Helpful ReplyInteresting photo of a close up LP

Author
sharke
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 13933
  • Joined: 2012/08/03 00:13:00
  • Location: NYC
  • Status: offline
2017/03/23 20:11:50 (permalink)

Interesting photo of a close up LP


James
Windows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
#1
Bhav
Max Output Level: -73 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 887
  • Joined: 2017/02/17 22:23:00
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/23 20:14:58 (permalink)
Do those groves wear out though, causing a degradation of audio quality or not?

I7 6850k, Asus RV10E, 32 Gb ram, SLI GTX 980 Ti, Creative Soundblaster Z, Yamaha DGX 630, Creative Aurvana Platinum headphones.
#2
tlw
Max Output Level: -49.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2567
  • Joined: 2008/10/11 22:06:32
  • Location: West Midlands, UK
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/23 20:27:40 (permalink)
They do indeed wear out. Also suffer from accumulated dust, imperfect pressing, wow, the disk not being perfectly flat, the stylus pressing harder against the outside wall of the groove than the inner and are very susceptible to physical damage. The top photo looks like it shows some damage - the black blob off to the left of the stylus and what look like minute scratches.
 
Old 78rpm discs were really fragile, serious collectors tend to use a nylon or natural thorn styli and change it after playing one or two discs, a modern sapphire or diamond-tipped needle hacks them about dreadfully.
 
Vinyl requires very careful and skilled mastering to get the dynamics, transients and bass response into the range the format can physically cope with. It's a really specialist skill and far harder than mastering digital formats.

Sonar Platinum 64bit, Windows 8.1 Pro 64bit, I7 3770K Ivybridge, 16GB Ram, Gigabyte Z77-D3H m/board,
ATI 7750 graphics+ 1GB RAM, 2xIntel 520 series 220GB SSDs, 1 TB Samsung F3 + 1 TB WD HDDs, Seasonic fanless 460W psu, RME Fireface UFX, Focusrite Octopre.
Assorted real synths, guitars, mandolins, diatonic accordions, percussion, fx and other stuff.
#3
craigb
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 41704
  • Joined: 2009/01/28 23:13:04
  • Location: The Pacific Northwestshire
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/23 20:39:38 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby BobF 2017/03/23 21:21:00
I was expecting to see a Les Paul.  My bad.

 
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
#4
bitman
Max Output Level: -34 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 4105
  • Joined: 2003/11/06 14:11:54
  • Location: Keystone Colorado
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/23 20:49:55 (permalink)
It's incredible that it ever worked at all.
 
But it did.
And how!
#5
bapu
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 86000
  • Joined: 2006/11/25 21:23:28
  • Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/23 22:32:31 (permalink)
craigb
I was expecting to see a Les Paul.  My bad.


Beta me to it. 
#6
The Grim
Max Output Level: -76 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 724
  • Joined: 2016/04/19 02:31:06
  • Location: hades
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/23 22:47:12 (permalink)
bitman
It's incredible that it ever worked at all.
 
But it did.
And how!




indeed
#7
SteveStrummerUK
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 31112
  • Joined: 2006/10/28 10:53:48
  • Location: Worcester, England.
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/24 00:04:18 (permalink)
 
Groovy babeee.

 Music:     The Coffee House BandVeRy MeTaL

#8
bapu
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 86000
  • Joined: 2006/11/25 21:23:28
  • Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/24 00:05:31 (permalink)
No, groovy vinyl.
#9
bapu
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 86000
  • Joined: 2006/11/25 21:23:28
  • Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/24 00:05:43 (permalink)
BAT plz.
 
#10
craigb
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 41704
  • Joined: 2009/01/28 23:13:04
  • Location: The Pacific Northwestshire
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/24 07:46:23 (permalink)
bapu
BAT plz.
 





 
By request.

 
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
#11
Kalle Rantaaho
Max Output Level: -5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 7005
  • Joined: 2006/01/09 13:07:59
  • Location: Finland
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/27 06:05:33 (permalink)
Bhav
Do those groves wear out though, causing a degradation of audio quality or not?




Now I really feel ancient

SONAR PE 8.5.3, Asus P5B, 2,4 Ghz Dual Core, 4 Gb RAM, GF 7300, EMU 1820, Bluetube Pre  -  Kontakt4, Ozone, Addictive Drums, PSP Mixpack2, Melda Creative Pack, Melodyne Plugin etc.
The benefit of being a middle aged amateur is the low number of years of frustration ahead of you.
#12
SteveStrummerUK
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 31112
  • Joined: 2006/10/28 10:53:48
  • Location: Worcester, England.
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/27 06:27:54 (permalink)
Kalle Rantaaho
Bhav
Do those groves wear out though, causing a degradation of audio quality or not?




Now I really feel ancient




He he 

 Music:     The Coffee House BandVeRy MeTaL

#13
Jeff Evans
Max Output Level: -24 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 5139
  • Joined: 2009/04/13 18:20:16
  • Location: Ballarat, Australia
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/27 06:35:33 (permalink)
Bhav
Do those groves wear out though, causing a degradation of audio quality or not?

 
Well it sort of depends. Yes and no.
 
No if you only use the right gear to play the vinyl on the turntable. I have had a state of the art turntable since the mid 70's. Fitted with finest arm ever made, SME of course with that incredible head shell. (When the arm is balanced, a small puff of air from you across the room causes the arm to move a few seconds later. Is that low bearing friction or what folks!)
 
And the cartridge for me is a Shure V15 Mk 3, possibly the finest pickup ever made too. With that famous elliptical stylus. (Min contact area on the groove wall) Tracking at about 1.2 grams.
 
So what does it all mean. I bought a pristine imported copy of Dark Side of the Moon for example and to this day there is not a single crack or any groove wall noise to speak of. Or any noise. It is dead silent and I mean silent. And how does the music sound, well pristine comes to mind and today it sounds the same as it did when it first came out. All the fine detail is still present. Only because it has only ever been played on this turntable of mine. So when the playback technology is this good yes it stays pretty well the same for a very long time.
 
And to add. A few things. I clean my vinyl with one of those Decca record brushes that have a million bristles. e.g. they are so fine they can get deep in the groove. Also I use a Rexon cleaner which is another type of arm on the turntable that has an electrostatically charged very soft pad on the end. It actually cleans and pulls the dust out of the groove as the record plays. And also I never drop the stylus at any part into the side of the album (Hi Fi enthusiasts consider a serious no no) e.g. the stylus is only set down at the very start and lifted at the very end. 
 
But unfortunately most turntables are like a nail playing a record like that and at about 2 or 3 or 5 times that weight pressure. So no. Not a hope in hell in the grooves remaining intact for very long.  Can you appreciate the difference here.
 
What DJ's do to vinyl I won't even go into here! 
 
Last time I bought my stylus (yes just the stylus folks it was $500!. If I even reversed the motion of the turntable like a DJ for a fraction of a turn that $500 stylus would be destroyed!
 
post edited by Jeff Evans - 2017/03/27 20:59:27

Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz - 8 Gb RAM - Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME PCI HDSP9632 - Steinberg Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 8- Studio One V4 - iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - Sierra 10.12.6 - Focusrite Clarett thunderbolt interface 
 
Poor minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas -Eleanor Roosevelt
#14
craigb
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 41704
  • Joined: 2009/01/28 23:13:04
  • Location: The Pacific Northwestshire
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/27 07:44:00 (permalink)
When I was a DJ we used to hold the record so we could look across the face.  If it was black, it was still good but, if it was gray, then the grooves (and maybe the groves too ) were flat and the record was thrown out.

 
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
#15
KenB123
Max Output Level: -66 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1229
  • Joined: 2006/08/16 12:02:50
  • Location: Illinois, U.S.A.
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/27 12:43:47 (permalink)
My first 'record player' was a piece of junk. Had to weigh down the needle-arm with a taped nickel (U.S. $.05) or two to keep it from jumping around. Unfortunately those records are now all pretty much ruined. Poverty has its downsides.

Broken pencils are pointless.

WIN-7 64-bit; Sonar X2A 64-bit; 12GB RAM; ASUS P6T Deluxe V2 MB; Intel Core i7-960; 300GB-OS (10000-RPM); 1TB-Projects (7200-RPM); 1TB-Samples (7200-RPM) 


#16
smallstonefan
Max Output Level: -48 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2724
  • Joined: 2003/11/20 11:41:35
  • Location: Papillion, Nebraska
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/27 13:56:24 (permalink)
craigb
I was expecting to see a Les Paul.  My bad.




Same! :)
#17
Beepster
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 18001
  • Joined: 2012/05/11 19:11:24
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/27 15:52:42 (permalink)
lol... I've seen that first pic before but without context I always thought it was some large exotic bird pecking at a groomed soil/sandy surface.
 
Freaky deaky.
#18
Jeff Evans
Max Output Level: -24 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 5139
  • Joined: 2009/04/13 18:20:16
  • Location: Ballarat, Australia
  • Status: offline
Re: Interesting photo of a close up LP 2017/03/28 19:06:57 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Beepster 2017/03/28 19:53:49
It is amazing the peaks of reproduction quality vinyl has reached though. A case in point are those Sheffield Lab albums form the 80's. I have got a bunch of them including an album by Dave Grusin. (Discovered Again) with Ron Carter, Lee Ritenour, Harvey Mason and Grusin himself. The music is wonderful on that album. 
 
The Sheffield Lab thing is they bypass the whole Multitrack tape path and create the mix in the studio for these guys live and feed the cutting lathe! The transient response from the Shore V15 III pickup is breathtaking. Snap, punch, kick, the cutting edge of a cowbell, OMG! It is almost like digital. (I believe digital is still better in this department) The groove surface noise is there but it is way low on my system.  They only pressed a limited number of albums from these masters too. Then I believe they got them in and did it all again. Different solos. And yes the vinyl sounds the same for me today as it did then too.
 
Another famous pickup was the Ortofon SL15Q possibly the most musical pickup ever made too. (moving coil) Instead of Moving magnet. Puts out super weak signals and requires a preamp too even bring it up to MM levels. Similar to a ribbon microphone in terms of levels being very low. They had transformer preamps and active. Both sounded different but amazing. The RIAA pickup equalising preamp too is also super important. I blew $1000 on one in the 80's to give you an idea. It kills anything inside any standard stereo Hi Fi amplifier by far. I nearly fell over when I heard this RIAA preamp. Electronic music is also jaw dropping on my setup too.
 
It is these mastering guys who mastered these amazing records that are the very original and first mastering engineers. With the white coats. But although it took a lot of skill to do it well we have a new set of things to deal with as modern digital medium mastering engineers. Such as almost limitless dynamic range. The skill now is making use of it all. 
 

Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz - 8 Gb RAM - Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME PCI HDSP9632 - Steinberg Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 8- Studio One V4 - iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - Sierra 10.12.6 - Focusrite Clarett thunderbolt interface 
 
Poor minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas -Eleanor Roosevelt
#19
Jump to:
© 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1