Headphones for Mixing

Hey Everyone,
 
So I have a question... I obviously jump back and forth between my headphones (Sennheiser HD380Pro) and my monitors (Event TR8, which are in need of a replacement after over 10 years but that's another post) for mixing and mastering... Then I go take the music and test it in my car and stereo and favorite headphones and blahblahblah...
 
LATELY though I've been doing the majority of my mixing/mastering in my headphones...
 
For the MOST part I get good results and things sound how they're supposed to and of course I end up having to go back and make tweaks like all of us do to make sure it sounds as good as possible everywhere, but for the most part I'm getting a good representation of what things sound like.
 
But sometimes the results are SO off. The biggest version of SO off appears when a song has that headache inducing sound in the car. It's hard to describe but all the sudden you start feeling like crap while listening to it haha. I've had that happen a few times and it just doesn't happen in my home studio. But it's not just that... It could be like the drums are way too loud in the car or you can barely hear this one instrument in my stereo. You guys all know how that is.
 
So I guess my question is... a) What headphones are you guys using for the most accurate mix? and b) any particular hints for the headache thing for those that have ever run into that one :-)
 
David

Hey, David... a number of us use KRK KNS 8400's.  I selected them because they are considered among the flatest on the market.  Additionally, you should run Sonarworks in the master bus to insure optimal mix eq... Sonarworks has profiled the 8400s and it has made a huge improvement in my final mixes.  Others here agree... Many of us rely on it to better translate headphone mixing.  If you wanna go all whole hog they will even profile your specific pair of headphones...
 
Btw, U got Tundra yet? Working on a makeshift studio at the moment as I'm relocating but oh my, Spitfire again opens new territory!

bluzdog
BeyerDynamic DT770 Pro 80 ohm and/or AT ATHM50 with SonarWorks or Focusrite VRM box.
 
Rocky

+ 1 Audio-technica ATH-M50

a) What headphones are you guys using for the most accurate mix?
 
I love my DT880s. Very comfortable. And I like the "air" of a semi-open back set of cans for mixing.
 
b) any particular hints for the headache thing for those that have ever run into that one :-)
 
Not on anything I've done, but one album in particular is pain inducing when played in my Subie Forester over a 440 watt HK system, Que Pasa by Babe Ruth. [If you're unfamiliar with them, check out their first album "First Base", six awesome songs, including a great cover of Zappa's "King Kong".] It's like they drove the entire mix at full speed into a brick wall (limiter), then backed up and did it again. And again. And again. Loud as hell. Almost no dynamics, but it sure does pump the sub, which pumps the entire enclosed volume of the car. I just can't listen to it at a desirable volume without pain.
 
The loudness and drug wars are both complete failures. Sigh. Geez, but I want to love that album. 
 

I have a theory about your headache-inducing car sound: it's your car's fault.
 
Seriously. Car stereos universally have horrible bass response. It has to do with the intentional manipulation of frequency response by the stereo itself, but mostly it's an acoustical problem. No matter how much money you've spent on aftermarket speakers, it's physically impossible to have flat bass in a car. The volume of air is too small, there are too many resonant cavities, too many reflective surfaces, and too little low-frequency absorption.
 
But, you say, I have commercial CDs that sound OK in my car. That's because they've been mixed and mastered in a very flat listening environment. Headphones are not flat. Even good ones lie. Even the ones that sound "good". Especially the ones that sound "good".
 
Your only hope is to train your ears to mitigate the headphones' defects, and you don't achieve that by listening to your own stuff on them, but by devoting many hours listening to quality commercial references through them. It's not a theory, it's a real psychological phenomenon; over time your subconscious will just know when your mix is right.
 
If you're using headphones just for mixing in a quiet room (not using them for tracking, not monitoring while a band is playing in the next room, not mixing in bed next to a sleeping spouse) then open-back or semi-open headphones will deliver a much flatter response than closed-back cans. 

i never 'mix' with headphones.
 
never.
 
never.
 
i always 'check' mixes with headphones, earbuds, and small mono boombox type speakers.
 
headphones are good for 'clinical' editing, tweaking specific problems.
 
but i never hear 'pure' headphone mixes that translate correctly on all platforms.
 
 
 
that said, i really dig my AKG 240's, they are cheap but excellent in sound

Anyone shopping for new headphones that are a step up from basic $100 cans might want to look at the planar magnetic technology from the likes of Audeze and HifiMan. They have received rave reviews from people who love great 'phone sound. Even Monoprice recently announced a couple of models. They look suspiciously like similar Audezes, but at a much lower price. Should be available soon.
 
Cheers,
Eddie
 
 
 

Hey, you won't find a better deal on this Planet !! 
 
Pay no attention to the seller.  KRK KNS8000 for $100.00

I have a pair of DT880 pros.   Not too bad, comfortable - but they are not exactly flat.  I use a MOTU AVB unit and it has more than enough power to fatigue my ears fast.  The open back helps a bit with bass build up, but the ear mind thing could not 'learn' how they translated into the mix all the time. 
 
I picked up a pair of DT1770s and somehow, they clicked with that ear mind thing.  When I hear something in the mix, I know how it might translate to a variety of devices.  They have a nice wide stage, fairly even response, comfortable...  Not top end mind you, but they are pretty good for the price.  I think they are worth checking out. 
 
Like others have said - I prefer using both monitors and headphones.  
 
LL