timwhite74
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External gear in Sonar X3
Hello all,
I'm new here. I use Sonar X3 and a Focusrite Saffire Pro 40 firewire interface. I've been looking online and on cakewalk.com for an answer with no luck. I don't see an option for External Insert in any of my fx bins. I only see FX Chain and all my plugins.
All I want to so is send audio out:
1. for 1 track to a compressor and back in to Sonar
2. send my entire mix out to a compressor and back in to Sonar
I think this has to be possible without using ProChannel (which i don't have).
ANY help is appreciated
Tim
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John
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 10, 17 12:29 AM
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☄ Helpfulby Zargg February 10, 17 4:34 PM
Thats doable. Sonar has an external insert plugin. If you have more than just the one stereo output that is outputs 3 and 4 you can use those as a stereo out to you compressor and bring is back in with inputs 3 and 4.
From page 1291 in the Sonar manual.
External Insert plug-in (Platinum and Professional only)
The purpose of the External Insert plug-in is to route audio to and from existing I/O ports in SONAR, allowing an
external audio device to be effectively patched into any FX Rack. This allows you to seamlessly incorporate your
favorite outboard gear in a SONAR project.
The External Insert plug-in is able to measure and automatically compensate for the round-trip delay through your
audio hardware (the time it takes for the audio to exit you computer, be processed by your external audio
hardware and finally returned to the computer).
External Insert interface
The left-hand side contains the hardware/external Send controls and the right-hand side contains the hardware/
external Return controls.
Send Stereo Mode buttons:
L (Left). This toggle enables/disables the left channel send output (enabled by default).
R (Right). This toggle enables/disables the right channel send output (enabled by default).
Mono. This toggle sums the stereo signal to make it dual-mono so the send output has the same audio on the
left and right channels.
Send Level. This is a +/- 24 dB trim to the level that is passed to the external send. This parameter is
automatable.
Send VU Meter. This meter shows the signal level being delivered to the external send. Since this is feeding a
sound card output, it is important to avoid clipping at this stage.
Send Port Picker. This control lets you choose an audio output that currently has nothing routed to it. This is the
port that you should connect to the input(s) of your external gear. All output ports that are already used in the
project are excluded (except for master buses that have other instances of the External Insert plug-in routed to
them).
Return Phase Control. This control flips the phase of the signal being returned to the external return input. This
parameter is automatable.
Return Level. This is a +/- 24 dB trim to the level that is passed from the external send. This parameter is
automatable.
Return VU Meter. This meter shows the signal level entering the external return.
Welcome to the forum.
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Kev999
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 10, 17 5:26 PM
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timwhite74
...I don't see an option for External Insert in any of my fx bins. I only see FX Chain and all my plugins...
It's definitely there. It's one of the menu options when you right-click on the fx bin.
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Audient:iD22+ASP800|KRK:VXT6|+various-outboard-gear|+guitars&basses, etc.
Having fun at work lately
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Jesse G
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 10, 17 5:50 PM
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This is how I used my External Insert for an external Lexicon M200 Reverb Unit for a cue mix with reverb not being recorded in Sonar Platinum.
Under Properties for Sonar
I first set a friendly label for the Ins in Sonar for In 7/ 8 in my Roland Octa-Capture I/O
I then set a friendly label for the Outs in Sonar for 7/8 in my Roland Octa-Capture I/O
7 Input = left = L-HW Reverb
8 Input = Right = R-HW Reverb
===================
7 Output = left = L-HW Reverb
8 Output = Right = R-HW Reverb
I then create a bus and select External Insert and set the IN to L-HW Reverb and the OUT to R-HW Reverb.
I then set the vocal track's output to the bus that has the External Insert on it and then create a send to Out 3/ 4 on that bus for a vocal cue mix with other tracks going to send out 3/4 . (You can set your buss out to the master bus for the compression)
Reverb heard nice and clear by the singer.
I am writing this while I am at work, so I may have missed a detail, but as I recall, this is how i set it up for my studio using HW reverb and a Headphone amp for the singer.
Hope this helps.
Peace,Jesse G.  A fisher of men <>< ==============================Cakewalk and I are going places together!
Cakewalk By Bandlab, Windows 10 Pro- 64 bit, Gigabyte GA-Z97X-SLI, Intel Core i5-4460 Haswell Processor, Crucial Ballistix 32 GB Ram, PNY GeForce GTX 750, Roland Octa-Capture, Mackie Big Knob, Mackie Universal Controller (MCU), KRK V4's, KRK Rockit 6, Korg TR-61 Workstation, M-Audio Code 49 MIDI keyboard controller.[/
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timwhite74
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 10, 17 6:11 PM
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I've read about the fact there should be an External Insert option in my FX Bins, but i swear it's not there.
I don't have Platinum or Professional, its just Sonar X3. I also don't have ProChannel.
tim
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John
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 10, 17 6:19 PM
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If you have X3 Studio it may not be in there.
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scook
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 10, 17 6:32 PM
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Jesse G
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 10, 17 9:33 PM
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Sorry that it's not there for you timwhite74. Sonar External Inserts are really nice to have with hardware you want to use in Sonar.
Peace,Jesse G. A fisher of men <>< ==============================Cakewalk and I are going places together!
Cakewalk By Bandlab, Windows 10 Pro- 64 bit, Gigabyte GA-Z97X-SLI, Intel Core i5-4460 Haswell Processor, Crucial Ballistix 32 GB Ram, PNY GeForce GTX 750, Roland Octa-Capture, Mackie Big Knob, Mackie Universal Controller (MCU), KRK V4's, KRK Rockit 6, Korg TR-61 Workstation, M-Audio Code 49 MIDI keyboard controller.[/
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tlw
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 10, 17 10:07 PM
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☄ Helpfulby Jesse G February 11, 17 10:02 AM
It's still possible to 'insert' hardware processors without using the external fx plugin.
Route the track with the audio you want processing to a bus of its own instead of the master and output that bus to suitable audio outs on your interface. Connect the processor to the interface outputs and then back to inputs on the interface.
Create a new stereo/mono track as applicable, arm it for recording and hit 'record'.
And that will do the job. The problem is that the latency on the looped-back audio will differ from the rest of the project's audio. Which means monitoring might be an issue, though if you monitor from Sonar's master bus and directly from the processor's feed into the interface that should be managable. I think.
The resulting recording will almost certainly need shifting along the time-line a bit to get it in the right place. One way to make this easier is to do a test run using a track containing a percussive sound with a very obvious transient at the beginning. The time difference between the original source track and how delayed the freshly recorded processed track is how far you'll need to shift the audio.
The external insert plugin basically does the test for you, which makes things a bit simpler.
One thing to watch is that hardware processors must be switched on and active to get any kind of accuracy from a loopback test because the processor itself might add latency, especially if it's a digital unit of any kind.
Sonar Platinum 64bit, Windows 8.1 Pro 64bit, I7 3770K Ivybridge, 16GB Ram, Gigabyte Z77-D3H m/board, ATI 7750 graphics+ 1GB RAM, 2xIntel 520 series 220GB SSDs, 1 TB Samsung F3 + 1 TB WD HDDs, Seasonic fanless 460W psu, RME Fireface UFX, Focusrite Octopre. Assorted real synths, guitars, mandolins, diatonic accordions, percussion, fx and other stuff.
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Jesse G
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 11, 17 10:02 AM
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TLW,
That's a good explanation of how this is done without External Inserts You DA MAN !!!
Peace,Jesse G. A fisher of men <>< ==============================Cakewalk and I are going places together!
Cakewalk By Bandlab, Windows 10 Pro- 64 bit, Gigabyte GA-Z97X-SLI, Intel Core i5-4460 Haswell Processor, Crucial Ballistix 32 GB Ram, PNY GeForce GTX 750, Roland Octa-Capture, Mackie Big Knob, Mackie Universal Controller (MCU), KRK V4's, KRK Rockit 6, Korg TR-61 Workstation, M-Audio Code 49 MIDI keyboard controller.[/
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timwhite74
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 11, 17 4:41 PM
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Thanks to everyone for the great help.
It sounds like I need to upgrade to a better version of Sonar.
Tim
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timwhite74
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Re: External gear in Sonar X3
February 12, 17 5:39 AM
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Hello all,
I may be doing this wrong, because the suggestion above didn't work for me.
I have a compressor routed as such via my Focusrite Saffire Pro 40:
Saffire outputs 5/6 > Compressor inputs 1/2 > Saffire inputs 5/6
I created the bus as described by tlw, but got no audio coming back, but the meters on the track in Sonar moved.
So, I have a stereo drum track output set to Master and the input on my processed track set to input Stereo 5. BUT that required me to solo the drum track so the compressor only compressed that track, not the whole mix.
This seemed to work, but doesn't seem right to me, especially after tlw's directions.
I should be able to send the drums out to the compressor (output 7/8) and record compressed drums on a new track from the compressor (input 5/6), with or without a bus. right???
Thanks
Tim
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