New song. Help needed to tame cymbals

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optimus
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2017/03/20 04:21:02 (permalink)

New song. Help needed to tame cymbals

I've posted this song because I would like some help on taming the cymbals which have bled into the drum mics during recording. I have tried using the Sonitus Multiband compressor, which has helped, but it also affects the tonality of the snare.
Is there a better way to reduce the wash of those damned cymbals short of re-recording the drums.
Also, anything else you can suggest for this mix would be appreciated.
 
Cheers
 
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    synkrotron
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/20 04:42:31 (permalink)
    I'm no expert but when I used to record the drummer in our band I used two condenser mics over the cymbals, a SM58 beta on the snare and an AKG kick drum mic.

    Bleed was unavoidable, across all mics but I only ever used straight EQ to selectively filter out "unwanted" frequencies from the resulting tracks. I would never have considered using a multi band compressor.

    Cheers

    andy

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    #2
    Wookiee
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/20 14:30:45 (permalink)
    First a question about how you recorded the drums are they multi miked?

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    daryl1968
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/20 14:53:01 (permalink)
    how annoying - I've been there myself with a live recording, so I didn't have any choice but to go in and surgically eq everything. 
    If your drummer doesn't have an issue with it, you could try drum replacer - find snare sounds that match what you/he were looking for and replace......
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    daryl1968
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/20 14:55:40 (permalink)
    oh, and good song (and performances) by the way
     
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    Voda La Void
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/20 16:44:00 (permalink)
    Yeah, really need to know how you're miking and recording.  

    The remedy for overwhelming cymbal wash in my set up came from close mic'ing all the drums, trying to keep the mic's 90 degree adjacent to cymbals as much as possible, using 2 condenser overheads above and on-axis with cymbals, adding finesse to cymbal hits, and then EQ'ing those overheads for high frequency focus.  After adding a gate and compressor to each drum mic track, it seems to be just enough to allow the high frequency cymbal hits to come through, dancing on top of everything, but cut back where it should be in the mix.   

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    #6
    Lynn
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/20 23:03:47 (permalink)
    I don't think that the cymbals are the problem.  I agree with Daryl, that the drum replacer in Splat might be the answer for you.  Mic bleed isn't always bad, in fact, used creatively, it can add realism to the drums.  Overall, the song is good as well as the performances.  I think you may be closer than you think.

    All the best,
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    #7
    optimus
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/21 00:11:06 (permalink)
    Wookiee
    First a question about how you recorded the drums are they multi miked?


    I had set up kick, snare, hihat, small tom, floor tom and a single overhead. Ended up not using the toms because of too much spill from everything and just mixed in a hair of overhead.
     
    Synkrotron, Daryl, Lynn, I tried to eq, but the cymbals bled into everything which is why I tried the Sonitus multiband compressor, which has had some effect, and thanks for the vote on the song. It was written by our guitar player who's feeling a little nostalgia. Thinks he's getting old. I haven't tried drum replacement, so I guess I will need to read up on it.
     
    Voda La Void, yes, I think that better mic placement may be the answer in future recordings.
     
    Thanks for your comments
    Cheers
    Wal

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    #8
    emeraldsoul
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/21 03:53:51 (permalink)
    If you turn the key and slide it into third, aren't you going to lug away in hurks and jerks, eventually ruining your transmission?  :)   If the neighbors are watching, you'll be embarrassed. First, second, then third. Check the owner's manual.
     
    I would totally not worry about those cymbals, do what you can. I would also pick an eq, get it on those drum tracks as a low pass filter, and cut away. But as you said you already tried that.
     
    My point is, it's a great song with great performances (+1 for the nostalgia) and your cymbals are mixed far down enough so they aren't going to hurt anyone as they are.
     
    cheers,
    -Tom

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    #9
    optimus
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/21 07:23:58 (permalink)
    emeraldsoul
    If you turn the key and slide it into third, aren't you going to lug away in hurks and jerks, eventually ruining your transmission?  :)   If the neighbors are watching, you'll be embarrassed. First, second, then third. Check the owner's manual.
     


    Ha Ha, Tom, if you listen carefully it is actually, "slid her into first". Just artistic license and poor diction by the singer.
     
    Thanks for listening and the vote for the song. Appreciate it as I'm actually in awe of you guys that have respond to my post. I have long admired your collective works.
     
    I don't often respond to other people's post as I often don't feel qualified, but I lurk a lot and listen.
     
    Cheers
    Wal
     

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    #10
    synkrotron
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/21 08:08:43 (permalink)
    optimus
    as I often don't feel qualified




     
    That's me in a nutshell... I still respond though, even if it's just to say something terrible like "nice."

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    gswitz
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/21 11:07:56 (permalink)
    When I mix drums, I often take time to split the clips around every drum hit and mute the clip between hits. Then, I select all the clips and add a fade in and a fade out. Now, the bleed comes up and disappears in a second.

    It can be worth a try.

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    daryl1968
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    Re: New song. Help needed to tame cymbals 2017/03/21 11:33:00 (permalink)
    Another thought. Drag and drop the snare track into a midi track so melodyne turns the hits into midi notes. Then use snare samples to replace......
    All the tools are there within Sonar.
    #13
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