brconflict
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How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
Are we better off? I think so. I'm a critic when it comes to software and products that I use. Some time ago, I've complained a few times that Sonar suffered from an infrequent and less agile development cycles, and that there was less information available of each release. My understanding is that Sonar is not quite as modular as it wants to be, and that there's some challenges around that, but it seems to be finding its way to a more agile cycle. Here's what I like: - More frequent updates, but slimmed down in new features - less to break in each iteration.
- More focused updates. Since there's fewer changes in each iteration/revision, there's less testing that has to be done to ensure nothing else broke.
- QA and Beta testers can be better utilized by this focus.
- Support can better be trained on what's new and be better prepared to answer questions or solve problems that are typically similar. No mass influx of Support calls when a release comes out.
- Bakers can revisit reported issues more easily because there's probably fewer of them reported, and a shorter list of what changed.
- Well-documented changes of each release.
- Rollbacks; if it breaks your Sonar experience, just revert! Easy!
- Less suffering of bugs and their workarounds. If the bug/fixed are patched quickly, you don't have to vent frustration of impatience.
- Posted update news and eZine. We now get to see more of what's coming and what's being fixed in each release.
- When you can see the future, you can decide when you want to continue receiving updates, upon renewals.
- Lowered learning curve of new features. Again, the fewer there are in each release, the less you have to learn or re-learn!
- More focused, current forum topics. Topics are more routinely focused on what's in the latest release. Rather than spewing feedback, complains, praises, questions, concerns, excitement etc. each year of massive changes, we can reduce the stampede approach when each new release is delivered!
- Perhaps this model may be a step toward a very modular update approach where Sonar isn't just one process, or is abstracted from other areas of coding, meaning that routine changes/patches/updates are able to take place without upgrading Sonar altogether.
- And not least: It's still NOT a subscription model.
What I don't like: - My constant checking for new updates. heh.
- I'd still like to see a list of reported issues not fixed in the current release, just in case I stumble upon the same problem someone else reported, I can at least know Cakewalk is working on a fix.
Want to add anything else you like?
Brian Sonar Platinum, Steinberg Wavelab Pro 9, MOTU 24CoreIO w/ low-slew OP-AMP mods and BLA external clock, True P8, Audient ASP008, API 512c, Chandler Germ500, Summit 2ba-221, GAP Pre-73, Peluso 22251, Peluso 2247LE, Mackie HR824, Polk Audio SRS-SDA 2.3tl w/upgraded Soniccraft crossovers and Goertz cables, powered by Pass-X350. All wiring Star-Quad XLR or Monster Cable. Power by Monster Power Signature AVS2000 voltage stabilizer and Signature Pro Power 5100 PowerCenter on a 20A isolation shielded circuit.
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wst3
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 13:31:11
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overall I think it is working out well, my only gripe is the time spent once a month or so evaluating, and then usually installing the update<G>. I haven't run into any problems, so it has just been the time to run the install, but some months that has been a bit of a push.
All things considered, that's a pretty minor thing!
-- Bill Audio Enterprise KB3KJF
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Starise
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 13:54:22
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I guess I don't analyze it quite so deeply. I've been making music and enjoying the new features. What do you mean by Sonar wants to be more modular?
I think Cakewalk took a bold step to introduce the purchase model they have chosen. I believe it benefits the end user far more than it does them. The monthly or yearly "non-subscription" plan holds them to a certain standard or expectation which I have to admire.
It's a commitment to roll out a new model every single month. Usually the improvements are substantial beyond mere functionality with plugs and the common bugs. These improvements have more than offset the cost of the software if purchased separately, moreover all additions are designed to work inside of Sonar.
Go price vocal alignment or drum replacement software. Go price the better plug-ins if they were sold separately and you can see the value start to add up. Look at purchasing some of the comparitive software instruments separately...it starts to add up. It's becoming less and less necessary to shop for any additional plugs or effects.
There are very specific directives involved beyond simply eliminating bugs as feature requests trickle in. The competition does this whenever, however, wherever and this would be the less stressful route to take for them.
This is real progress that bridges the gap between end user and software engineer which can only be a good thing.
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Mojo3432
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 14:56:00
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Starise
The competition does this whenever, however, wherever and this would be the less stressful route to take for them. +1. I agree completely. Plus, Cakewalk is continually demonstrating that they DO actually listen to what their customers want and try to provide those wants/requests in each or future updates. That says a lot about the company and helps to cement (at least in my case) customer loyalty.
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Zargg
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 15:41:02
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Hi. I am very happy with the new model / release cycle we have now. It has been increasingly more stable and snappier on my end. I like taking in a little (of the features) at the time, and in my mind it is easier with smaller releases.
I would not like to go back to "the old way".
All the best.
Ken Nilsen ZarggBBZWin 10 Pro X64, Cakewalk by Bandlab, SPlat X64, AMD AM3+ fx-8320, 16Gb RAM, RME Ucx (+ ARC), Tascam FW 1884, M-Audio Keystation 61es, *AKAI MPK Pro 25, *Softube Console1, Alesis DM6 USB, Maschine MkII Laptop setup: Win 10 X64, i5 2.4ghz, 8gb RAM, 320gb 7200 RPM HD, Focusrite Solo, + *
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LLyons
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 15:52:51
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Model - great. Software - great. Sunny day - great. Harley ready to go - priceless.
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listen
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 16:03:02
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☄ Helpfulby Zargg71 2016/05/13 16:37:16
Enjoying the journey, recognizing there will never be what we call a FINAL destination....
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Cactus Music
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 17:04:25
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For me the new system works way better than the old once a year updates, which for me was more like once every 3 years because I'd skip versions. So now when I have time I can hit the big button and see what happens. It's a huge bunch of stuff in this first year alone. I have not done monthly more like every 3 months, so that's every 3 months instead of 3 years.
My only gripe is my own lack of time to explore these features. I do a lot of stuff arse backwards still. I keep promising myself I will spend a week just learning and stop recording until I'm back up to snuff.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 17:12:52
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I absolutely love this model.
Stability has increased along with the new features - I'm throwing all manner of different projects at Sonar and it just sits there saying, "that all ya got?"
I agree with Johnny on one point "My only gripe is my own lack of time to explore these features"
Amen to that!!
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FCCfirstclass
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 18:14:50
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rwheeler
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 18:37:35
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Works great for me, much better than annual or less frequent updates that are too big to digest. Also, this is a shining example for other software companies to emulate. I hate the "rent until you run out of money then watch the product die before your eyes" approach taken by Adobe (and others), and I vote with my dollars when deciding how to spend. Sonar is great value, and the monthly (or whenever I get around to it) updates make it even more valuable.
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Morvejones
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 18:51:02
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I love it, cant wait for the new updates, i love learning the features as the come out rather than a big pile of content
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subtlearts
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/13 20:09:37
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I'm afraid I'm going to have to pile on and agree that it's been pretty solid so far. Cakewalk took a big risk, waited out the inevitable resistance and growing pains, and for the most part, it seems like they've come through and delivered on the promise of the model. I hope that as time goes on we get some renewed attention for older features that need some attention - I have my own list of these and doubtless others have theirs - but thus far overall, I find little to complain about and have been a happy camper and early adopter of each month's installment.
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Sanderxpander
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/14 07:33:48
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I'm only moderately enthused but I can mostly get around the issues I have with the system. Mainly I find it annoying to scour the forum for bugs every time. So far every version has turned up minor quirks I think. That's not to say that I expect perfect code, and I'm happy with Sonar's stability as a whole or I wouldn't be using it. But getting updates more often means noticing small new bugs more often too and sometimes I find it frustrating to have to go over this process over and over again.
But my solution is simple - I don't upgrade during important projects and usually skip at least one iteration. I don't really use many of the included VSTs so the Rapture Pro bugs and the LP EQ/MB passed me by other than reading about them here, but it was still enough to stop me from running to the CCC and upgrading. Unless a specific feature represents a MAJOR workflow enhancement (like aux tracks and recording softsynth audio directly) I really don't need the very latest features. A month or two later is fine for me.
Although I must admit the one time I did upgrade during something important and it clonked out on me, the rollback feature was much quicker and more painless than I expected. I was actually sitting there with a friend who uses Logic going "oh ****, I think I'm going to have to go back to an older installation of Sonar", half embarrassed that this happened at all, but five minutes later we were back up and running and he said "huh
.. That was it already?"
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deswind
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/14 15:05:45
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I am very happy with this model. I hope there is an update that deals with more color options, including locking in the colors of a track that applies to new takes on that track. But it will always be something with every DAW, and Sonar is AWESOME.
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RD9
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/14 19:24:49
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Since you ask... There have been a few threads already on this subject including an unofficial poll that indicated ~66%% of the respondents liked the monthly updates. In my case it seemed too disruptive so I had been advocating for quarterly or half yearly updates. For me it really comes down to this: is the joy of discovery (that comes with new or updated software) important to me? From a functionality standpoint most modern DAWs would already suit my needs although some more than others.
After tallying the results from the poll I realised that Sonar would continue as it is. Based on this I went out and purchased Cubase 8.5 and am now moving my work over. I am aware of others that have shifted over to another DAW in the past year because of their dissatisfaction with the monthly update approach so it is likely that the 66% will rise over time.
Sonar is a very good DAW but the new delivery model did not suit me and I wanted the better midi editing that Cubase provides. I am enjoying Cubase and found it to be quite easy to learn since Sonar and Cubase are quite similar in their functionality.
Cheers.
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jpetersen
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/14 20:02:08
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As Craig says in the Sweetwater video: If you prefer quarterly updates - update quarterly. And many of us do use multiple DAWs. Probably a dangerous question to ask here, but: Could you give some insight into how Cubase's MIDI editing compares to Sonar's? I am looking for better MIDI editing, too.
post edited by jpetersen - 2016/05/14 20:25:08
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RD9
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/14 20:57:49
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jpetersen
1) As Craig says in the Sweetwater video: If you prefer quarterly updates - update quarterly. And many of us do use multiple DAWs.
Probably a dangerous question to ask here, but:
2) Could you give some insight into how Cubase's MIDI editing compares to Sonar's? I am looking for better MIDI editing, too.
JP, Item 1: I have heard this argument (logical, not emotional) from the Gibson VP before and it has some validity, however skipping updates is not quite the same thing as less frequent updates. For one thing, the Forum (and I suspect Cakewalk) cease addressing any issues with a version after one month, after that your software is "out of date". Item2: Addressing this here probably isn't what the OP Brian intended with this Thread. Craig Anderton did mention this discrepancy in some recent posts and there are probably some reviews on Youtube which do a better job of comparing MIDI editing amongst the DAWs. Cheers
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rickbail
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/14 21:09:42
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Why yes, I do like it very much so.
Rick
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hockeyjx
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/14 21:17:49
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I do think the new system is better than the old one for sure. Maybe fixes/tweaks/etc would be steady every month, and quarterly would best for new features.
Bottom line is that I believe in the bakers and what they are doing, thus I re-upped this year.
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icontakt
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/14 22:09:17
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RD9
however skipping updates is not quite the same thing as less frequent updates. For one thing, the Forum (and I suspect Cakewalk) cease addressing any issues with a version after one month, after that your software is "out of date".
Very good point.
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jpetersen
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/15 06:01:22
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RD9
...For one thing, the Forum (and I suspect Cakewalk) cease addressing any issues with a version after one month, after that your software is "out of date".
I guess bugs in recent features enjoy priority because the code is still fresh in the dev's minds. Older bugs do occasionally get fixed, but I sure cannot figure out how the Bakers make their decisions. The Problem Reporter is full of fairly serious bugs supplied with clearly reproducible steps and yet recently they fixed an obscure bug in the "Clean Audio Folder" tool. RD9
Item2: ... probably some reviews on Youtube which do a better job of comparing MIDI editing amongst the DAWs. I have not really found anything informative, but you are right, this is not the place.
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RobWS
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/15 08:07:50
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The more time you can dedicate to SONAR, the more you'll get out of it. Simple statement, but unless you can dedicate a large amount of time to it, it can be overwhelming. With the old annual release format, I always looked forward to the Karl Rose instructional tutorials. But with a monthly update from Cakewalk, it's a bit too much to take in. I rarely touch the application, but when I do, I feel like I have to start all over again and then figure out what has been added. So, I paid for the first year of updates but that was all. Has anyone ever complained of getting too much? Maybe that's what I'm doing here. Nothing wrong with this new monthly model, but it's just a bit too much for me to keep up with.
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MacFurse
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Re: How does everyone like the more frequent Sonar releases so far?
2016/05/15 08:13:54
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Works for me, just wish I had more time to investigate some of the new features. I subscribe to a few software packages now, probably like most others here, but honestly, nothing else gives me the same value. If I stopped paying, I would just keep making music. If I stop paying 365, or Adobe - nothing......
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