Helpful Reply"Safe mode" project open

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jkoseattle
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2017/08/20 14:17:22 (permalink)

"Safe mode" project open

Often I want to open a project nut don't intend to use all the instruments in it. Maybe I just want to copy a passge of Midi, or look at just one track, or whatever. Is there a way to open a project but elect not to load all the instruments? My project takes a fuull 5-6 minutes to completely load. I know that I can work while instruments are loading, but it's pretty annoying to watch loading progress bar dialogs which insist on appearing smack dab in the middle of everything.

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#1
Cactus Music
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/20 15:30:44 (permalink)
My biggest projects take about 10 seconds to load. Those might have 8 VST's and a 20 plug ins. I can see if I doubled that it might take 20 seconds. So you have 100's VST loaded?? Possibly a very slow hard drive that needs de fragging? 

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#2
chuckebaby
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/20 15:40:27 (permalink)
If its taking 5-6 minutes to load a project I would be a bit concerned.
This may be a heads up the HD is failing or a RAM issue.
 
I tested this last week on a project with 32 tracks and almost 50+ Plug ins = 14 seconds

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#3
Anderton
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/20 15:44:37 (permalink)
8 GB of RAM might not be enough for large, sample-based projects. Even instruments that stream from the hard drive need enough RAM to store at least the attacks for instant playback. 

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#4
AT
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/20 15:47:17 (permalink)
There is a command to open projects that doesn't load any of your VST or instruments.  Except I always forget what it is since I only use it every few years.  The last time scook replied, so maybe he will pop in.  Or you could look up the standard commands.

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#5
chuckebaby
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/20 18:47:23 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby MurkyMark 2017/08/25 17:20:44

Safe mode is activated when you open a file while the SHIFT key is pressed.
 
 
 


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#6
AT
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/20 19:20:40 (permalink)
You'd think I could at least remember that.

https://soundcloud.com/a-pleasure-dome
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there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.
24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
#7
chuckebaby
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/20 20:38:00 (permalink)
no its not you AT. I couldn't remember either (as you can tell by my first post )

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#8
jkoseattle
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/21 04:18:09 (permalink)
I have about 20 instruments loaded, but each one takes maybe 5-20 seconds. These are EastWest orchestral instruments. It's always been like that for these.
 
And now I have 12 Gb RAM, btw.
 
SHIFT key! Awesome, exactly what I needed!

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Kalle Rantaaho
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/21 09:07:12 (permalink)
If you open in safe mode, edit the project and save, what happens?
Do the original VSTs remain in the project, or is it just the opened version that is saved, or does SONAR automatically save a special "safe-version"??

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#10
chuckebaby
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/21 10:16:07 (permalink)
Kalle Rantaaho
If you open in safe mode, edit the project and save, what happens?
Do the original VSTs remain in the project, or is it just the opened version that is saved, or does SONAR automatically save a special "safe-version"??


That's a very good point.

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#11
savoy
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/21 11:24:09 (permalink)
If you open in safe mode, edit the project and save, what happens?
Do the original VSTs remain in the project, or is it just the opened version that is saved, or does SONAR automatically save a special "safe-version"??
 
i think that you will loose  the fx that you not load in safe-mode
 
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#12
jkoseattle
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/21 14:37:14 (permalink)
Kalle Rantaaho
If you open in safe mode, edit the project and save, what happens?
Do the original VSTs remain in the project, or is it just the opened version that is saved, or does SONAR automatically save a special "safe-version"??




Hmmm, I just tested this. I created a project with a VST loaded. I recorded some Midi and added an effect to the instrument track. Saved, closed, re-opened in "Safe Mode", saying "No to All" when it asked to load VSTs. Saved and closed Safe Mode version. Re-opened. The effect was missing, the VST was still present but not loaded. It loaded fine when I selected "Synth Connected" (AFAIK that's the only way to load a VST that is not loaded, right? I've always wanted to ask this - seems like there would be a more obvious way...)
 
So, saving in Safe Mode does indeed lose your effects. Doesn't just turn them off -- they're gone. Beware!

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#13
chuckebaby
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/21 14:56:07 (permalink)
A work around might be to -open in safe mode -Work on your midi -export your midi tracks to the browser.
 
I always, ALWAYS back up midi when saving projects for the simple fact that if a project goes corrupt, you can always salvage the audio tracks (they are in the work folder) but the Midi is saved with the project.
If something goes array and Project Ducky wont open.. "Poof" there goes the midi !
 

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#14
Anderton
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/21 15:00:17 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby chuckebaby 2017/08/21 15:06:06
jkoseattle
So, saving in Safe Mode does indeed lose your effects. Doesn't just turn them off -- they're gone. Beware!



As the documentation says...
 
To use File Recovery mode
 
Do one of the following: 
  • If you are opening a file from the Most Recently Used files list in the File menu, hold down the SHIFT key while selecting file name.
  • If you are opening the file from the Open dialog box, select the file in the dialog box and hold down the SHIFT key while clicking the OK button. 
 
What does File Recovery mode do?
 
File Recovery Mode applies the following behavior when opening a project file: 
  • Opens only the Track view, skipping all other opened views in the project including effects windows, Console View etc.
  • Prompts you to open the plug-ins saved with your project. Each plug-in gets a prompt, so you can open some and not open others.
  • Important: If you choose to not open a plug-in, that plug-in is stripped out of the project, so resaving the file will cause a loss of any project specific settings for that plug-in.

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#15
jkoseattle
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/21 15:28:46 (permalink)
Thanks!
 
So here's a feature request: If you go to save a project you opened in File Recovery Mode, Sonar should warn us of this "You opened this project in File Recovery Mode. If you save it you may lose stuff permanently. Are you sure?"

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#16
KingsMix
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/21 15:56:08 (permalink)
jkoseattle
Thanks!
 
So here's a feature request: If you go to save a project you opened in File Recovery Mode, Sonar should warn us of this "You opened this project in File Recovery Mode. If you save it you may lose stuff permanently. Are you sure?"


Last time I opened in "Safe Mode", it actually did give me a alert and or warning about this. So it seems that this feature is already there. Maybe you missed it (overlooked the info in the opening of "Safe Mode" process).
#17
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/22 03:39:12 (permalink)
Interesting. It has never even occurred to me to save a project I've opened in safe mode. That's always a troubleshooting step, to see if a problem is being caused by a plugin or not. And because the next step is usually to remove plugins one-by-one, I always start by saving the project under a new name.
 
At any rate, safe mode isn't your best solution. If projects are taking a long time to load, first make sure you're not doing an automatic plugin scan - that can add an extra minute right there. More likely, it's just large sample libraries that are slowing you down.
 
I do have some large projects that take up to two minutes to load. 5-6 minutes is pretty extreme, and might indicate memory exhaustion. I say might because 8 GB will hold a bunch of medium-sized libraries and a couple monster ones. After they've completely loaded, check your memory usage. If they're Kontakt instruments, it'll show you right there in the header how many mega/gigabytes each instrument has loaded. Other samplers have other ways to show you how much RAM they're consuming, and each has its own tricks for deferring loading or minimizing memory usage.
 
If you've got one or two monster libraries (e.g. OTS Rick Bass, the reason I was compelled to give up XP and go 64-bit in the first place), consider freezing them. Then they'll pop right up, no loading required. Even if your template has no MIDI data you can still freeze the tracks to avoid loading the library on start up. Un-freezing is a one-click operation. Freeze them all and save that as your template. When you start a new project, just un-freeze the ones you want to use.
 
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#18
soens
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/22 03:59:07 (permalink)
Curious why we say "unfreeze" instead of "thaw". You don't unfreeze frozen food, you thaw it.
#19
mudgel
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/22 12:44:35 (permalink)
Just create a copy of the project before you open it in safe mode if you're going to save that file.

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#20
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/23 23:46:52 (permalink)
RIGHT- I use safe mode often to quicky open other projects for a variety of reasons but yea, DON'T SAVE IT, just close without saving OR save as a barebones version that you can then just open normally
 

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#21
Kalle Rantaaho
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/24 09:12:10 (permalink)
mudgel
Just create a copy of the project before you open it in safe mode if you're going to save that file.

I can imagine a situation:
You open a problem project in safe mode > are glad to see it's operable and editable > You go through the track view to check things > " yeeh, everything looks OK,  oh, there's an off time MIDI note, I just nudge it a bit" > "How does it sound without the FX?...Hmmm well, I boost track 3 a little" > you forget you're in Safe Mode and do a reflex Ctrl+S :o/
 

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#22
mudgel
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/08/27 00:55:00 (permalink)
Seeing as others have mentioned not having thought about some of the possible outcomes associated with Safe Mode; I wonder?

If you opened a file using Safe Mode, with Auto Save activated, might auto save be triggered if the set time or operations reach their set limit?

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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/11/14 15:42:02 (permalink)
Thanks for posting this.  I came looking for how to load a VST after having opened a project in safe mode and then having saved it.    Good warning that all your effects plugins disappear!   
 
For other searchers:  instead of looking for the words load VST or load VSTi or reload VST or reload VSTi or undo safe mode for VST or any of the other plausible search strings:
 
you go into the browser window, synth section, select one of your VSti's (very difficult to tell it's selected with my colors but the gray changes a tiny bit), then click the little down arrow at the top of the browser window and check 'VST connected'.    Do this one at a time for each one (can't seem to select them as a group, afaik).    Then save the project and you'll be back to a working set of VST instruments.   This does not fix the loss of other plugins, of course, but at least recovers the very time consuming process of reloading a set of instruments. 
 
As to whether it can take a long time to load a project, even with a powerful computer: yes, of course it can.    Loading all those samples can take quite awhile, even with SSDs and fast memory.   Plenty of time to make a cup of coffee, anyway. 
#24
scook
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/11/14 15:47:02 (permalink)
williamcopper
you go into the browser window, synth section, select one of your VSti's (very difficult to tell it's selected with my colors but the gray changes a tiny bit), then click the little down arrow at the top of the browser window and check 'VST connected'.  

It might be faster to float the synth rack or dock it in the multidock. Then each row in the synth rack has a power button. Click the power button to change the synth connected status.
#25
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/11/14 16:08:50 (permalink)
Interesting.   I always have it docked "at the right" and the power buttons are never visible:  so I never even knew there were power buttons!      Thanks.  
#26
pwalpwal
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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/11/14 16:21:14 (permalink)
does the global fx bypass not re-enable everything in safe mode?

just a sec

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Re: "Safe mode" project open 2017/11/15 12:50:58 (permalink)
chuckebaby
I always, ALWAYS back up midi when saving projects for the simple fact that if a project goes corrupt, you can always salvage the audio tracks (they are in the work folder) but the Midi is saved with the project.
If something goes array and Project Ducky wont open.. "Poof" there goes the midi !


Maybe that should be a feature request! An option in the global preferences to export/save midi files externally upon saveing a project.
Same as 'copy all audio' -> copy all midi

As long as there are no mix ups regarding newer/older versions. (Especially with versioning option active)

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