mikebeam
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Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
I'm scoring a short video. I wrote some music, mostly midi, but one audio track - focused on the music.
Then I imported the video to do a little syncing and there was a few frames of black, I wanted the music to start right when the first image came on. I used the Set Measure/Beat at Now function and put in Measure 2/Beat 1. Seemed to work out fine - I brought all my clips to start there using snap.
BUT - now the tempo is 360. And the clips don't line up to the beats/measures anymore. When I play it, it sounds fine, so it locked the midi clips in real-world time...
Can anyone tell me how to fix this? What am I doing wrong?
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telecharge
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/25 23:19:06
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mikebeam
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/25 23:33:02
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I'm using Sonar Platinum.
Yeah - I've been using markers. I set a marker at the right time - what I would like to be able to do is set the Measure/Beats to start right at that marker... Does that make sense? It seems the marker is only a good way to label a spot - now I want to make everything else line up to it.
So I used the "Set Measure/Beat to Now" function and it messed everything up. Unfortunately, I've saved since then and I can't just undo...
What I'm looking at now - all my midi and audio is lined up to each other fine - it sounds right, however the tempo is set to like 360 something... So it's almost like it stretched all my clips out... They also don't line up with the Measure/Beat lines anymore.
I hope I'm explaining this well.
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telecharge
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/25 23:43:16
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I'm not sure if this is what you're experiencing in regards to tempo change, but it sounds like it...
"Next, select the Lock to SMPTE (Real World) Time check box. This option is very important when working with video. If a marker is not locked to SMPTE time, its position in relation to events on the video will change with tempo and meter changes in the project."
You could try importing the video again and disregard the changes if it doesn't work out.
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Base 57
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/26 03:01:35
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What you are trying to do is not easy in SONAR. A commonly requested feature is "offset measures" which would help here. But...
I don't think setting measure 2 "a few frames" into the project is going to work. Just cheat measure 1 a few frames longer or
Maybe you could make the initial time sig something like 1/64 then a time sig change to 4/4 (or whatever you are going to use) at measure 2.
FWIW I usually use "set measure /beat at now" back to front. Meaning that I set the last measure first (I set measure "100" then work my way back to measure "2" {which is really measure 1} arrrgh!). Unless there are time sig or tempo changes within the song this is fairly easy.
I am sure that you will eventually work it out.
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Base 57
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/26 03:07:00
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Also the tempo of measure 2 is determined by the time placement of measure 3
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mikebeam
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/26 06:27:15
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This is all great information, but I don't think it addresses the current problem.
@telecharge - I did lock the marker to the time - and it's right where it should be. The problem I'm having now comes after the marker. It's almost as if the Midi Clips got locked to real world time. Sonar changed the Tempo to 360 to make the marker line up to real-world time. The clips kept their relative location to the video. The problem is that if I change the Tempo back to 110, the clips play really slow because the Midi doesn't line up any more.... So now, my project is at a stand still.
@Base57 - your back to front method seems very helpful. I'll probably do that in the future if I can work out this problem... I'm thinking about starting over. I didn't have any other markers or locked time placement besides measure 2, so I'm not even sure why it raised the tempo...
I'm starting to wonder if this is just a glitch - I've scored a handful of videos like this and I've never ran into this problem.
The only thing I can think of that I did differently was that I started with a Blank Project rather than a template. Could that change some global setting - lock clips to real-world time or something?
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brundlefly
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/26 11:57:36
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The purpose of Set Measure/Beat At now is to change the M:B:T timeline relative to absolute time without affecting the absolute playback timing of either audio or MIDI for the purpose of aligning the timeline to a existing MIDI/Audio. That's why MIDI doesn't follow the tempo change.
When you SM/BAN, SONAR calculates the tempo needed to make the specified beat fall on the current Now time, and re-calculates MIDI start times and durations to preserve their absolute playback timing at the new tempo. The most recent tempo is changed, and a new tempo of the same value is inserted at the Now time as a reference point for setting additional points further out in the timeline if needed.
Using SM/BAN is the only way to make tempo changes without altering the absolute playback timing of MIDI. MIDI will follow any manual tempo change you make. You can use SM/BAN to restore the original tempo starting at the point you set by the following method:
- Set the Now time at the measure corresponding to Current Tempo + 2 (i.e. 362 in your example)
- Shift+N, enter Target Tempo + 2 as the Measure, and OK.
SONAR will recalculate the tempo at 2:01:000, returning it to the original tempo without changing the playback timing. So now you'll have the high tempo only for the first measure to align the video.
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mikebeam
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/26 12:51:29
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Thanks for your reply... I actually just redid the project I was working on. It was only about 5 tracks and 45 seconds, plus I had everything written out on sheet music... But I want to understand this!!! brundlefly
You can use SM/BAN to restore the original tempo starting at the point you set by the following method:
- Set the Now time at the measure corresponding to Current Tempo + 2 (i.e. 362 in your example)
- Shift+N, enter Target Tempo + 2 as the Measure, and OK.
SONAR will recalculate the tempo at 2:01:000, returning it to the original tempo without changing the playback timing. So now you'll have the high tempo only for the first measure to align the video.
I recreated the problem in a new project. The tempo was reset to 133 - Midi clips stretched. Now, I'm trying to follow your steps - I'm not sure I understand. Should I scroll ahead in the project to Measure 135?! Or just set the Now time at Measure 2?
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mikebeam
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/26 12:57:28
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Also - Shift+N brings me to the Snap to Grid menu. I don't see a place to enter the Target Tempo.
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brundlefly
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Re: Set Measure/Beat at Now...? Help.
2017/02/27 23:59:11
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Sorry, that was typo; I meant Shift+M, the shortcut for Set Measure/Beat At Now. Yes, if the the new tempo is 133BPM, and the first set point was 2:01:000, you would set the Now time at Measure 135, Shift+M, and enter the tempo you want to get back to plus 2 measures. Suppose that target tempo is 100. What you're doing is telling SONAR to change the tempo at 2:01:000 to make 100 measures go by in the time of 133, counting from measure 2. This is the same having 100 beats go by in the time of 133; it's just easier to work with full measures.
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