Seeking Honest Critique

Author
Mdemers
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 166
  • Joined: 2004/09/10 12:49:02
  • Location: Wickenburg, AZ
  • Status: offline
2005/01/15 15:54:17 (permalink)

Seeking Honest Critique

We're getting ready to start on the (hopefully) final, updated, version of this song for our demo. We're looking for honest critique and any advice, on any and all aspects; from mixing, to guitar work, to effects, to song structure, etc, etc.

The updated version will have an added verse and chorus, as well as a middle eight break, so it won't sound as repetitious.

All feedback is welcomed - from both a technical or artistic point of view.

Thanks in advance.
#1

13 Replies Related Threads

    Guest
    Max Output Level: -25.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 4951
    • Joined: 2009/08/03 10:50:51
    • Status: online
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 16:00:06 (permalink)
    i'm gonna spend a little ear-time with this one .. i'll post
    later...
    jeff
    #2
    Mdemers
    Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 166
    • Joined: 2004/09/10 12:49:02
    • Location: Wickenburg, AZ
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 16:11:18 (permalink)
    Thank you. It will be very much appreciated I can assure you.

    sidenote:
    The link above is a direct link to the song, however. If you go here and click on the top song, "Every Soul Needs Love," it seems to be a better sound quality on this one. I'm not quite sure why that is - but it is.

    I've heard that some don't want to respond if they have to jump thru too many hoops to get to the song, so I provided the direct link. But there is a definite difference in sound quality between the two - for some reason.

    Thanks again everyone.
    #3
    den121961
    Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 149
    • Joined: 2003/12/28 14:49:39
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 19:24:01 (permalink)
    Definitely a difference between those two links! Loved the deep wah guitaralthough it seemed to make the song left channel heavy on my system. Loved the reverb on the vocals, and that background lead type sound. Maybe a bit of that would have worked on the way guitar?

    Den
    #4
    Mdemers
    Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 166
    • Joined: 2004/09/10 12:49:02
    • Location: Wickenburg, AZ
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 19:58:22 (permalink)
    Thank you. We're probably going to tone the wah down a bit in the final mix. I was told it sounds like a 70's porn flick. Not exactly what we were going for.

    Thanks for the comments. I've also been told to leave the reverb completely off the vocal mix. I guess one man's trash is another man's treasure. If we all liked the same thing there would only have to be one song. . . then what would we all do?
    #5
    den121961
    Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 149
    • Joined: 2003/12/28 14:49:39
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 20:02:39 (permalink)
    I always get told some of my funk stuff sounds like porn music. As far as I know, there were no "porn" film composers so I am assuming they took their stuff from whatever was popular back then and maybe some people's only exposure to dated music is through older porn movies? Either way I wouldn't let anyone's association with a wah pedal and porn make you change our mind about it, it seems to really fit the song well.

    Den
    #6
    Guest
    Max Output Level: -25.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 4951
    • Joined: 2009/08/03 10:50:51
    • Status: online
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 20:29:57 (permalink)
    like a 70's porn flick
    nice critique .. sheesh .. that's
    when you say "name a couple .. 'cause I don't remember the
    soundtracks all that well" ;-)

    anyway .. listened to it .. and i think the vox has way too much
    verb on it and it makes it sound far away (cavernous) .. but the
    song wants it to be close and personal. the guitar at :58 needs to
    come up .. and have a little more warmth / presence to it .. maybe
    a touch of distortion. the vox needs compression to level it out a bit.
    the bass and kick on the drum need to come up a bit to give this a
    bit more of a skeleton. i would let it sustain out at the end .. it's a bit
    abrupt. is the vox a bit "R" .. i would say you probably want it dead
    center.

    anyway .. it's a good song . got potential .. mostly just mixing stuff.

    jeff
    < Message edited by jmarkham -- 1/15/2005 5:38:58 PM >
    #7
    m11
    Max Output Level: -82 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 417
    • Joined: 2004/10/12 12:50:38
    • Location: Germany
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 20:32:28 (permalink)
    Hi Mdemers,

    You want me to be honest? Ok, there you are:
    The acoustic guitar rattes and seems to be out of tune (at least one of the higher strings).
    This is the first time I have to say that the vocals are too loud.
    Reduce the reverb at the vocals. Don't leave it completely off.
    There is also very much reverb at the drums. Try to set a similar reverb to all tracks to get a related room impression.

    The vocals seem to go to the left ant to the right. This is irritating.

    The song is a bit short, and the vocals stop surprisingly. Why don't you repeat the refrain?

    The songwriting is good, I like the melody.

    hth.
    Melf
    #8
    Mdemers
    Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 166
    • Joined: 2004/09/10 12:49:02
    • Location: Wickenburg, AZ
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 21:26:47 (permalink)
    Thank you for the insight. I tried the vocals at a lower level and the words got lost in the mix. Could just be bad articulation, or the wrong mics.

    The version we're getting ready to do is pretty much the same, except where this one cuts off - it goes into an instrumental break with a variation on the chord progression (just to break it up a bit). Then it comes back in with another verse, the chorus, and a much more polished ending.

    I appreciate your honesty. And yes, I tend to keep my G string a little on the flat side and everyone gives me hard time about it. I guess it's just my ears.

    Vocals moving left and right? Hmmm. I don't know why that could be. They were recorded on one track in stereo with a MXL 990 large condensor mic and a MXL 991 condensor mic slightly overhead and back, with the pan set in the center.

    The Rattles must be my playing. The guitar is a Martin that I only bought about three months ago, and it's one of the sweetest sounding instruments I've ever picked up. I'll definitely keep an eye on that when we start recording.

    Keeping all the reverbs the same makes a lot of sense too. As soon as I read that it seems to me I heard that a long time ago and just forgot about it. I tend to focus on one track or instrument at a time as far as sound goes, and pretty much just adjust levels on the overall mix. But I'm learning with each project.

    Thanks again for your help.
    #9
    Mdemers
    Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 166
    • Joined: 2004/09/10 12:49:02
    • Location: Wickenburg, AZ
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 21:36:08 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: jmarkham
    anyway .. listened to it .. and i think the vox has way too much
    verb on it and it makes it sound far away (cavernous) .. but the
    song wants it to be close and personal. the guitar at :58 needs to
    come up .. and have a little more warmth / presence to it .. maybe
    a touch of distortion. the vox needs compression to level it out a bit.
    the bass and kick on the drum need to come up a bit to give this a
    bit more of a skeleton. i would let it sustain out at the end .. it's a bit
    abrupt. is the vox a bit "R" .. i would say you probably want it dead
    center.

    anyway .. it's a good song . got potential .. mostly just mixing stuff.

    jeff
    Yes, that guitar was recorded direct, (experimenting). The only compression I have is the one in the SONAR audio effects, and I'm still (experimenting) there also. Not sure if it will work for vocals.

    We're using a different mic placement on the drum kit. I'm putting a mic closer to the kick and snare, then I'm going to duplicate that track and play around with eq until I can get more punch there. As far as abrupt, the revised version is longer and more polished. This version was kind of a one time thru sound check.

    Thank you very much. I've read a lot of your posts and I very much respect your input.
    #10
    MannyNY
    Max Output Level: -76 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 732
    • Joined: 2004/01/20 06:29:45
    • Location: Sound Beach, New York
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 21:50:53 (permalink)
    Hi,

    Liked the tune, liked the vocal a lot (voice has a rich, full quality). The others have pointed out some of the things that could use some tweaking – I guess I’d just say it really could use a bridge (I know, you’re working on that). When you have a good tune and someone that sings it well, you’re pretty much there – the rest is just hammering out the details – nice going.
    #11
    Guest
    Max Output Level: -25.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 4951
    • Joined: 2009/08/03 10:50:51
    • Status: online
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 22:03:59 (permalink)
    I very much respect your input.

    you know who would help you far more than me is chaz .. he's
    got ears ... i'm mostly a composer and a mixing hack ;-)
    jeff
    #12
    RLD
    Max Output Level: -55.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 1990
    • Joined: 2003/11/06 10:11:26
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 22:05:38 (permalink)
    I like this song as well, but I always keep the "less is more" saying in mind when reverb is used...
    of course it may be a matter of personal taste, but I would back off on the vocal and drum reverb...go for a drier, closer, more intimate feel...
    I also hear some tuning issues with the stringed instruments...
    This has great potential...give it some more thought!...

    RLD
    #13
    Mdemers
    Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 166
    • Joined: 2004/09/10 12:49:02
    • Location: Wickenburg, AZ
    • Status: offline
    RE: Seeking Honest Critique 2005/01/15 22:19:53 (permalink)
    I've read several posts Chaz has done also, and yes, he definitely knows his stuff. I'm nowhere near that level yet. He talks way over my head. I'm sure he could pinpoint down to the minutest detail exactly what I need to do to improve this mix - and I probably wouldn't understand a word of it.

    I'll say this (slightly off topic). This forum has been the most helpful forum I've ever visited, (which is why I keep coming back). And by an overwhelming majority, the members are the most encouraging, helpful, friendly, knowledgeable, and talented people I've dealt with. I don't know a lot of the technical differences between one companies software and another, but this forum alone has certainly made me glad I chose SONAR.
    #14
    Jump to:
    © 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1