Thoughts on Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 vs Saffire Pro 40

Hey all. Due to several hardware/OS-related reasons, I found it necessary to switch from my longstanding Saffire Pro 40 (FireWire) interface to its USB counterpart, the Scarlett 18i20.
 
While overall the performance is exactly as expected and a very clean transition to the Scarlett, I have noticed some differences and my guess is that it has more to do with the connection type (USB vs FireWire).
 
The Pros: just like the Saffire, the Scarlett's latency is little-no-none. (Yes, there's ALWAYS latency, but both buggers are fast and latency during tracking isn't noticeable). I'd always set the Saffire at 64 samples when tracking, then bumped up to 512 or 1024 when mixing. The Scarlett's settings are in milliseconds as opposed to samples so that took a little getting used to, but I'm still able to track at 2ms without any clicks/pops/dropouts, which is on par with the Saffire.
 
However, there are some drawbacks:
 
1) The Scarlett does not have a loopback function in Mix Control, whereas the Saffire did. While I didn't use the feature very often, it was nice to be able to record what my PC was "hearing", as in, set up loopback, arm/record a track, then play something on YouTube, thereby capturing the audio. It seems the only way to do this with the Scarlett is to manually set up a cable patch from physical outputs/inputs on the interface.
 
2) While it's often been said that Windows doesn't allow applications to share ASIO drivers simultaneously, I was always able to do this with the Saffire. (I'd select the "share drivers" settings within SONAR first, of course.) I could have an open session in SONAR, export audio, then play it back in Windows Media Player without having to close out SONAR. Likewise, I could have a browser open and jump back and forth between YouTube and SONAR without a hitch. No longer the case. If SONAR is open, everything else is locked out.
 
3) I have an Eleven Rack connected to the Scarlett via SPDIF. I also have the Eleven Rack connected to the PC (USB connection) so I can run the Eleven Rack Editor (change amp models etc. without having to use the hardware's knobs/buttons). With the Saffire, I noticed some clicking/popping when tracking with the Eleven Rack, so I ended up changing the clock settings on the Saffire from Internal to SPDIF, and that did the trick. While I haven't noticed the clicks/pops thus far with the Scarlett, I have noticed that I cannot set the Scarlett to SPIDF and still use it within SONAR. SONAR then recognizes the Eleven Rack as my ASIO device and I'm not able to select the Scarlett. Didn't work that way with the Saffire.  Hopefully I don't notice any clicks/pops this time around - and that would inevitably be better anyway since I'd no longer have to change clock settings and could just keep the Scarlett set at Internal. But if I run into sync settings again, not sure what my options are, aside from getting rid of the SPDIF connection and running analog outs from the 11R into line inputs on the Scarlett.
 
4) For whatever reason, it seems to take the USB connection a while longer to fire up when starting Windows. I used to hear the "welcome" jingle when starting Windows, now I just hear a couple static pops, as if the Scarlett is fully fired up and ready by the time Windows startup plays the audio file. Not a big deal of course because who cares, but still odd.
 
5) Audio engine dropouts. The Scarlett will sometimes not be recognized right away when I launch SONAR and will require either (a) closing SONAR, firing up Mix Control, make sure settings are correct, then re-launching SONAR, or (b) powering off/on the interface to get everything reset. Doesn't happen often and once it's there, it stays there (i.e. I don't lose the connection once SONAR is live), but still goofy.
 
So it seems to me that this is all USB related, since that's the primary difference between the two interfaces. I know that FireWire is pretty much a dead technology, and since Thunderbolt isn't heavily supported in Windows, it seems USB is really the only viable interface option at this point. It's too bad, because FireWire was always rock solid for me on the old setup, and I'd still be using it were it not for IEEE 1394 chipset/motherboard/Windows 10 compatibility issues.
 
Are these types of issues typical of any USB interface and just something I need to get used to? Or are others on here using the Scarlett (or other USB) interfaces and don't experience any of the scenarios I've described?

Thanks for the feedback. Strange that the Saffire was janky for you but rock solid for me...I guess that's what we get for having PCs. Tons of options and much less expensive, but configuration anomalies abound!
 
I failed to mention it, but yes, I'm connecting both devices to USB ports, not hubs. Also, both for the Scarlett and the Eleven Rack, documentation states that they need to be plugged into USB 2.0 ports, not USB 3.0. Since this is a new board, most USB ports are now 3.0 so my 2.0 options are limited.
 
Thanks for the tool resources; I'll give them a run.
 
I think I'm going to give the Saffire another shot by picking up the PCIe FireWire card that's recommended for Focusrite products in Windows 10. Although that particular card has known compatibility issues with my Z170 chipset, if all else fails I can just return the card.
 
It should be noted that none of my issues are earth shattering and I still have a very usable setup; it's just that things were much more flexible and convenient with the Saffire and I'm hoping I can get that working on my new setup.

I didn't have any issues with my Windows 7/Z68 setup, but Windows 10/Z170 has some known issues with FireWire/Focusrite and there are only a handful of IEEE 1394 chipsets that have been shown to work. The one I'm picking up has the Texas Instruments chipset known to be most compatible for audio interfaces, and even though it hasn't worked on some Z170 boards, I'm hoping that mine will be the exception. I used the newest BIOS and chipset drivers when I built the PC so fingers are crossed!

Yeah, in most cases I don't run into any issues either. The dropout issue doesn't happen very much at all and is rock solid the vast majority of the time. Kinda weird that my USB port isn't "waking up" in time for the Windows welcome ditty, but whatever. No big deal.
 
Of course, for me, issues 1-3 are what I really liked about the Saffire, especially 1 & 2, since there's a workaround for the Eleven Rack (bypassing SPDIF and just running analog outs/ins) if I do run into clicks/pops.

Sonico
I have the 18i20 and it has been rock solid for like two years (since I bought it).
I run it at 32 samples when tracking and 64 when mixing and no problems at all.
I run Sonar or my other DAW, export my mix, then open it in Ozone 7 work on it (with DAW open), export my file and play it against other tracks in WMP or itunes (DAW and Ozone open).
While DAW is exporting mixes, I watch something in youtube and no problems either.
Is what I describe that you are not able to do with the Scarlett?

Yep, that's exactly what I can't to. If I have a session open in SONAR and I open up a web browser and try to play something on YouTube, there's either (a) no audio from the browser or (b) an error message from YouTube stating an error occurred during playback. Same thing if I open up iTunes and try to play something, nothing happens. Also true with any other application that uses audio drivers (Premiere Pro).
 
Likewise, if I have another application open that's using audio (such as Chrome w/YouTube) and I attempt to open a session in SONAR, I get an error message stating that SONAR is unable to open audio record device, etc.
 
I know it's been said that Windows doesn't support multiple audio devices simultaneously, but in the case of my Saffire it did, and apparently in the case of your Scarlett, it does, too!

Yeah, that's what I meant. Apparently I type faster than I think. :)

My onboard audio devices are also disabled, so I have no clue.

biodiode
I had the same problem with my 18i20 in respect of other audio programs not playing back when Sonar was open. I solved the issue by right clicking on the speaker icon and choosing recording devices and deselected the 'Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device', same with the playback.
If that doesn't work let us know and I will see if I changed any other settings.

Nope, that doesn't work either. I can have iTunes/YouTube open at the same time and both will play back audio simultaneously, but if SONAR is open nothing else will play audio unless I close SONAR.

Just an update: 
 
Received the Focusrite-recommended FireWire card with TI chipset in the mail, plugged it in, hooked up the Saffire, and bingo. Works flawlessly.
 
So now I've got my loopback back, the ability to run multiple audio programs simultaneously, etc. Although that particular card had been known to have some compatibility issues with some Z170 boards, evidently my board isn't one of them. :)
 
Happy camper here!

Yep, Windows 10 here.
 
Long and short of it:
 
Built a brand new PC (specs in signature) with a clean install of Windows 10 Pro (64-bit). My particular Z170 board (ASUS Z170-AR with newest available BIOS & chipset drivers installed before OS installation) works great with the new FireWire card recommended by Focusrite. (http://www.amazon.com/DP-Firewire-800-PCIe-NN-FW0012-S1/dp/B001EQCNMW?ie=UTF8&psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00). I didn't install any drivers for the card, just plugged it in and Windows found it. Went into Device Manager and was happy to see "Texas Instruments" listed as a IEEE 1394 device. 
 
Installed the newest version of Saffire Mix Control then plugged in the 40 Pro...worked like a charm.
 
Only caveat - had to buy an adapter so I could plug in my 400 cable into the 800 ports on the new card. :)