Ruckman65
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Stuck Midi Notes
I recently changed audio interfaces from an NI Komplete 6 to a Focusrite Sapphire 6i6. For the most part, I am very happy with the changeover except for one thing which I am not sure is attributable to the audio interface. When playing back a track with midi instruments, at least one track will end up with a stuck midi note or notes. That is, the chord or notes start playing in a particular track but when the duration of the note ends, the sound keeps going. Stop the playback and the notes still play. A midi reset stops the notes. This happened very occasionally with the NI interface but happens with almost every song I play now. What I need to ascertain is whether this could be a driver issue or if there is some other known reason that may cause this to happen. Anyone experience anything similar?
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Ruckman65
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/17 04:06:42
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I am aware that the problem is Note Off messages are getting lost or not read. The issue is, what is causing the problem!
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chuckebaby
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/17 07:22:06
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This sounds like a classic case of midi buffers needing to be set. In Sonar Platinum I find 500 to be the new norm. Go to preferences/midi and check your buffers.
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brundlefly
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/17 16:16:52
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If you're inserting soft synths in audio track FX bins, try using the Synth Rack instead. I have seen issues with stuck notes when synths are in FX bins. Problems with the MIDI 'Prepare Using' buffer being too low usually manifest as dropped note-ons rather than note-offs, but it's possible that could have a bearing. As Chuck said, 500ms is a good starting point for most systems/projects. I'v experienced stuck notes when using MIDI FX plugins (e.g. MIDI Event Filter) as well, but more often with live input than playing back recorded MIDI.
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Ruckman65
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 03:32:01
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Thank you for the advice chuckebaby and brundlefly. I have tried a range of buffers from the minimum allowable of 20 to the maximum allowable of 10000 and the notes still get stuck. The issue is not with soft synths. They all work with no issues whatsoever. I am using a Roland Sound Canvas module which runs into the 6i6. I started a new project with one midi track and recorded into that track. No issues with recording. But, when playing back, the stuck notes happen. This leads me to the conclusion that it may well be a driver issue with the 6i6 but I am not really sure. Any other clues?
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 05:22:11
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I've has issues in the past with stuck notes and it's worth checking to see if the ones which are sticking have a gap, even if it's only a few ticks, between itself and the previous/next note. Short version - overlapping notes can cause sticking.
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chuckebaby
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 06:01:27
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Bristol_Jonesey -checking to see if the ones which are sticking have a gap, even if it's only a few ticks, between itself and the previous/next note. -overlapping notes can cause sticking.
+1 to this Over lapping notes will cancel out the next note. I clean this up using Quantize but there may even be a CAL script out there, not sure. And also to Brundlfly's suggestion. He brings up a good point as well that I did realize.
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pwalpwal
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 08:14:43
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has this bug been reported via the official channels?
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 08:50:41
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Er, do we know for sure that what the OP has posted is a bug?
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pwalpwal
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 08:58:48
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dunno, but i think "overlapping notes can cause sticking" (notes) counts as a bug?
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Ruckman65
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 08:59:23
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No, I don't think this is a bug. As I mentioned, this rarely happened with my NI Komplete Audio interface. It has only started happening since I changed over to my Sapphire 6i6. I understand the deal about overlapping notes but, this was never much of an issue previously. Still, as chuckeybaby suggests, might be worth cleaning tracks up with quantize. Bit of pain, though.
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pwalpwal
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 09:00:21
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chuckebaby
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 10:38:08
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Ruckman65 might be worth cleaning tracks up with quantize. Bit of pain, though.
not as bad as you think man. - Select the whole track then press "Q" to bring up the quantize menu. - Set quantize to just barely pick up note durations. Click enter. - If you find the notes are shifted too much, easily hit undo and try another quantize duration setting. You don't really need to do any hard quantizing here, just simply making sure you don't have any overlapping going on. But you may want to do a few tests: - Listen for the area of stuck notes, are they in the same places (repetitive) every time ? - Open the PRV and check the notes to see if they are overlapping. Even if its not an overlapping issue, this will help you narrow things down a bit.
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bvideo
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 11:17:31
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If it's really only your Sound Canvas, it somewhat points to MIDI interface, cable, or the SC itself, no?
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brundlefly
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/18 11:33:07
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If it's only with hardware synths, and only with one hardware synth (that we know of), I'm inclined to agree it;s probably a hardware/firmware/driver issue. I use a number of hardware synths, and have pretty much never experienced a stuck note during playback. But notes may 'stick' on stop if the track has CC64 Sustain messages in it and 'Zero Controllers when Play Stops' isn't enabled in MIDI preferences. SONAR sends CC123 All Notes Off as well as individual note offs for sounding notes when play stops, so that should silence everything except the effect of Sustain or Sostenuto which override note off messages by design and patches that have a long release stage or long one-shot samples. If overlapping notes of the same note number are causing the problem, I would still suspect that's a hardware/firmware/driver problem. I wrote a CAL that eliminates overlaps to eliminate the effect they have on the sound, but I never encountered any stuck notes before they were removed. P.M. me your e-mail addr, and I'll send you a copy of the CAL.
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Ruckman65
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/19 00:12:48
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As the Sound Canvas has been working flawlessly for years, I reckon I can count that out. I think it all points to the Focusrite drivers though I am not at all sure how a driver would effect midi data that way. I will try your suggestion, chuckebaby, and see how that goes. I have pm'd you, brundlefly, and thank you so much for your generous offer.
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Ruckman65
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Re: Stuck Midi Notes
2017/01/19 03:40:49
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I tried an experiment. I copied one of the midi tracks with the stuck notes and pasted it into a new project. When I played it back in the new project, no stuck notes. I checked as many settings as I could think of in the old track and compared it with the settings in the new tracks but they appear to be the same. Maybe the track in isolation doesn't stretch the midi capabilities of my setup. Though as I mentioned, this problem only started after changing my audio interface to the 6i6.
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