Helpful ReplyAudio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software)

Author
icontakt
Max Output Level: -32.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 4266
  • Joined: 2012/03/04 08:18:02
  • Location: Tokyo
  • Status: offline
2017/04/12 13:40:15 (permalink)

Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software)

I've been looking for a new audio interface and asked for advice in this thread. The other day, while comparing a few candidate models (e.g. Tascam US-2x2-SC, Steinberg UR22mkII, Scarlett 2i4 G2), I noticed that they all lacked a feature that is very important to me. Roland's Quad-Capture, which I've been using but causes SONAR to be completely silent when the project gets too heavy, comes with a simple software program (see below) in which you can see, edit and save/load all parameters, including the input gain value. This feature is very convenient as you can imagine, so I was very surprised to learn that the competitor products did not have it (correct me if I'm mistaken). It's so important that I'm considering paying more than what I said in the other thread if the interface displays at least the input gain value (so that I can copy it into Excel etc. for future reference). Do you know any audio interface other than Roland interfaces that has this feature?
 

 

Tak T.
 
Primary Laptop: Core i7-4710MQ CPU, 16GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Home Premium OS (Japanese) x64 SP1
Secondary Laptop: Core2 Duo CPU, 8GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Professional OS (Japanese) x64 SP1
Audio Interface: iD14 (ASIO)
Keyboard Controller/MIDI Interface: A-800PRO
DAW: SONAR Platinum x64 (latest update installed)
#1
JonD
Max Output Level: -39 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3617
  • Joined: 2003/12/09 11:09:10
  • Location: East of Santa Monica
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 14:44:16 (permalink)
Hm, if the Quad-Capture has that, then it seems likely that its big brothers Octa-Capture and Studio-Capture might also.
 
But I would expect them all to share the same driver code, so moving up to one of them, you could still experience the same problems.
 
Are you sure your issues aren't system-specific?  I don't recall ever hearing another Quad Capture owner report the same issue you described (Sonar goes quiet with a heavy project).

SonarPlat/CWbBL, Win 10 Pro, i7 2600K, Asus P8Z68 Deluxe, 16GB DDR3, Radeon HD5450, TC Electronic Impact Twin, Kawai MP11 Piano, Event ALP Monitors, Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro, Too Many Plugins, My lucky hat.
#2
azslow3
Max Output Level: -42.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3297
  • Joined: 2012/06/22 19:27:51
  • Location: Germany
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 15:19:34 (permalink)
From interfaces I have checked, Digital Gain control (Digital Trim (tm) in MOTU terminology) exists only in RME, MOTU and some Roland interfaces... Most Digital Mixers also have it.
 

Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro
GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB
RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc.
www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
#3
Cactus Music
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8424
  • Joined: 2004/02/09 21:34:04
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 15:20:11 (permalink)
Those 3 interfaces you mentioned are all entry level. A lot of the better interfaces come with GUI mixers. Even the 6i6. But really, If it's time for a new interface make the commitment to quality and get a RME or Motu. 

Johnny V  
Cakelab  
Focusrite 6i61st - Tascam us1641. 
3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
 http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
 
 
#4
mettelus
Max Output Level: -22 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 5321
  • Joined: 2005/08/05 03:19:25
  • Location: Maryland, USA
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 15:31:35 (permalink)
^^^^ Higher level Focusrite products have front-end software that can be saved to the hardware (MixControl) and other interfaces have similar, essentially a digital mixer.

ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero (Wi-Fi AC), i7-8700k, 16GB RAM, GTX-1070Ti, Win 10 Pro, Saffire PRO 24 DSP, A-300 PRO, plus numerous gadgets and gizmos that make or manipulate sound in some way.
#5
azslow3
Max Output Level: -42.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3297
  • Joined: 2012/06/22 19:27:51
  • Location: Germany
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 16:12:05 (permalink)
mettelus
^^^^ Higher level Focusrite products have front-end software that can be saved to the hardware (MixControl) and other interfaces have similar, essentially a digital mixer.

From the documentation, Scarlett (all models) have no digital gain control. From pictures, Clarett also do not have it. Mix control (so digital DSP) yes, save/recall DSP settings also yes. But gain control?

Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro
GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB
RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc.
www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
#6
mettelus
Max Output Level: -22 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 5321
  • Joined: 2005/08/05 03:19:25
  • Location: Maryland, USA
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 16:36:18 (permalink)
The hardware knob has no linkage inside the mixer (there are only 2 of these for all inputs... the rest are digital only). The mixer can control each input on each mix separately (digital faders). There are actually multiple faders and busses internally, so "input gain" there is a fader. It gets as "complex" as the interface it is running.

I am not sure which models carry MixControl (some Scarletts did not), and is certainly not unique to Focusrite.

I am confused by the question. MixControl is the ASIO control panel for the unit, and a fader is gain control. Did I miss something?

ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero (Wi-Fi AC), i7-8700k, 16GB RAM, GTX-1070Ti, Win 10 Pro, Saffire PRO 24 DSP, A-300 PRO, plus numerous gadgets and gizmos that make or manipulate sound in some way.
#7
fireberd
Max Output Level: -38 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3704
  • Joined: 2008/02/25 14:14:28
  • Location: Inverness, FL
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 17:20:13 (permalink)
I had a Roland Octa-Capture.  It had a lot of flexibility in the Control Program.  I now have an MOTU and the control program and options in it are extensive (so much that I needed some hands on instruction).

"GCSG Productions"
Franklin D-10 Pedal Steel Guitar (primary instrument). Nashville Telecaster, Bass, etc. 
ASUS ROG Maximus VIII Hero M/B, i7 6700K CPU, 16GB Ram, SSD and conventional hard drives, Win 10 Pro and Win 10 Pro Insider Pre-Release
Sonar Platinum/CbB. MOTU 896MK3 Hybrid, Tranzport, X-Touch, JBL LSR308 Monitors,  
Ozone 5,  Studio One 4.1
ISRC Registered
Member of Nashville based R.O.P.E. Assn.
#8
batsbrew
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 10037
  • Joined: 2007/06/07 16:02:32
  • Location: SL,UT
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 17:25:36 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby tlw 2017/04/15 12:16:51
check out totalmix, with RME interfaces

Bats Brew music Streaming
Bats Brew albums:
"Trouble"
"Stay"
"The Time is Magic"
--
Sonar 6 PE>Bandlab Cakewalk>Studio One 3.5>RME BFP>i7-7700 3.6GHz>MSI B250M>G.Skill Ripjaws 4 series 16GB>Samsung 960 EVO m.2ssd>W 10 Pro
 
#9
Jim Roseberry
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 9871
  • Joined: 2004/03/23 11:34:51
  • Location: Ohio
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 18:06:22 (permalink)
RME and MOTU audio interfaces allow you to control the "input gain" via software.
Behringer digital mixers (also function as audio interfaces) also allow you to control input gain via software.

Best Regards,

Jim Roseberry
jim@studiocat.com
www.studiocat.com
#10
eikelbijter
Max Output Level: -70 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1002
  • Joined: 2003/11/13 22:23:52
  • Location: Sherman Oaks, CA
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 19:18:48 (permalink)
Zoom UAC allows it as well, and gives AWESOME latency too!

R

Xeon E3-1231V3, 16GB RAM, 480GB 840EVO SSD, MOTU 2480MK3, 424PCI w/ Sonar Platinum
Dell XPS 18, i5, 12GB RAM, 500GB SSD+128GB SSD, Roland VS-100 w/ Sonar Platinum

Dell XPS 13, i5, 8GB RAM, 256GB 840EVO SSD, Zoom UAC-2, Sonar Platinum

http://www.RicoBelled.com/

#11
azslow3
Max Output Level: -42.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3297
  • Joined: 2012/06/22 19:27:51
  • Location: Germany
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 20:58:18 (permalink)
eikelbijter
Zoom UAC allows it as well, and gives AWESOME latency too!

Yes, I have overseen that since hardware Gain knobs are not encoders (I have the same on VS20).
If they update R8-R24 with UAC technology, I will have problem with money... UAC-2 is just "2", UAC-8 is 8 (more then I need) while close to MOTU/RME price range. So I am still waiting for wonder
 
mettelus
The hardware knob has no linkage inside the mixer (there are only 2 of these for all inputs... the rest are digital only). The mixer can control each input on each mix separately (digital faders). There are actually multiple faders and busses internally, so "input gain" there is a fader. It gets as "complex" as the interface it is running.

I am not sure which models carry MixControl (some Scarletts did not), and is certainly not unique to Focusrite.

I am confused by the question. MixControl is the ASIO control panel for the unit, and a fader is gain control. Did I miss something?

From scarlett Focusrite Control (Scarlett 2nd Gen) documentation:

Set the recording levels by adjusting the gain controls on the Scarlett front panel.

So no pre-amp gain control from software.

Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro
GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB
RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc.
www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
#12
Cactus Music
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8424
  • Joined: 2004/02/09 21:34:04
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 21:31:14 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby mettelus 2017/04/12 23:49:08
Yes to be clear, You do use the front panel gain controls on all models of Scarletts. Mix Control is only available from the 6i6 upwards and does not come with the Solo, 2i2 or 2i4.  
But you can certainly save mix scenes and levels within the mix control. As well as you do have to use mix control to toggle the PADS. 
I really don't see a situation where one can't take the 10 seconds to adjust the gain level. Besides, if you have more instruments than inputs and find your self swapping cables a lot, you should really get an interface that has enough inputs so this won't happen. Or have a mixer where all your outboard is connected and then you just mute and un-mute channel strips. 
I've seen people shopping for interfaces and they say - "well there's only me so I only need 2 inputs". But this is not smart. You need as many inputs as you have potential instruments on hand that you plan on using regularly. 

Johnny V  
Cakelab  
Focusrite 6i61st - Tascam us1641. 
3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
 http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
 
 
#13
Kev999
Max Output Level: -36 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3922
  • Joined: 2007/05/01 14:22:54
  • Location: Victoria, Australia
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 22:43:54 (permalink)
The Audient iD22 allows you to load and save settings. Settings include input gain as well as routing configuration.

SonarPlatinum(22.11.0.111)|Mixbus32C(4.3.19)|DigitalPerformer(9.5.1)|Reaper(5.77)
FractalDesign:DefineR5|i7-6850k@4.1GHz|16GB@2666MHz-DDR4|MSI:GamingProCarbonX99a|Matrox:M9148(x2)|UAD2solo(6.5.2)|W7Ult-x64-SP1
Audient:iD22+ASP800|KRK:VXT6|+various-outboard-gear|+guitars&basses, etc.
Having fun at work lately
#14
JonD
Max Output Level: -39 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3617
  • Joined: 2003/12/09 11:09:10
  • Location: East of Santa Monica
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/12 23:19:59 (permalink)
To the OP --
You have two systems still running Win 7 (according to your sig). If it were me, I'd upgrade one to Win 10 and see if that fixes the crashing (Win 10 is supposed to run much more efficiently overall. Makes sense that would also apply to the Quad-Capture drivers). 
 
That's roughly $100 for the O.S. upgrade vs several hundred for a new interface.  Just a thought...

SonarPlat/CWbBL, Win 10 Pro, i7 2600K, Asus P8Z68 Deluxe, 16GB DDR3, Radeon HD5450, TC Electronic Impact Twin, Kawai MP11 Piano, Event ALP Monitors, Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro, Too Many Plugins, My lucky hat.
#15
azslow3
Max Output Level: -42.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3297
  • Joined: 2012/06/22 19:27:51
  • Location: Germany
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/13 07:49:55 (permalink)
Cactus Music
Yes to be clear, You do use the front panel gain controls on all models of Scarletts. Mix Control is only available from the 6i6 upwards and does not come with the Solo, 2i2 or 2i4.  
But you can certainly save mix scenes and levels within the mix control. As well as you do have to use mix control to toggle the PADS.

In general I agree, but OP question was about digital gain control... And I must admit I was unaware that Zoom and Audient also have it.
 

I really don't see a situation where one can't take the 10 seconds to adjust the gain level.

At least one case exists, with Roland/Cakewalk VS-20. It is 2x2 interface but can switch between inputs, most important between guitar and mic. I have found rather annoying adjusting several parameters, including input gain, manually when switching. So I have organized that as saving relevant settings in Sonar track so they are automatically recalled when I record arm corresponding track (unfortunately not yet working with BOSS effects selection, but that also can be done).
 
For "real pro" all that is not an issue... but pro interfaces have it. For hobbyist that can be an issue, I am switching audio interfaces and connections all the time (for just playing a song I use TC GTX, it also has build-in audio but it is basic and without ASIO. So when I want record I reconnect to VS-20... as long as I am ok with BOSS effects, because latency is to high for computer processor, in that case I use M-Audio).

Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro
GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB
RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc.
www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
#16
icontakt
Max Output Level: -32.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 4266
  • Joined: 2012/03/04 08:18:02
  • Location: Tokyo
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/15 04:24:52 (permalink)
Thank you all very much. Your replies really helped me learn about some models that I hadn't really considered before. While (re-)checking out the manufacturers/models you recommended, I realized that I don't even need MIDI ins/outs (because the only MIDI device I use is connected to the MIDI input of my MIDI keyboard controller), so I considered some of the "no MIDI" models as well. Below are my impressions so far.

Babyface Pro: I'm sure this is fantastic in terms of both sound quality and stability. I seriously considered buying this, but it won't fit in the space where I want to put it (maybe it will, but it will be hard to see the meters and access the buttons/cables), so I'll have to buy longer monitor cables and some device to put it on. If it was a half-rack style, I would buy it, although it's very expensive for me...

UltraLite-mk4: I'm very certain I don't (and won't) need more than two inputs and two outputs. I can imagine myself telling myself "I paid extra money for what I'll never use" every time I see the many outputs on the back panel or the many channels/routing options in its mixer software.

Microbook IIc: I need two mic inputs (one for a condenser mic through which the singer sings, and the other for a dynamic mic through which I need to talk to the singer), so I had to drop this one. It seems to me that MOTU isn't interested in people who only need 2 mic ins, 1-2 guitar ins and want to record high quality audio at home. If they had such a model that is positioned between UltraLite-mk4 and Microbook IIc, I would buy it.

UAC-2: At one point this became the top candidate. I saw very positive reviews, except for some driver issues which may have been fixed by now, but there were three people who said the quality of the headphone amp was not very good (e.g. rather opaque in the high frequency range) or horrible, which discouraged me from buying it...

Audient iD14: This excited me the most. There are lots of positive reviews on Sweetwater, and the sound quality seems the best in this price range. It's not a half-rack style, but I think I can put it in the limited space on my desk and won't be difficult to plug in/out the cables. But I watched a YouTube video this morning and learned that the Mic 1 and Mic 2 faders in its mixer software aren't for adjusting the input gain knobs (on the unit) or the record levels...

Scarlett 6i6 G2: I didn't quite understand the explanations in the above posts about the Scarlett's software mixer, but it seems to me that you can't see the input gain value. Maybe I'm mistaken.
 
 
So, I haven't decided which model to buy yet. What I really learned in the last two days is that the Quad-Capture is the only interface that meets my needs perfectly, and it's so unfortunate that the device causes my heavy projects to go silent. 

Tak T.
 
Primary Laptop: Core i7-4710MQ CPU, 16GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Home Premium OS (Japanese) x64 SP1
Secondary Laptop: Core2 Duo CPU, 8GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Professional OS (Japanese) x64 SP1
Audio Interface: iD14 (ASIO)
Keyboard Controller/MIDI Interface: A-800PRO
DAW: SONAR Platinum x64 (latest update installed)
#17
icontakt
Max Output Level: -32.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 4266
  • Joined: 2012/03/04 08:18:02
  • Location: Tokyo
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/15 04:27:03 (permalink)
 
JonD
Are you sure your issues aren't system-specific? I don't recall ever hearing another Quad Capture owner report the same issue you described (Sonar goes quiet with a heavy project).

 
Even if it's system-specific, I don't know how to fix it. I've configured all audio-related settings as recommended in the Quad-Capture manual, SONAR manual, etc., and there's no one here who can come to my place and solve the issue for me. But I think it's a Quad-Capture driver issue, because if I use a Tascam 2x2-SC, which I've been renting for a couple of days now from TEAC Japan thanks to its 2-week free rental campaign, the heavy project plays fine. I said "heavy project" just because it uses lots of plugin effects etc., but, according to the Performance Module which you can see in the screencast below, the project isn't really heavy. I reported the issue to Roland Japan, but they said they have never heard of the issue before. I also have never seen anyone in the SONAR forum experiencing the same issue. So I'm probably the only one in the world experiencing it. How unfortunate.
 

 

Tak T.
 
Primary Laptop: Core i7-4710MQ CPU, 16GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Home Premium OS (Japanese) x64 SP1
Secondary Laptop: Core2 Duo CPU, 8GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Professional OS (Japanese) x64 SP1
Audio Interface: iD14 (ASIO)
Keyboard Controller/MIDI Interface: A-800PRO
DAW: SONAR Platinum x64 (latest update installed)
#18
icontakt
Max Output Level: -32.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 4266
  • Joined: 2012/03/04 08:18:02
  • Location: Tokyo
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/15 04:30:15 (permalink)
JonD
You have two systems still running Win 7 (according to your sig). If it were me, I'd upgrade one to Win 10 and see if that fixes the crashing (Win 10 is supposed to run much more efficiently overall. Makes sense that would also apply to the Quad-Capture drivers).

That's roughly $100 for the O.S. upgrade vs several hundred for a new interface. Just a thought...

 
I downloaded Win10 when it was available for free, so upgrading is free. But I'll have to buy a new backup software and external hard drives because they aren't supported by Win10. Also, upgrading might cause some other issues (even IF it fixes the current issue), and I don't really like Win10 in terms of usability and design (I've used it several times before). I'm very happy with Win 7 except this particular issue.

Tak T.
 
Primary Laptop: Core i7-4710MQ CPU, 16GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Home Premium OS (Japanese) x64 SP1
Secondary Laptop: Core2 Duo CPU, 8GB RAM, 7200RPM HDD, Windows 7 Professional OS (Japanese) x64 SP1
Audio Interface: iD14 (ASIO)
Keyboard Controller/MIDI Interface: A-800PRO
DAW: SONAR Platinum x64 (latest update installed)
#19
GerardMcNamara
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 48
  • Joined: 2015/04/10 13:10:08
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/15 12:17:52 (permalink)
To icontakt : Just got the UltraLite-mk4 (have yet to set it up) --- had the Focusrite Scarlett 18i8 (first generation) which was fine (I am new to this stuff, however) but the problem I had with the 18i8 was that it some how got fried because of a power outage. My computer and the rest were not affected, I believe this is because they have their own power supply. So in effect the audio interface would not turn on. Did a bit of research and the UltraLite-mk4 seemed to fit the bill. Plenty of driver updates and continued support for product. Plenty of inputs (two for guitar on the front face) Usb2 and firewire and Midi. Really, before this becomes an Ad for them just look them up on internet. The thing I wanted to mention is that I also got a Furman PST-8 (power station) which basically is a power conditioner and a surge suppressor to plug all my gear into.
#20
JohanSebatianGremlin
Max Output Level: -82 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 402
  • Joined: 2016/03/17 22:27:15
  • Status: offline
Re: Audio interface that displays input gain value (and allows you to edit it via software 2017/04/16 20:43:36 (permalink)
I recently upgraded my interface to an RME. I can't recommend them enough. 

 
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change.  -microapp
 
i7, 32gb RAM, Win10 64bit, RME UFX
#21
Jump to:
© 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1