones can offer a more honest, flatter fequency response than closed back, especially in the mids. But they generally leak more sound which can be a problem if mics pick it up. Closed back isolate better, and often have a stronger bass output but not necessarily as flat as some of the open backs which do have extended bass.

    In reality, nearfield monitors are generally more useful, but as you say they make a noise which can be a problem in some situations. The ideal solution is to have monitors and phones of course.

    As for ASIO4ALL, if you have no need for what it does, my advice is don't waste time researching it. There are so many conflicting opinions and experiences of it that confusion is a more likely result than clarity. One area it is useful is if you do everything "in the box", need to be mobile, use a laptop PC and don't want to carry a small dedicated audio interface along with your laptop. But other than that an interface that comes with manufacturer-supplied, regularly updated and good dedicated ASIO drivers is pretty much always better.

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    dwardzala
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/24 14:35:56 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby RamboFB 2016/04/25 07:20:37
    RamboFB, your BR800 is an audio interface.  I use one with my laptop (because it works on USB3.0 and Win10.)  You only get 2 channels with the BR as an AI (not 4 like in standalone mode) but there are a number of different workflows you can use.  It doesn't have great connections for monitors (RCA's) but it will work just find for headphones.
     
    If you need help setting it up, post and I'll try to help you.  As far as headphones, the AT recommendation is a good one.

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    RamboFB
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/25 07:10:38 (permalink)
    dwardzala
    RamboFB, your BR800 is an audio interface.  I use one with my laptop (because it works on USB3.0 and Win10.)  You only get 2 channels with the BR as an AI (not 4 like in standalone mode) but there are a number of different workflows you can use.  It doesn't have great connections for monitors (RCA's) but it will work just find for headphones.
     
    If you need help setting it up, post and I'll try to help you.  As far as headphones, the AT recommendation is a good one.




    Hi thank you for the reply.
     
    Yes I have used it as an audio interface but I was unaware that it supported USB3.0, thanks a lot for that information.
     
    I see, didn't know that you could record two tracks at once when using the USB function. Again thank you for that information.
     
    I had actually thought all monitors were connected through RCA's but that shows how much I know. I will look into this nearer the time if I decide to purchase a set of monitors.
     
    Thanks I appreciate that, I'm ok with the BR800 at the moment but I have been consulting the manual ALOT..
     
    Thanks again.
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    tlw
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/25 18:09:38 (permalink)
    The usual connection for studio monitors is an electronically balanced one using TRS jack or XLR plugs and running at +4dB levels, not the lower levels usually found on consumer electronics.

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    eph221
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/27 16:26:36 (permalink)
    I agree with pwalpwal about the 7506's.  Some say they emphasize the higher frequencies, but that's often not really an issue.  The other great choice is the 280PRo's.  Both are under 100 if you do a little research.  They retail for much more.
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    Cactus Music
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/27 23:32:22 (permalink)
    Headphones are now produced by the millions of container loads ,, there has never been so many headphones manufactured probably thanks to the way people now listen to music. This is a good thing for us musicians who where used to paying over $100 for cans. Mass production brings the price down.  
    I'm a sucker for trying $15 headphones you'll see in dollar or discount stores. 
    I've seen the exact same headphones sell for $150 in a fancy box and a skull or some cool graphics added. I think it's the biggest consumer scam going. Ear buds too!  
    But for the most part I've had good luck if you know what to look for in the design. 
    My latest batch sound as good as any of the ones I own made by Sony, AKG, AT etc. Most of those all have issues. All headphones share one thing in common, flimsy cables that are easily destroyed by studio musicians.  So I'm though with name brand cans. 
    With the $15 ones, I'll try one pair and if I like them I go buy a bunch. 
    When I travel I have done a lot of editing and listening with just my laptop and a pair of these $15 headphones. 
    I've even brought mixes very close to finished with them.  
    I'd post what brand but they have no markings on them ! 
     
    post edited by Cactus Music - 2016/04/27 23:55:01

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    patm300e
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    Re: Entry level headphones for monitoring?? 2016/04/29 12:38:08 (permalink)
    I bought a pair of the REALLY CHEAP (< $30.00 on Amazon) Superlux HD681s.
    http://www.amazon.com/Superlux-681-Dynamic-Semi-Open-Headphones/dp/B002GHIPYI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1461947836&sr=8-1&keywords=Superlux+HD681
     
    Sonarworks has  a profile for them.  http://sonarworks.com/headphones/overview/
     
    I can say that when I turn off the plugin the superlux phones are a little on the annoying side with boomy bass.  I am used to Sennheiser (Lower end HD210s).  The Supeluxs with the plugin engaged sound very smooth. 
     
    UPDATE: I use these for mixing now all the time...They seem to translate (to my phone, car, etc.) better mixes than I was doing with my Sennheiser HD-200s.
     
     
     
     

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